AllBuffs | Unofficial fan site for the University of Colorado at Boulder Athletics programs
This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!
-
Prime Time. Prime Time. Its a new era for Colorado football. Consider signing up for a club membership! For $20/year, you can get access to all the special features at Allbuffs, including club member only forums, dark mode, avatars and best of all no ads ! But seriously, please sign up so that we can pay the bills. No one earns money here, and we can use your $20 to keep this hellhole running. You can sign up for a club membership by navigating to your account in the upper right and clicking on "Account Upgrades". Make it happen!
And the Big12 is already crumbling...
- Thread starter Darth Snow
- Start date
Really? Would OU bail on UT?
Mick Ronson
Well-Known Member
according to the OU prez, bailing on OSU was the deal-killer for turning down a SEC offer.
Deleted member 807
Guest
UT/OU/A2M = $60M
Everyone else in the conference $70M
Everyone else in the conference $70M
OKCBuff
Well-Known Member
That's the absolute truth. OU president David Boren was once governor and a US Senator. While he's Sooner through and through, his family has deep OSU ties historically and the Boren family has made many big financial gifts to both OSU and OU. As long as Boren is alive those schools will not be separated.
JimmyBuff
Well-Known Member
They might have to if UT goes to Big Ten.
I don't think aggy is enough for the SEC. They'd like aggy but I think they would want another team from the same area (UT or OU).
SEC/bama fans would like to get Alabama in the SEC East because they have long time rivalries with Tenn (they do play them every year) and UF
if SEC goes to 16 heres's what it might look like.
West
Arky
Aggy
OU
Okie State
Miss
Miss State
LSU
Kentucky
East
Auburn
Alabama
Va Tech
Florida
Georgia
Tenn
Vanderbilt
South Carolina
Last edited:
Very, VERY shortsighted if this is the case. He may have doomed both schools to an eternity of irrelevance.
Sensing this possibility, De Loss Dodds wisely scheduled an exporatory trip to Laramie last fall to check out their potential future home in the Mountain West. [/bongwhorn Bob]
Mick Ronson
Well-Known Member
i dunno. if Gundy keeps winning 8-9 games and T. Boone's money is still around, they are not the worst poison to drink if you can get OU, too. i bet over the last decade OSU and ATM are pretty close in total wins. and the last 4-5 years very much in favor of Oklahoma aggy over Texas aggy. overlooked in the media markets analysis....is that OU draws big in Dallas. coupled with OKC, it's not a bad combo. OSU has a pretty competitive, complete AD with success in hoops, baseball, golf and those spring sports that are big in the SEC.
is OU/OSU worse or better than just ATM? i don't see UT in the SEC, too many other egos and programs there to contend with for being the Emperor. Their OOC schedule and hatred of significant travel would be a good fit, though.
I suppose if the SEC decides it wants 16 teams, it could go with OSU, OU, A&M (it WILL want more of the Texas market than just Dallas), and a team from the East, like Clemson, UNC or Georgia Tech. OU and A&M will give them the majority of the Texas market without the need to actually have UT in their midst.
My fear is that if the SEC does go to 16, and there's a domino effect, that the Pac will have to follow suit, which would mean we'd HAVE to take UT, probably along with Tech. barf.
Boone Pickens has/had a huge say in wherever OK St goes. Texas will not join the SEC under any event. UT seems themselves as wayyyyy academically superior than in SEC garbage in their eyes.
If the big 12 completely dissolves i see texas most likely:
1. Joining the Big 10 with ND
2. Becoming independent w/ ND
3. Creating it's own conference w/ Tech, Aggie, UTSA, Baylor, Tx State (eventually), SMU, UNT, Houston, Rice etc...
4. PAC (let's hope not)
If the big 12 completely dissolves i see texas most likely:
1. Joining the Big 10 with ND
2. Becoming independent w/ ND
3. Creating it's own conference w/ Tech, Aggie, UTSA, Baylor, Tx State (eventually), SMU, UNT, Houston, Rice etc...
4. PAC (let's hope not)
Mick Ronson
Well-Known Member
that makes some sense. and you are probably right about the SEC wanting to optimize their expansion more than Dallas. ATM, OU, OSU and say Clemson. Clemson has always seemed like an SEC type school (pretty scientific analysis, i know). you get the CLemson-USC rivalry and the ACC probably won't miss much about Clemson except their under-achieving in both revenue sports seemly every year (while G Tech and UNC are pretty much heavies in the hoops-friendly ACC, would be a big loss for the conference).
muhahaaha
those aggies sure are entertaining!!!
those aggies sure are entertaining!!!
