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CU Basketball vs. Fort Lewis Thoughts...

Discussion in 'Colorado Basketball Message Board' started by TZISKIN, Nov 13, 2011.

  1. TZISKIN

    TZISKIN Well-Known Member

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    I'll try to keep it fairly short, but early warning, I know I'll fail.

    1. Austin Dufault. Many know I've hated on him time and time again on this board, so here we go. That was one hell of a start to his senior season, I can admit when I see improvement, and this dude put in work this offseason. He was very aggressive on the boards, something I've NEVER seen from him. He also displayed a dramatically improved post game, with an array of well timed, coordinated, post moves, something he's never had in his arsenal. Now, it's against a D2 team, so all is not well, but he played very well in Game 1. He still needs to box out on defense and was able to get away with his superior size a few times in this one, he'll need to focus on that harder against legit opponents. I also think he shoots too many jumpers, but we'll see. Again, great start for Austin.

    2. Carlon Brown. I was hoping to see more of a legit #1 scoring threat from him, he's not there yet. He does have a pure jumper and did hit a tough jumper with the clock winding down, we'll need more of that. He needs to be more aggressive going to the basket. I need more from him going forward.

    3. Andre Roberson. Such an athletically gifted player, but he needs to be more focused defensively and on the boards. Because of that talent, he easily outjumped Fort Lewis players for rebounds, but he'll need to actually box people out soon enough, so he better get in the habit. He got lazy defensively on occassion, and disappeared offensively in the 2nd half. He's gotta stay involved, we need him to. Admittedly, I'm nitpicking, but I expect big things from this kid.

    4. Nate Tomlinson. People just hate, hate, hate, I don't get it. Offense was 100x better with him in the game, sets the pace, plays tough D despite limited athleticism, and makes the right plays in our set O. Didn't drop a couple jumpers that he normally makes, but he'll be ready...

    5. Askia Booker. I'm much more down on him than others I've seen posting. He has tremendous athletic ability and plays like a mad man, but that's not all good. He took quite a few bad shots, had some bad turnovers, he's gotta relax and play within the system. He's not our best player, so I don't wanna see him playing like he's the only dude out there. Harsh? Maybe, but he needs to tone it down.

    6. Spencer Dinwiddie. Ugh. I need to see more from him, he doesn't finish well around the rim, which is frustrating given his size for the position. He's very fluid, and has all the raw talent, I hope it was just nerves and he puts it together. You can see the potential there, keep working at it kid.

    7. Shane Harris Tunks. Oh boy, let's hope that was rust because damn he was awful. Getting dominated by a horrible, horrible big man, I mean that #44 kid was trash. Athletically, he's not where he used to be, and that's alarming. He's gotta rebound and play solid D, he did neither, I'll reserve judgment as it's been awhile since he's played, but damn, that was disappointing.

    General thoughts...

    - Our depth is tremendous, haven't seen that many legit D1 players on a CU team in awhile
    - Great athleticism, we'll have some highlight plays, we play fast, teams are gonna get tired out against us in Boulder
    - Too many fouls, granted, the refs were bad, but gotta keep those down

    Overall, I didn't think we looked all that great, and we should be happy we played against a D2 opponent, because we don't beat any decent D1 teams in that game. On the other hand, its Game 1 and we shouldn't rush to judgement. This tournament in PR will say a lot about our chances this season.
     
    Sexton Hardcastle likes this.
  2. Buffalo Brad

    Buffalo Brad Club Member Club Member

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    Also should point out that they cleared the bench and played Mills. Guessing that means the red shirt for him is not happening.
     
  3. Ruckus

    Ruckus Peep my words. Club Member

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    Carlon didn't need to do more. To me, it seemed he toned down his game Friday night. Not playing down to the competition, but not trying to pad his stats and take over. I am not concerned about his ability after that game. He could have scored 40 if he wanted.
     
  4. Goose

    Goose Hoops Moderator Club Member Junta Member

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    God dammit, I had a whole response written up to this before my internet crapped out and I lost everything. Let's try this again.

