1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Hypocrites

Discussion in 'Colorado Football Message Board' started by BrownEyedBuffGirl, Nov 25, 2012.

  1. BrownEyedBuffGirl

    BrownEyedBuffGirl Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 9, 2005
    Messages:
    4,500
    Likes Received:
    135
    How can you at the same time advocate "building a donor culture" while most of you appear to be nonrenewing season tickets and donations? I get that you want to show your displeasure with how things are going with the football program, but without donations and ticket sales how exactly do you expect the university to pay for all the facility improvements that we allegedly cannot compete without??

    You say "I'm not going to give them any more money until they show me they are SERIOUS about football!" What exactly do you expect to happen with no funding?? All the administration sees is that the fan base does not care about improving.

    It's not a chicken or egg argument...if you want to see changes, by all means keep telling the administration you're not happy, but also give and renew your tickets. Show them WE are serious about football at CU!
     
  2. Darth Snow

    Darth Snow Hawaiian Buffalo Club Member Junta Member

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2008
    Messages:
    56,968
    Likes Received:
    4,979
    I don't think you understood the message. Building a donor culture requires action from ABOVE, not individual actions by donors (albeit possibly organized in a mobby sort of way). But rage away.
     
  3. Tea Rex

    Tea Rex Club Member Club Member

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2007
    Messages:
    3,423
    Likes Received:
    183
    Terrible argument but ok
     
  4. InTheBuff

    InTheBuff Club Member Club Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2005
    Messages:
    11,253
    Likes Received:
    508
    if CU shows me they care(fire Embree) then I'll show I care (donate)
     
  5. Darth Snow

    Darth Snow Hawaiian Buffalo Club Member Junta Member

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2008
    Messages:
    56,968
    Likes Received:
    4,979
    frankly, CU should be writing down a list of eveyr poster in that thread and then PM them the instant Embree is canned (or facilities are announced, etc.). These are big time fans to post in that thread. CU should be identifying and cultivating them. Throwing parties for them. You know, building a donor culture. Or they can instead ignore them and claim they are the problem.
     
  6. Duff Man

    Duff Man Moderator Club Member Junta Member

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2006
    Messages:
    39,761
    Likes Received:
    4,753
    The school has to show a vision and commitment to winning for any sort of donor culture to take hold. That is what Nik is talking about going forward.

    If you donate money or buy tickets for CU athletics right now, where is the money going? How can the fans answer that question if the school/AD cannot answer it?
     
    HotRack likes this.
  7. Buffenuf

    Buffenuf massive tool

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2011
    Messages:
    2,575
    Likes Received:
    299
    You're right! All we have are a bunch of "mealy-mouthed whiners" whose wallets don't work, trying to lead from behind.

    Most here don't even understand the over-arching role of the CU Foundation and keep blaming Bohn. Its too, too comical.
     
  8. Duff Man

    Duff Man Moderator Club Member Junta Member

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2006
    Messages:
    39,761
    Likes Received:
    4,753
    ...says the guy who thinks Kansas' football tradition is nearly the same as that of the Buffs. You sure we are the ones misinformed?

    And some board members on this board have close ties to the CU Foundation. Don't be so sure we know nothing about their role.
     
  9. Uncle Ken

    Uncle Ken Orr no morr Club Member

    Joined:
    Dec 16, 2011
    Messages:
    17,430
    Likes Received:
    5,250
    Nearly all of the blame, that I've seen, has been placed on The President and the Chancellor. Most view Mike Bohn as their puppet. Did you form this opinion in a vacuum?
     
  10. Uncle Ken

    Uncle Ken Orr no morr Club Member

    Joined:
    Dec 16, 2011
    Messages:
    17,430
    Likes Received:
    5,250
    In my opinion, this might be a good point after four losing seasons. But at this point--an all time low--it appears that our administration is considering "staying the course". How else can you get their attention without being taken for granted?
     
  11. buffaholic

    buffaholic Club Member Club Member

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2008
    Messages:
    10,201
    Likes Received:
    1,636
    All the admin and regents have a letter with my name, seat locations, donation history and my stated opinion.

    I will donate when I can back the program. I am not a former CU student just a local businessman .
     
