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Can somebody explain this to me?

Discussion in 'Colorado Basketball Recruiting Central' started by sackman, Apr 2, 2015.

  1. sackman

    sackman Club Member Club Member

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    This is a kid I know personally. His Dad and I are friends. He's actually been to several of our tailgates. He's a superstar on the team that went the entire season undefeated until the title game. His numbers look pretty good to me. He's smart, plays good defense, and is left handed (I've heard that's important for some reason). He's local and he plays AAU ball with Tad's son. Yet he hasn't shown up on our recruiting page. I know he has a few offers (Northern Colorado for sure, and possibly a few more).

    Why isn't he a more sought after recruit? What are the holes in his game that are keeping him from getting bigger offers?

    http://www.bocopreps.com/ci_27830418/boys-basketball-jessup-named-bocopreps-com-player-year
     
    AlferdJasper and sockdolager like this.
  2. dply

    dply Doble hoja Club Member

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    deleted
     
    Last edited: Apr 2, 2015
  3. absinthe

    absinthe Ambitious but rubbish. Club Member Junta Member

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    6'5" 180 which is a jump from the 6'2" 150 he was listed at last year, he is very thin and no way he is actually 180, but that maybe an indication he's still growing. (coaches are likely waiting to see if he keeps growing and how he rounds out as a player with a bigger frame).

    Here is his stat line for 4A Ball:
    17 points, 4.5 rebounds, 2.5 assists and 3.2 steals per outing

    cant find any video on him.
     
  4. AlferdJasper

    AlferdJasper Well-Known Member

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    Sacky,
    I don't know if you have talked to the player or his family, or if you are just wondering about the status as you know him. Sometimes a player IS getting attention from schools and coaches, but not recruiting forums, and that's okay. If Tad is really interested, he will see NO benefit to promote this kid to anyone else, and may not want him to become high profile. If he is NOT in contact with any schools, there are things a player/his adult supporters can do, and should do.
    (Disclaimer -- you know this kid, so you have more flexibility to speak with him. If you did not have an existing relationship, it would be one of those dangerous areas for potential NCAA violations if a college fan is making contact. I'd actually urge you to delete the third sentence here, because I'm a worry-wort, but ... up to you.)

    Off the top of my head - advice for any player in the primary sports:
    1. make sure he has created recruiting profiles for all the major sites: Rivals, Scout, ESPN, 247, Hudl, etc. There is a place on each site where a player can submit a form. You have to dig for it, sometimes, but it's there. In most cases, they want this submitted when the kid is a junior or before, so NOW is the time. Some sites don't bother with senior submissions.
    2. The player should go to each and every college site where he (or she) wants to be considered and file the prospective player questionaire on the athletic site for that team. Again, could have a slightly different name, but somewhere "information for potential recruits" is THERE. On CU's football site, it's under "more" and looks like this: questionaire.
    Okay, I couldn't find one for basketball, so plan B. Attend the school's camp(s) for your sport, so the coaches see you and get to know you.
    And Plan C, in conjuction with Plan B, for basketball: send an inquiry letter/email to the coach in charge of recruiting. In CU's case, Sean Kearney. Short and sweet, expressing interest. If the player is local, or making a college visit in the area, ask if there is an opportunity to stop by the office, tour facilities and meet staff on such and such a date. This puts a player on the school's radar, if not already there. IMPORTANT: be sure you let the athletic staff know you are coming to visit. The player can send a note and follow up with a call, but remember there are guidelines about recruit contact. The recruit can call as often as he/she wants to call, but the college can't always return the call during certain times. So put the info in a letter/email and follow up with a call.
    3. If the player does anything of interest - attending a camp, setting a record, getting an offer, visiting a college unofficially, working with younger kids in his/her sport, etc. send a note to area newspapers, both the big dailies and the local interest papers. If I were a player in Boulder County, that means the Camera, the Post, the Longmont Gazette, etc. Self-promotion --- those stories don't appear miraculously, someone tells the paper what is happening. Sure, not every tidbit gets reported, but if someone isn't feeding the stories, you'll get zero coverage.
    4. Duplicate those tidbits with the Rivals and Scout reporters/publishers for the home state site, AND any states/colleges where the player has an interest. If the player secretly wants to go to Notre Dame, then be sure he takes a summer tour there and sends a note to the publisher of the Rivals Notre Dame site saying so.
    5. Post videos on youtube of game highlights. They can be a mix of long and short clips, all on his own "Channel." Be sure the title states his year in school and where he is from, the name of the high school. Let Rivals and Scout know these videos are available to view, too.

    There's a million more things to do to increase a player's profile - let me know if you want to know more. I know football recruiting better than basketball, but much of it crosses over in terms of what the player can do himself.
     
  5. sackman

    sackman Club Member Club Member

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    I'm not so much interested in whether he goes to CU or not. That's not my intent with this. I'm more curious as to why he seems to be so lightly recruited. From talking to his Dad, he's getting a lot of interest from some D-II programs.

