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Does Greg Brown get too much of a free pass?

Duff Man

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We have had a lot of discussion about how slow the OL recruiting has been thus far under Marshall, but what about Greg Brown? He seemingly gets a pass because he found Jimmy Smith and [URL="http://www.allbuffs.com/entry.php/114-Jalil-Brown-Bio-and-Draft-Profile-2011-University-of-Colorado-Draft-Class]Jalil Brown[/URL] in the 2006 class, along with Chap Brown. You cannot do a whole lot better than landing those three CBs in one class. But what do we have to show for outside of those players? Here are the DBs signed over the last several years:

2006
Chap Brown
Jalil Brown
Jonathan Hawkins
Jimmy Smith

2007
Lamont Smith
Anthony Perkins
Anthony Wright

2008
Vince Ewing
Steven Hicks
Patrick Mahnke
Paul Vigo

2009
Deji Olatoye
Parker Orms

2010
Jered Bell
Terrel Smith

2011
Sherrard Harrington
Gregory Henderson
Kyle Washington

Not a perfect list because you could argue that Ray Polk needs to be added for 2008 and that Terrel Smith should not be on the 2010 list because he signed after Brown left for Arizona. Some players have switched positions and move around a bit (Ewing, Mahnke) and Anthony Wright has never been able to stay healthy, but overall, that group explains why we find ourselves in a precarious position at CB entering the 2011 season. Those 2007 and 2008 classes are really hurting us right now, Anthony Perkins excluded.

For the 2012 class, we are in good shape with Yuri Wright and... well, not sure which other players we actually have a good shot at.

So I ask again, does Greg Brown deserve a free pass?
 
So I ask again, does Greg Brown deserve a free pass?

Technically, you asked if he gets a free pass, not if he deserves one. I'd say yes to the first, no to the second. However, I'd also say the entire staff is getting a free pass right now. Who knows what kind of strategy Hawk had for getting DBs. Maybe he got exactly what Hawkins wanted. You know - guys who get their horns out and bring their lunchpails.
 
Greg Brown made his own bed with our talent issues in the secondary. I certainly don't give him a free pass as a recruiter. He's got a ton of work to do this season to make sure our pass defense isn't a liability.
 
Technically, you asked if he gets a free pass, not if he deserves one. I'd say yes to the first, no to the second. However, I'd also say the entire staff is getting a free pass right now. Who knows what kind of strategy Hawk had for getting DBs. Maybe he got exactly what Hawkins wanted. You know - guys who get their horns out and bring their lunchpails.

Or maybe he did not put enough effort into recruiting and we are paying the price now.
 
I thought the book on him was that he was a suspect recruiter but a good developer of talent.

That is the perception, and maybe it has been overstated. Outside of Smith, Brown, Brown, and Perkins, it is hard to find another player he had developed into a quality starter. Four guys over several years is not exactly incredible.
 
That is the perception, and maybe it has been overstated. Outside of Smith, Brown, Brown, and Perkins, it is hard to find another player he had developed into a quality starter. Four guys over several years is not exactly incredible.

He also gets some credit for the development of Figures, Hudson and Wheatley. He's been a great coach on the field. He's a very good DB coach.
 
lets hope his DB coaching doesn't suffer from his Dcoord coaching. And that he got some good ones in the incoming true frosh. After everything that people have said since the spring, two true frosh corners STARTING this year would not surprise me.
 
lets hope his DB coaching doesn't suffer from his Dcoord coaching. And that he got some good ones in the incoming true frosh. After everything that people have said since the spring, two true frosh corners STARTING this year would not surprise me.

I'm thinking (hoping?) that Brown is sandbagging a bit.
 
He also gets some credit for the development of Figures, Hudson and Wheatley. He's been a great coach on the field. He's a very good DB coach.
Fair enough.
If they can get Wright, he'll start as a freshman.
As good as Wright is, I am not sure he is a surefire starter as a true freshman. He would play quite a bit, but he is still pretty raw overall.
 
As good as Wright is, I am not sure he is a surefire starter as a true freshman. He would play quite a bit, but he is still pretty raw overall.
I'd be willing to bet that even extremely raw, Wright will be substantially better than anyone else we'll have available next year.
 
We've had some good DBs under him, but his recruiting is lackluster when looked at the entirety of his time here.

With that said, having guys like Wright say good things about helps, but doesn't explain why he couldn't recruit in previous years the numbers we needed. Hawk rushing 3 on 3rd and 12 never helped out his unit either. Our DL was atrocious with Hawk and we never really got a good pass rush. It looks like he can develop CBs, but his safeties were never really in position to make the plays they needed.
 
how can he be overrated? he barely has a reputation.


and that is more than he deserves!!!


He is living off the successes of his 1990 CU teams and all the award winners at CB from the past. (Figures, Hudson, etc.)

I am not at all fired up about him as a defensive coordinator.
 
and that is more than he deserves!!!


He is living off the successes of his 1990 CU teams and all the award winners at CB from the past. (Figures, Hudson, etc.)

I am not at all fired up about him as a defensive coordinator.

Chap Brown, a 5'6" CB who ran about a 4.8 forty made Big 12 all-conference teams under Brown. Jimmy Smith went from a mid-range safety prospect to a 1st round NFL draft pick at cornerback. Jalil Brown went from being an unknown safety/corner tweener to becoming a 4th round NFL draft pick at cornerback.