    First off, I'm late to the party but I wanted to thank everyone who came out to the pre-game. I wanted to post this this weekend, but Comcast's incompetence has left me without internet at home. Good to see some of you again and nice to meet some new faces like 'Tini, Rugged and NWD. Plus, I finally got to meet Rumblin'.

    As for the game, I know I've always been a huge Austin homer, but that was what I've been hoping for for years. He played like I was hoping SHT would play. He was physical, he banged, he rebounded. Now, quality of opponent does come in to play, but he looked like a different player. It looks like the FCA tour he went on this summer might pay off.

    I'm not worried about Dinwiddie. I saw flashes that made me think he could be special. I think once it starts to slow down for him, he'll be one of our top 3 players, and it wouldn't surprise me if that happened by the start of conference play.

    I told 'Nik at halftime that Ski could be our Dominique Wilkins -- he might score 30 points, but he's giving up 28 to the guy he's guarding. Saw some flashes, but he's a definite defensive liability right now. He's going to be have to permanently be paired with either Sharpe or Chen.

    SHT - wow. Nervous here. Hoping it's just rust, hoping he'll be fine. I was surprised to see us burn Mills' redshirt, but 'Nik & Rugged both made some good points about that after the game. We need Cain - badly. I don't think he'll play in PR, but hopefully he'll be back by Air Force. We need him.

    Honestly, not sure Friday changed my thoughts much about the season. I'm a little bit more nervous than I was before, but not too much. I still think that Wichita State is going to execute us to death on Thursday, and then I hope we can match up well with Maryland. 1-2 is still my likely vote for the PR Tipoff, but 2-1 wouldn't surprise me either.
     
    NWD Buff likes this.
  5. torerobuff

    torerobuff Dancing is forbidden Club Member

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    I've been wit Tziskin all along, I really like Tomlinson. He's nothing special, and he's not flashy, but he does a lot of things really well that help the entire team out. That was the first I'd seen of the freshmen, I really liked what Booker brought, even if he did some boneheaded, first college game things. I'm sure those will improve as we progress. Brown seemed to be kind of an enigma in this first game, but you looked up and he was in double digits scoring without noticing. So I count that as a plus. SHT looked awful, hopefully, as has been said before, its just rust. We'll learn a lot more in Puerto Rico.
     
  6. RumblinBuff

    RumblinBuff That one blogging guy Club Member

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    Great to see everyone on Friday. I can finally put faces with the names. We'll have to do some more meet-ups in the future amongst us basketball types.

    - Austin was awesome, I hope he can keep it up against better post players. After 3 years of playing out of position in the Big XII, he has a litany of post moves he can go to in order to make up for any athletic or height disadvantages. Going after guys he has physical advantages over is almost unfair at this point; had he played the full night he could've shot for 30 and 20.

    - 'Dre didn't even have to try against these guys. Wait til he has his blood up playing against real competition.

    - Did SHT jump once on Friday? Maybe that knee recovery is going slower than we thought. He seems to be running well, but he got no bounce in the paint. He needs a lot more game time to get back into game shape; he was huffin' all night long after whistles.

    - I've repeatedly talked about how much I like Nate. He passes both the eye and the stats test. People who hate on the kid confuse me.

    - The freshmen played like freshmen. Give them a few games before you really begin to form opinions about there game.

    - The refs were awful, the game seemed too fast for them. Where the **** did we get them from? Still, Dinwiddie can't be getting 5 fouls in 22 minutes against an athletically inferior opponent.

    - Great crowd for a game against a D-2 opponent; near 8,000 people and best opening day attendance since the start of the Bzdelik era. And a mostly full student section! Blew my prediction out of the water. I may have vastly under-estimated how many people will come to watch CU basketball this non-conference season. If we can get 8k to see Ft Lewis, we should be able to get close to a packed house for Georgia.
     
  7. Goose

    Goose Hoops Moderator Club Member Junta Member

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    In his defense, two of the fouls were offensive. And were bad calls.
     