    Here's his stats as a junior (thanks abs):
    17 points, 4.5 rebounds, 2.5 assists and 3.2 steals

    Here are Spencer Dinwiddie's stats as a senior:
    11.2 points, 3.1 rebounds, 7.7 assists, 2.4 steals.

    Acknowledging that Dinwiddie was a point guard, and Jessup is more of a shooting guard, it would still appear that Jessup has better numbers than Dinwiddie had. So why the difference?

    I'm more curious than anything. I'm not lobbying for a CU offer. I'm just trying to figure out the story here.
     
  6. Darth Snow

    Darth Snow Hawaiian Buffalo Club Member Junta Member

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    Hint: level of competition.
     
  7. sackman

    sackman Club Member Club Member

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    Only at the high school level. Jessup plays AAU ball, too. No difference in competition level there.
     
  8. Darth Snow

    Darth Snow Hawaiian Buffalo Club Member Junta Member

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    Ummm....
     
  9. sliderNcider

    sliderNcider MacLovin Club Member

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    Here's your reason:

    [​IMG]
     
  10. dply

    dply Doble hoja Club Member

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    We should lay off Sacky for the Longmont stuff. It's getting out of hand.
     
  11. sackman

    sackman Club Member Club Member

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    His club team is the Colorado Titans. Looks to me like they play a lot of high level tournaments. But maybe they don't. Maybe somebody around here who knows this stuff can shed some light on it.

    [FONT=Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif]U17 Gold 2015 Tournament Schedule [/FONT]

    [FONT=Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif]April 10[SUP]th[/SUP] – 12[SUP]th[/SUP] – Big Foot Hoops H-Town Classic
    Houston, TX[/FONT]
    [FONT=Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif]April 17[SUP]th[/SUP] – 19[SUP]th[/SUP] – CCBA, Denver, CO[/FONT]
    [FONT=Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif]April 24[SUP]th[/SUP] – 26[SUP]th[/SUP] – Mile High Classic, Denver, CO
    or JayHawk Invite, Lawrence, KS[/FONT]
    [FONT=Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif]May 1[SUP]st[/SUP] – 3[SUP]rd[/SUP] – CCBA, Denver, CO [/FONT]
    [FONT=Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif]May 8[SUP]th[/SUP] – 10th – Top of the Rockies, Parker, CO[/FONT]
    [FONT=Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif]May 15[SUP]th[/SUP] – 17[SUP]th[/SUP] – CCBA, Denver, CO[/FONT]



    [FONT=Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif]July 8[SUP]th[/SUP] – July 12[SUP]th[/SUP] – Next Level Invitational, Milwaukee, WI[/FONT]
    [FONT=Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif]July 15[SUP]th[/SUP] – 19[SUP]th[/SUP] – Best of Summer, Anaheim, CA[/FONT]
    [FONT=Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif]July 18[SUP]th[/SUP] – 19[SUP]th[/SUP] – Swoosh Ultimate Showcase
    Orange County,CA[/FONT]
    [FONT=Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif]July 22[SUP]nd[/SUP] – 26[SUP]th[/SUP] – Las Vegas Classic, Las Vegas, NV[/FONT]
    [FONT=Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif]July 22[SUP]nd[/SUP] – 26[SUP]th[/SUP] – Fab 48, Las Vegas, NV – Split Roster[/FONT]
     
  12. sackman

    sackman Club Member Club Member

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    You're treading on very thin ice here. Choose your next words carefully. Not kidding.
     
  13. Darth Snow

    Darth Snow Hawaiian Buffalo Club Member Junta Member

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    You listed high school stats....
     
  14. sliderNcider

    sliderNcider MacLovin Club Member

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    Hey you asked...
     
  15. sackman

    sackman Club Member Club Member

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    Yeah. And compared them to Dinwiddie's high school stats (Senior year stats, at that). So your point is that Dinwiddie played better high school competition? OK. I can buy that to a degree. But is that all of it?
     
  16. sackman

    sackman Club Member Club Member

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    And you responded with a completely inappropriate, childish response. Not cool. Either contribute or get the Eff out of this thread. You're pissing me off right now.
     
  17. sliderNcider

    sliderNcider MacLovin Club Member

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    Uhhh.... ok
     
  18. buffaholic

    buffaholic Club Member Club Member

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    Edit: Nik says it best below.

    But don't assume that his AAU level is at all similar to Spencer's because it's not!
     
    Last edited: Apr 2, 2015
  19. HUFset

    HUFset Well-Known Member

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    Can he shoot and is he not afraid to shoot? That's all I care about after last year.
     
  20. TSchekler

    TSchekler Darth's Hero Club Member

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    I speak with a view from football recruiting but don't underestimate "the eye test". Stats and even competition level aren't everything. Some of the most productive football players in the state, who play at the highest level, are only going small D1 on scholarships or even as walk ons. While they blew away the competition at the highest level, here in Colorado, they just didn't pass the eye test as big time D1 players.