92Buff
Well-Known Member
IF the SEC did go to 16 and took OU, OSU, and Aggie then UT becomes a bit more pallatable. Of course, I would see this if:
- They ahd to move before setting up their stupid network (and couldn't after the fact)
- Had to come in on equal revenue terms
- They would no longer be Texas and the 4 minions/bitches, etc. thatit would have been - they would simply be a wee little voting block of two (assuming Tech would never grow balls to go against them)
- Had to deal with the fact that Tech is their "rival" (LOL) and would be forced to have to play either OU or Aggy as OOC.
This would appear on the surface to keep them from being able to ruin the conference as they have become so accustomed to doing. It would also appear to have them on a path for the mediocrity of the 90's since their recruiting base would be spread out across conferences, making it harder for them to dominate as they have this decade due to the increased competition.
- They ahd to move before setting up their stupid network (and couldn't after the fact)
- Had to come in on equal revenue terms
- They would no longer be Texas and the 4 minions/bitches, etc. thatit would have been - they would simply be a wee little voting block of two (assuming Tech would never grow balls to go against them)
- Had to deal with the fact that Tech is their "rival" (LOL) and would be forced to have to play either OU or Aggy as OOC.
This would appear on the surface to keep them from being able to ruin the conference as they have become so accustomed to doing. It would also appear to have them on a path for the mediocrity of the 90's since their recruiting base would be spread out across conferences, making it harder for them to dominate as they have this decade due to the increased competition.
I suspect that the rest of the conference members got a good view of what they could expect with UT as a member organization and are none too thrilled by the prospect.
UrbanaBuff
Member
I like the effort, but this this is WAAAAY too lopsided in the East. Six of the eight East teams are annual threats to make the BCS. I'd say only 2-3 in the West are that good. At minimum, I'd flip Alabama and Kentucky.
BehindEnemyLines
beware the habu
:nod: nothing changes your view of a potential business partner like bargaining in good faith with them for MONTHS and settling many issues, only to have the other ****ers throw everything out the window at the last second and make ridiculous blackmail style demands. Complete bad faith and total ****itude. I hope to God the SEC snaps up the decent part of the Big 12 S sans texas and we get to dictate to those mother****ers in a few years.
Mick Ronson
Well-Known Member
i think in order to keep Texas off the Pac 12/16's national push, USC needs to bounce back from their current turmoils and probably make a good hire after Kiffin. as much as i dislike USC, they aren't as offensive as UT. or: some other Pac team needs to step up and be a national behemoth....though, i'm having a hard time figuring who that will be (outside the Buffs, of course).
(time to start tryin out this pac 12 hate)... I'm warming up to hating USC a lot. I think they ****ing suck. Bunch of brats in a ghetto.
Promises from Texas and Beebe are like the promises some pimple faced boy makes to your 16 year old daughter in the back seat of his dads old car. He knows what he wants, he will say whatevery he has to to get it, and he is in no position to deliver the long-term revenue and stability needed to actually make his promises happen but as long as he gets what he wants right now he doesn't care.
aTm is not seen as a national power like Texas or Oklahoma but in Texas you have to deal with Texas politics. The big money and power come out of UT but aTm has enough highly placed connections financially and politically to block certain agenda items of the UT people. aTm has a lot of highly placed friends in the agriculture and oil and gas industries in Texas and that gives them enough political pull that nobody wants to force them to play their hands.
This does get interesting though when you look at the $20 million promises made to UT, OU, and aTm. If UT does their own network (and Missou and one or two others follow) then because of exposure, saturation, and dilluted market along with the fact that the Big XII media footprint is similar to the MWC when you subtract Texas the overall value of the package they could get is greatly reduced.
Let's say just for speculation purposes that the league gets a package worth $120 million. Subtract the $20 each for the big three and you get a little over $9 million each for the others, a little more than they made last year in the Big XII but less than 1/2 of what the big three get. Reduce the package to $100 million and then you get payouts of about $6 million and some really pissed of schools including OSU looking at OU getting almost 4X as much as they do.
This could be fun to watch, especially from the outside looking in, thankfully!
aTm is not seen as a national power like Texas or Oklahoma but in Texas you have to deal with Texas politics. The big money and power come out of UT but aTm has enough highly placed connections financially and politically to block certain agenda items of the UT people. aTm has a lot of highly placed friends in the agriculture and oil and gas industries in Texas and that gives them enough political pull that nobody wants to force them to play their hands.
This does get interesting though when you look at the $20 million promises made to UT, OU, and aTm. If UT does their own network (and Missou and one or two others follow) then because of exposure, saturation, and dilluted market along with the fact that the Big XII media footprint is similar to the MWC when you subtract Texas the overall value of the package they could get is greatly reduced.