  8. torerobuff

    torerobuff Dancing is forbidden Club Member

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    The Officiating was awful. I remember looking up at the scoreboard with like 10 minutes left in the game and the fouls were 10-8. One of those crews that thought the crowd was there to watch them.
     
  9. tante

    tante Club Member Club Member

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    It was like watching a KSU-CU game in the keg.
     
  10. Buffalo Brad

    Buffalo Brad Club Member Club Member

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    Agree. Even my 12 year old son asked if the refs thought we were there to watch them instead of the game. It was very bad as they continually stopped the flow of the game and were on the wrong side of many calls. I will say that Dinwiddie got the last call because he made such an issue out of the 4th foul. The ref had him pegged and went after him. Did not call a T but made sure his butt was on the bench.
     
  11. RK

    RK UBL Club Member

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    2 years ago... Worst game ever
     
  12. Buffnik

    Buffnik Real name isn't Nik Club Member Junta Member

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    Only reason KSU won that night is they had a deeper bench and could weather 3 guys fouling out with another half dozen in foul trouble. We couldn't. Crazy thing is that there weren't any hard fouls. I think the only technicals or warnings were on coaches who got fed up with it. That game must have taken 3 1/2 hours with all the stoppages.
     
  13. jgisland

    jgisland Club Member Club Member

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    It is very difficult to hate on Nate, but it is also very tough to love him. He is a defensive liability, he passes up too many shots (which he can't do this year, he is probably CU's best outside shooter) and he can't penetrate and break down defenses. That being said he is the steady hand out there, he gets them into their sets, calms them down and generally makes me feel comfortable with the ball in his hands when it matters.
     
  14. Ruckus

    Ruckus Peep my words. Club Member

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    The bold part. Am I the only person who sees Nate get jittery and out of control at the end of a game or half and turn the ball over or commit a charging foul? I hope to hell he is different than previous years because at the end of a game when I saw him with the ball my stomach turned over.


    -- I'm a Guy On A Buffalo --
     
  15. Black&Yella

    Black&Yella New Member

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    agree

    I totally agree with the post above me. Everyone loves to dog Nate but he knows the offense and makes sure we are executing it. At times last year that might not have been the best thing, as Alec did a lot on his own and needed the ball in his hands, but this year we need to be more structured since we have no go to guy on the offensive end.
     
  16. Darth Snow

    Darth Snow Hawaiian Buffalo Club Member Junta Member

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    Nate when there is no pressure = no problem. Nate at crucial or fast paced moments = often a disaster. I am talking like throwing the ball in bounds to the other team disaster.
     
  17. Buffnik

    Buffnik Real name isn't Nik Club Member Junta Member

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    Or picking up his dribble against the sideline to get trapped. Or trying to make an impossible pass.

    If he can discover his clutch gene, he could be really good. I just don't know if he has it.
     
  18. Ruckus

    Ruckus Peep my words. Club Member

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    Which is the reason we had Cory or Alec bring the ball up the court quite a bit last year. Because Nate couldn't handle the pressure and Shannon wasn't a good alternative there either. I think Nate is a fine player who can knock down some big shots and be a vocal, senior leader for the team, but I'm not going to pretend he is clutch or necessary.

    -- I'm a Guy On A Buffalo --
     
  19. RumblinBuff

    RumblinBuff That one blogging guy Club Member

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    Nate's the one telling everyone where to go. Without him, it often becomes a disorganized mess; this has been true the past two years.
     
  20. jgisland

    jgisland Club Member Club Member

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    Exactly, i can post all the random stats in the world but nothing can account for him telling people where to go.
     
  21. RK

    RK UBL Club Member

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    Nate needs to pull from outside whenever he is open.
     
  22. GoBuffs!!

    GoBuffs!! Active Member

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    I will agree Nate is pretty good at directing people where to go, but his shot isnt as good as many of you seem to think. He can make the shot when left open, and he is able to set himself up. When given any type of pressure, he is unable to set up his shot, or get it off with anyone of size guarding him. I will have to give him credit for not taking shots that he knows he has a low percentage of making.