  12. Creebuzz

    Creebuzz Club Member Club Member

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2008
    Messages:
    3,212
    Likes Received:
    529
    I see both sides of the argument. I guess it's up to the individual to make choices that they think will create change. In the end, everyone wants to see improvement regardless of their opinion on how to achieve it.
     
  13. 89BUFF89

    89BUFF89 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 5, 2009
    Messages:
    1,525
    Likes Received:
    144
    Well I have been donating for many years and we now have the worst football program in FBS, so obviously something has to change because that course of action has not worked. The only thing within my power is to stop donating to see if things up at CU change. I understand those that want to keep buying/donating, I was one of you up until this season. But at this point I feel like I have no other choice if I want to see any real change happen anytime soon.
     
  14. BlackNGold

    BlackNGold Club Member Club Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2005
    Messages:
    4,505
    Likes Received:
    609
    I am not going to call anyone a hypocrite, everyone has an opinion on how best to deal with the issue. I do feel that boycotting and not renewing is not going to be effective in fixing the problem. As a donor you have a more powerful voice than you do as a non-donor (not saying the voice will be all powerful but it will have more impact).
     
    BrownEyedBuffGirl likes this.
  15. Buffnik

    Buffnik Real name isn't Nik Club Member Junta Member

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2009
    Messages:
    80,782
    Likes Received:
    16,502
    My donations have not led to better management or a better result. I will increase donation to support a vision. I will stop donating into the existing black hole. CU can create a donor culture by communicating vision and recruiting us to the effort. It's pretty simple, really.
     
  16. Junction

    Junction Moderator Club Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2005
    Messages:
    47,534
    Likes Received:
    1,000,005
    BEBG does have a point in that the facilities improvements are needed, and the donations are needed to make that happen. But it's also true that the donors most effective way of expressing themselves is voting with their dollars. Donating under the current circumstances is supporting an unsupportable situation. To me it seems like the best solution is to let the administration know that this situation isn't one people are willing to support by cutting back on season ticket purchases and donations, but commit to making up those donations when the time is right...
     
  17. Clean Undies

    Clean Undies Flagship of the 12-Pac Club Member

    Joined:
    Jun 3, 2007
    Messages:
    27,301
    Likes Received:
    5,994
    I would like to see a "pledge" section on Allbuffs.

    If CU does _________ , I promise to donate $_______.

    The aggragate sum of the Allbuffs pledges would provide additional substance to the campaign by Allbuffs to effectuate change.
    In my view, taking your season ticket purchase and seat donation off the table basically removes you from the dialog.
     
  18. GoonieBuff

    GoonieBuff Not really Club Member

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2011
    Messages:
    4,552
    Likes Received:
    323
    Whatever. You're entitled to your opinion, however messed up that may be.
     
  19. Uncle Ken

    Uncle Ken Orr no morr Club Member

    Joined:
    Dec 16, 2011
    Messages:
    17,430
    Likes Received:
    5,250
    Okay, I've thought about this some more.

    The goal is to reinforce the model that good football brings in donations. You can't do that unless bad football doesn't. Therefore, withholding tix, donations etc... should promote a donor culture.

    A great movie on the subject of changing culture is 12 O'Clock High with Gregory Peck. You may remember that as the new Group Commander, BG Savidge shuts down the bar. Before, it was open at all times. Later in the movie, he opens the bar, but only as a reward. Sometimes you have to secure those things that are taken for granted, and then make them rewards for specific behavior later. That's the intent here.

    I've mentioned before that I guest lecture at a DC University from time-to-time. One of my topics is on "Leading Change". The rational model for leading change is simple.

    C=D*M*P>R

    In this basic model change occurs when Dissatisfaction times the Model (vision) times the Process (the patch to that vision) is greater than the organizational resistance.

    One of the counter-intuitive techniques to creating a culture receptive to change is dial up the dissatisfaction. I'd argue that Nik has done a good job of presenting a model and process already. Now we just need to make the Administration miserable with the status quo. Withholding donations accomplishes that.
     
  20. MiamiBuffs

    MiamiBuffs Wᴉɐɯᴉ qnɟɟs Club Member

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2005
    Messages:
    36,157
    Likes Received:
    2,029
    I think the fans feel, after 8-9 years of this, that there is NOT a culture of winning eminating from the top anymore. And most of these fans here have supported the program over that span or longer. And they are tired of this. Many here, myself included, were attracted to CU from out of state partly by the football program. Football planted the seed. Football represents an identity, a part of the brand that is CU, it still connects many of us to CU after we left. And we're tired of seeing it mistreated.