    Your friend's kid may have put up better stats than Dinwiddie, but was he realistically good enough to defend or score on a high school Dinwiddie or Collier? Coaches know a D1 caliber player when they see one and stats just don't mean much.
     
  21. Buffnik

    Buffnik Real name isn't Nik Club Member Junta Member

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    sacky,

    There's no great mystery here.

    He's not a Power Conference athlete. He's a stretch 4 in a guard's body when we're talking about that level.

    Should be a very good SG for UNCo or similar low D1 (or high D2 like Metro). He's getting recruited exactly where I'd expect.
     
  22. torerobuff

    torerobuff Dancing is forbidden Club Member

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    The kid is talented, no doubt about it. Watched him play and develop for a long time. He doesn't have a power conference body. He'll be very successful at a lower level school.

    Edit: Nik said the exact same thing right before me. So, yeah, :stupid:
     
  23. Ruckus

    Ruckus Peep my words. Club Member

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    What Nik said. Also, 17 ppg in 4a colorado isn't enough to make up for it.
     
  24. absinthe

    absinthe Ambitious but rubbish. Club Member Junta Member

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    CIF Open Division is not remotely comparable to Even 5a in Colorado, the stats i quoted are from their high-school teams. His numbers are comparable to XT's Sr season at Sterling when they were in 4a, that season was widely considered a let down and lead to the Stalzer Scholarship offer.

    As noted by a couple of others currently he's physically under developed, he's lanky, I can find any highlight videos of him doing anything besides laying the ball up so I assume between that and his RB numbers at 6'5" that he is a limited athlete. With those assumptions what he'd need to do to start to get top level offers is grow to 6'8"+ fill his frame out and continue to shoot the ball well.
     
  25. torerobuff

    torerobuff Dancing is forbidden Club Member

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    Important distinction too... He'd probably be able to be a solid offensive contributor on offense at a power school. But more importantly, you have to ask who he's going to guard. Look at Utah, he would get smoked by their guards on the perimeter, and there is no way in hell he's guarding Jordan Loveridge. Who was their 4th option this year.
     
  26. AlferdJasper

    AlferdJasper Well-Known Member

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    And my post was about this: what has he done to get his name and profile out there? For example, if there isn't video, why not? SOMEONE has to post it, it doesn't just appear like a gift from Thor.
     
  27. sackman

    sackman Club Member Club Member

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    Well, it's obviously a mystery to me, but I appreciate the response. I'll be keeping an eye on his recruitment.

    Thanks to everybody who chimed in. Except Slider, who was just being a dick.
     
  28. Buffnik

    Buffnik Real name isn't Nik Club Member Junta Member

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    If it helps you wrap your head around what I'm saying, think of Austin Dufault. He was a guard in high school, including being the primary ball handler for his North Dakota AAU team. Averaged 26 & 12 in high school (along with 4 assists & 3 steals) as the POY. He didn't have any high D1 offers until he blew up at a Las Vegas tourney competing against more heralded prospects... and he is 6'9". In college, Austin had no future as a big guard and ended up being an effective stretch 4. That's what I'm talking about when I say the type of athlete that plays the 4 at the Pac-12 level.

    A good reality check for whether someone is a good enough athlete to play guard in the Pac-12 is to ask yourself if you could see him covering Pac-12 WRs as a CB or S on the football team. If they don't pass that test, they're not a Pac-12 guard.
     
  29. Gary Indiana

    Gary Indiana Club Member Club Member

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    IMO, it comes down to 3 things- exposure, size, and competition. I grew up playing around New England, particularly NH. There were guys I played with/against that would dominate AAU/Summer league teams from Boston and NYC, but ended up at DII and DIII schools. Two individuals that stick out in my mind as special from the area that I played against or watched at tournaments were Matt Bonner and Kaleb Tarczewski.

    Bonner was able to make it because he had size but was able to handle the ball and stroke the 3. When you're 6'10" and can knock down shots from distance, you're going to get some looks. He also worked hard to get his name out there. As did his brother (played at WVU) and sister (Stanford).

    Kaleb's size speaks for itself and we have seen his play develop up close in the Pac-12. He will be in the NBA as well in short time. One thing that Kaleb did, it appears Jessup did not, was to transfer to a top prep school rather than attend the local HS. Playing at St. Anthony's in Mass got him the exposure he needed. Perhaps if Jessup went this route he would prove himself against top flight competition and would get some more offers. If he transferred to a top school for senior year and put up the same numbers, then your comparison to Dinwiddie might hold water.

    Hope this helped even a little.
     
  30. buffaholic

    buffaholic Club Member Club Member

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    Having been thru the process in 3 different sports, I think ALL the things that parents can control such as videos, websites and all-star showcases, etc are giant money making scams. I had a D1 coach say "we don't have time for those videos, we just throw them away. We ask for film if we want to see it".

    The Rivals/Scout/247 profiles are for us fans, not for the recruiters.
     

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