He has definitely had recent success. His entire career is success when it comes to coaching defensive backs. Long list of great players he developed in the NFL, too (Rodney Harrison, Samari Rolle, Blaine Bishop, etc., etc., etc.).

I share concerns about his recruiting ability. I also share the thought that he's unproven as a Defensive Coordinator since he's never done it, only been a Defensive Pass Game Coordinator and Co-Defensive Coordinator. But questioning his ability to coach and develop DBs is ridiculous.
 
Brown does not get a pass from me. Polk is in the secondary because Brown can't recruit. I blame Brown as the reason I'm not going to get to watch Polk run the ball this year.

Our safety play has been lackluster for awhile, and terrible the last few years. Maybe bottom 10 in D-1. Definitely not out of the bottom 20.

With all the pass-happy offenses around, safeties are probably more valuable than DT's. There is no substitute for recruiting at safety. There are maybe 15-20 guys coming out of HS every year who have the stuff to make a splash at the position. We have to get at least one every 2-3 years. And I'm also starting to question Brown's coaching when it comes to safeties. Polk either has the worst instincts I've ever seen, or he's getting bad advice in practice.

Hope he gets it in gear, because we're going to see alot of teams who have the personnel to go after our safeties this year.
 
Chap Brown, a 5'6" CB who ran about a 4.8 forty made Big 12 all-conference teams under Brown. Jimmy Smith went from a mid-range safety prospect to a 1st round NFL draft pick at cornerback. Jalil Brown went from being an unknown safety/corner tweener to becoming a 4th round NFL draft pick at cornerback.

He has definitely had recent success. His entire career is success when it comes to coaching defensive backs. Long list of great players he developed in the NFL, too (Rodney Harrison, Samari Rolle, Blaine Bishop, etc., etc., etc.).

I share concerns about his recruiting ability. I also share the thought that he's unproven as a Defensive Coordinator since he's never done it, only been a Defensive Pass Game Coordinator and Co-Defensive Coordinator. But questioning his ability to coach and develop DBs is ridiculous.

I can agree with this post.

He has to get better on the recruiting trail. To hope that a repeat of the 2006 class is going to happen on a regular basis is pretty unrealistic. Not sure is doing a whole lot to alleviate those concerns with the 2012 class either. Great position with Yuri Wright, but this class needs to be more than one elite player (who is no slam dunk anyway).

I think sooner rather than later, we might be looking at a situation where a DB coach who can recruit might be needed.
 
I can agree with this post.

He has to get better on the recruiting trail. To hope that a repeat of the 2006 class is going to happen on a regular basis is pretty unrealistic. Not sure is doing a whole lot to alleviate those concerns with the 2012 class either. Great position with Yuri Wright, but this class needs to be more than one elite player (who is no slam dunk anyway).

I think sooner rather than later, we might be looking at a situation where a DB coach who can recruit might be needed.

Maybe Ryan Walters depending on how he progresses at U of A
 
I guess one should ask, how many DBs are signed yet? Nada. The book is still out. From what I saw at spring practices, Brown isn't that impressive. I find it hard to get behind a coach/recruiter who never played outside of Midget league football.
 
Brown can coach and develop - without question imo.

His recruiting has been less than stellar. Also was watching him at UofA and they signed no-names in 2011 as well (he left after most of the class was in places, certainly the DBs). They may turn out to be great players (I think he has an eye for talent).

I think his eye for talent combined with JE's ability to recruits should help a bit. I have no doubt he can develop guys given the talent.
 
Brown can coach and develop - without question imo.

His recruiting has been less than stellar. Also was watching him at UofA and they signed no-names in 2011 as well (he left after most of the class was in places, certainly the DBs). They may turn out to be great players (I think he has an eye for talent).

I think his eye for talent combined with JE's ability to recruits should help a bit. I have no doubt he can develop guys given the talent.

Brown and Marshall are somewhat similar in this regard. Both feel that if they are given players with the right mix of measurables and the right attitude, that they can develop them into great football players. Evidence seems to support this. But the onus is on making sure they have the best possible prospects to work with because the higher the baseline they're starting from with a guy, the higher the ceiling is going to be and the odds of success go way up.
 
Brown does not get a pass from me. Polk is in the secondary because Brown can't recruit. I blame Brown as the reason I'm not going to get to watch Polk run the ball this year.

Our safety play has been lackluster for awhile, and terrible the last few years. Maybe bottom 10 in D-1. Definitely not out of the bottom 20.

With all the pass-happy offenses around, safeties are probably more valuable than DT's. There is no substitute for recruiting at safety. There are maybe 15-20 guys coming out of HS every year who have the stuff to make a splash at the position. We have to get at least one every 2-3 years. And I'm also starting to question Brown's coaching when it comes to safeties. Polk either has the worst instincts I've ever seen, or he's getting bad advice in practice.

Hope he gets it in gear, because we're going to see alot of teams who have the personnel to go after our safeties this year.

I've got to call this post out. This is absolutely ridiculous. Sure, critique Brown's less-than-stellar recruiting, but he is a solid coach...I don't know where to begin with this post - it's almost entirely... ... ...dumb.
 
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