Let's say just for speculation purposes that the league gets a package worth $120 million. Subtract the $20 each for the big three and you get a little over $9 million each for the others, a little more than they made last year in the Big XII but less than 1/2 of what the big three get. Reduce the package to $100 million and then you get payouts of about $6 million and some really pissed of schools including OSU looking at OU getting almost 4X as much as they do.
This could be fun to watch, especially from the outside looking in, thankfully!
Texas wanted to keep the conference together so they could build their own TV network and other independent revenue sources. They know it will not last long, but maybe long enough for them to solidify their network, etc. Then when the conference explodes they will have all the options in the world while maintaining control of their own revenue streams. Having those independent revenue streams before joining a new conference makes it much easier to exclude those from the rest of the members.
So basically you are left with UT beefing up it's personal coffers prior to conference explosion. This will ensure that whatever conference they go to they can get special treatment (meaning exclusion of their TV network, etc.). And you can be sure, someone will take Texas and all its BS. Just too much money to pass up. No one likes what Texas is doing, but they are doing what is in their best interest.
In regards to ATM, they may not be showing it on the field lately, but they are one of the more desirable and prominent programs in college football. Huge following and large resources. It's is also more fun when they are good, because Texas fan hates losing to Aggy!
So basically you are left with UT beefing up it's personal coffers prior to conference explosion. This will ensure that whatever conference they go to they can get special treatment (meaning exclusion of their TV network, etc.). And you can be sure, someone will take Texas and all its BS. Just too much money to pass up. No one likes what Texas is doing, but they are doing what is in their best interest.
In regards to ATM, they may not be showing it on the field lately, but they are one of the more desirable and prominent programs in college football. Huge following and large resources. It's is also more fun when they are good, because Texas fan hates losing to Aggy!
I disagree. There are three potential conferences they could go to: The SEC, the Big 10, and the Pac 10. The SEC and the Big 10 have business models that have made their conference members incredibly wealthy. Neither will be willing to acquiesce to UT's overbearing demands. They don't have to. They already have all the money they need and can easily cherry pick off some other schools (ND, Pitt, Missou, KU, A&M, Clemson, OU) and pretty much get the exact same result without the headache.
That leaves the Pac. As I mentioned, I think that the member institutions have seen just about everything they need to see out of UT to know that they don't want any part of them. At the very least, they won't allow UT to come into the league with their own network and an unbalanced revenue scheme. Again, they have no reason to. The Pac, as it stands, is the only major conference in two time zones. UT is not really all that coveted.
At the end of the day, I think UT tries to go independent, and OU and A&M wind up in the SEC, with maybe OSU along for the ride. The Big 12 will implode, there's no stopping that. UT may try to re-invent the old SWC with some also-ran teams like Baylor, Tech, Rice, UNT, Houston, UTEP, SMU and TCU. But nobody outside of the state of Texas will ever care about what goes on in that conference.
In my opinion there is no way everyone passes on Texas even with its BS, but I understand your points.
However I do agree that independent may be a route they are considering. However, while they will have no trouble scheduling for football (as OU, ATM, TT and Baylor will all still be tripping over themselves to play them), the bigger problem would be the other sports. Where do they do. Big East?
However I do agree that independent may be a route they are considering. However, while they will have no trouble scheduling for football (as OU, ATM, TT and Baylor will all still be tripping over themselves to play them), the bigger problem would be the other sports. Where do they do. Big East?
This could eventually end up like the old ACC with Florida State using a group of other schools to make scheduling easier and give them a bunch of easy wins each year.
OU, aTm, even OSU and Mizzou have some appeal to other conferences. Baylor, ISU, KSU, have no appeal to any other significant confences, KU doesn't either from a football standpoint so as much as they may protest their choices are to put up with Texas running the show and hogging the money or settle for mid-major status and money in the MWC, the C-USA, etc. which means even less money and recognition for them.
OU, OSU, and A&M, if they go to the SEC, won't be interested in playing UT anymore. They'll have a new, bigger kettle of fish to fry, and they'll each be playing each other, plus Arkansas and LSU. If those three leave, UT is screwed - royally. Their SOS will drop to KSU levels. In all seriousness, what's the difference between playing Wyo/CSU/BYU/Boise/Air Force and playing UTEP/SMU/Houston/Rice/Baylor/Tech?
Another impact will be that they'll lose recruits. Sure, they'll still get some, but the Big 12 really helped put UT back on the national stage. Take that stage away, and many of those kids will look to play somewhere that they can get more recognition.
The final nail in UT's coffin will be when Mack Brown finally hangs up his whistle. Remember that it took them 30 years between DKR and Mack Brown. That was 30 years of getting waxed by UCLA, A&M, CU, and OU on a regular basis. You can have all the money and facilities in the world, but if the guy running the show is incompetent, it won't translate to success on the field.