    I am not a full on Nate hater, but he fits in the Bz system, and he fit pretty well in it, but with Boyles high paced system, he is just getting left behind.
     
  23. Buffnik

    Buffnik Real name isn't Nik Club Member Junta Member

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    I don't think people expect Nate to look for his shot like Levi did. At least I don't. I want him to be more like Jason Kidd with his shot selection. Knock it down when he's wide open instead of looking to reset the offense when that happens.
     
  24. GoBuffs!!

    GoBuffs!! Active Member

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    That would be good for him. With that said, I dont see him staying in the starting lineup for much longer, as soon as Dinwiddie and Booker calm their Freshman nerves, he will be bringing relief from the bench.
     
  25. jgisland

    jgisland Club Member Club Member

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    ^this^ he is a career 44% 3 pt shooter and shot 46% last year. He has to pick his SPOTS, I don't want him chucking it up every time down the court, but if he doesn't look for it when he is wide open who on this Buffs team is going to that you actually want shooting?
     
  26. RK

    RK UBL Club Member

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    This is one of my big worries for us. Every good team has the go to guy to knock down a 3 when they need it. I really think Nate has to start shooting more or Ski needs to really find his stroke for us to be where I want us to be this year.
     
  27. JRK7

    JRK7 Member

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    I won't base the outlook for the rest of his career on one game but i'm not sure why expectations for SHT were so high. He was terrible as a freshamn and it's not like he's suddenly going to turn into some great player especially coming off of major knee injury. I realize that Boyle has said he's looked good in practice but Bzdelik also once said that based on how he looked in practice Shannon Sharpe was just as good as Burks...
     
  28. shang

    shang Member

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    I'm with you on your observations in regards to expectations. I saw the game and what I was most impressed w/ about SHT was his attitude, fire and desire. For a guy coming off a major injury, he played w/ heart and brains, he got up and down the court, was jawing and shoving, got a technical and even ran over a couple of Ft. Lewis players and luckily didn't get called on that. I think as the season unfolds, we will see some real measurable improvement in him, and lets not forget, that when he's in the game w/ Dufault, it allows Dufault to move towards his natural position which is a huge plus.

    Just an observation, but on this thread we see a lot of high expectations of everyone, and some disappointment as not all 10/11 players that played got double doubles, hehe. I'm not sure if you saw the Tad Boyle aftergame interview(it's on the cubuffs website), I think that Tad was dead on in regards to the game. There's a reason he was able to turn around UNC and he's doing a fine job in both coaching and recruiting from what I've seen so far. Dinwiddie and Booker clearly showed major potential coming out of high school and lets look at 2 of the 3 transfers that got to play(unfortunately Adams is still recovering from a concussion). Brown is the real deal, maybe a little rusty or first game jitters, but clearly a major talent, and Chen came out of nowhere adding 10 pts. What really amazed me was between Sharpe and Chen, they looked the strongest on D and shut their opponents down. Chen had a the tougher assignment in the second half as he was defending the post position for a stretch there....

    Also I loved the multiple array of lineups, there must of been close to a dozen different ones...and Boyle and co. are looking as to what works and what doesn't...if we can't beat you w/ our big lineup, we'll go w/ our 4 or 5 guard lineup...lol! All I know is what ever works, with whatever lineup Boyle wants to use, I'm in, this is going to be both a most interesting and exciting season...GO BUFFS!
     
    Darth Snow likes this.
  29. Buffnik

    Buffnik Real name isn't Nik Club Member Junta Member

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    Nice first post. It's great to get more basketball fans. Welcome aboard.

    I agree with you on Shane. My concerns with him are his timing (which he should get back relatively quick) and whether he's got bounce (I'm worried on this). He's not a guy who is going to fill up the stat sheet, but should be a guy who does all the dirty work that makes the rest of the guys better.
     
  30. GoBuffs!!

    GoBuffs!! Active Member

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    I would be interested to see the other guys stats for when SHT is in the game, and when he is out. Most importantly Dufault. I really think he is allowed to play a game that suits him a lot better when he isnt guarding or being guarded by the biggest guy on the court.
     

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