    The culture that does seem to exist is a culture of academia is in control, athletes gain entry based on rigid academic criteria (compared to the looser criteria other top25 peers enjoy), and coaches are selected by some criteria other than their ability to win. Football is kept on a very short leash here.

    To put it more simply look at the Top 25 and name one program that would have put up with Embree finishing last in nearly every NCAA statistical category? And how many of them have an alum as criteria to be head coach? The answer is none because we don't want to be a top 25 program anymore.

    Ill not ridicule or criticize anyone for with holding funds based on the above.
     
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2012
  21. Buffnik

    Buffnik Real name isn't Nik Club Member Junta Member

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2009
    Messages:
    80,782
    Likes Received:
    16,502
    I've also given this some more thought and think I can simplify it.

    If you give your kid an allowance and he half-asses his lawn care for a while, you correct behavior by reducing or taking away the allowance. BEG and others are saying to give the kid a bigger allowance in hopes that this will motivate him to turn your lawn into something out of Edward Scissorhands.
     
  22. Clean Undies

    Clean Undies Flagship of the 12-Pac Club Member

    Joined:
    Jun 3, 2007
    Messages:
    27,301
    Likes Received:
    5,994
    Maybe a better option than just canceling the tickets is to send the money you might otherwise have spent on football tickets to support CU programs that are meeting and exceeding your expectations.

    - Basketball, Cross Country, Skiing, Golf - all did very well over the base 12 months. They should not be punished for the mismanagement of football.
     
  23. Buffnik

    Buffnik Real name isn't Nik Club Member Junta Member

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2009
    Messages:
    80,782
    Likes Received:
    16,502
    That had been my plan. But it was pointed out to me that they'll just shift budgets around. It may still make a statement, but they won't feel the pinch that would force decision-making and leadership. I still haven't decided on this front.
     
  24. Swish

    Swish Half a bubble off Club Member

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2006
    Messages:
    4,202
    Likes Received:
    551
    No disrespect BEBG but the wallet is the only thing anyone respects anymore. It is the only voice that will be listened to.

    What's hypocritical is to be content to allow a program that pays for most everything else that goes on in sports at CU to fall from mediocre to worst over the last several years and still expect fans and boosters to give their full support solely on the basis of loyalty and a special place in their hearts for all that is Buff. Loyalty is a two way street and the administration is not showing much loyalty to the bread and butter of the overall athletic program at CU. They are not showing much loyalty to the fans either by their stubborn position in a number of areas regarding the football program.
     
  25. Clean Undies

    Clean Undies Flagship of the 12-Pac Club Member

    Joined:
    Jun 3, 2007
    Messages:
    27,301
    Likes Received:
    5,994
    To play devil's advocate, the absence of ticket buying fans may also be interpreted as a clear sign to shutter the program.

    This bottom line driven administration is just as likely to pull the plug than to pull off some major resuscitation.

    The unintended consequence of "tough love" may be for CU to end up like the University of Chicago or DU. That would suck if CU decided to cut off their own nose just to spite the face.
     
  26. SBG

    SBG Formerly known as EFNMB Club Member Junta Member

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2006
    Messages:
    6,829
    Likes Received:
    505
    Not with pac12 money. They'll field a team. It's just going to be a new KSU pre-Snyder.
     
  27. DBT

    DBT Club Member Club Member

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2005
    Messages:
    58,615
    Likes Received:
    4,724
    People must make tough choices with their dwindling pay checks these days. If money were no object then, yeah, it could be argued that threatening to cancel one's season tix while screaming for better facilities could be considered to be hypocritical. But for people who stretch the budget at the expense of other things, it is not hypocritical. If I were to write a letter, my argument would be that, "Mike, I must make a choice as to how I spend my very limited dollars. I get the most joy watching a competitive football program. I get no joy watching a no competitive disaster. My wife gets joy going to the theater. It is difficult for me to argue with my wife that our limited entertainment funds are better spent going to CU football games."
     
  28. Fight CU

    Fight CU Club Member Club Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2005
    Messages:
    6,728
    Likes Received:
    1,579
    BEBG - this is not a drive in. please come back and pick up your food.
     

Share This Page