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I know this will make some people angry...

Discussion in 'Colorado Football Message Board' started by ChemEBuff, Sep 9, 2012.

  1. ChemEBuff

    ChemEBuff New Member

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    The buffs have really dropped the ball. The coaching has been extremely lackluster and the players dont seem to understand the concept of hard nosed, grind it out football. There is no heart. There is very little talent. Things dont look good for this season and i agree that most of the blame needs to be placed on Embree for putting this product out on the field.

    Ive only been a serious CU fan for the 3 years that ive been attending the university but over that time Ive seen my share of memorable meltdowns and embarrassing defeats (yesterday was one of the worst). But ive also seen some pretty cool victories by this football team (Georgia in 2010), and i know what this fan base and football team is capable of.

    That being said I believe Embree needs more time. Ive been satisfied so far with his ability to recruit (especially in Texas and Cali), and the players he is bringing in seem to have an edge about them that should develop nicely in the years to come. We all know that Embree has the heart to get this program back to the right place even though his heart isnt translating to wins right now. Put yourself in Embree's shoes. He is dealing with a program that needs to be rebuilt from the ground up. It takes time and i think ive come to realize that. I know that for some of the fans on this board that are much wiser and more loyal than myself, time is of the essence. You want to be respectable now. That makes sense. But good things take time.

    Go ahead and bash if you want. I want to win now but i think after the Sac St loss my expectations have fallen back down to earth. Its going to be a long season. But these guys need all the support they can get. No true buff fan should be booing their home team. No true buff fan should be talking about killing themselves because of one loss. There is still a lot of football to be played this season and talent to develop. Negativity only breads doubt, not success.

    What is hiring a new coach in the middle of an already ruined season going to do to the team dynamic? We have a greater chance of losing freshman players who committed to play for Embree and EB if they're fired. The team is going to lose and have to rebuild any semblance of family/identity that they might have developed this far into the season. Help these guys out. Dont contribute to their downfall. If nothing changes by the beginning of next season then Embree needs to go. But lets be realistic with what we are working with.
     
    L Buff likes this.
  2. BuffClass90

    BuffClass90 Banned BANNED

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    Its a tough situation. If we keep them and go 0-12, that will hurt recruiting more than a mid season firing.

    I don't know if firing Embo soon is the answer, but if he doesn't make changes, even firing some assistants if need be, he should go. I don't think Embo is the guy but not sure firing him mid season is the answer either.
     
  3. SINKRATZ

    SINKRATZ Club Member Club Member

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    I understand this point of view, but I completely disagree with some of your main points.

    I am not at all satisfied with this staff's recruiting - I accepted the Embree hire, in part, because I believed this group would make up for lack of coaching experience with well above average recruiting. This has not happened.

    It's going to take a lot more than heart to get this program back in the right place. A lot of people have heart, not all are great coaches.

    As a fan, and someone who has spent discretionary income on this program for years, it is well within my right to boo the home team and frankly the administration needs to hear it. It is not directed (entirely) at the players, but they're not without fault and are big boys. I boo because we have put a dogsh!t product on the field for 7+ years and there is no end in sight.
     
  4. Matt

    Matt Nerd Drone Pilot Club Member

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    Good luck with the flames. I hope you brought your flame suit! People here think we are Alabama, Michigan, or LSU. We are 0-2 and people think Embree should be fired today and we will bring in the next Nick Saban. CU Football has been irrelevant for a decade. Embree is here for awhile, I think we should all take some Klonopin and calm down.
     
  5. ChemEBuff

    ChemEBuff New Member

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    Exactly. Over reactions will kill this program not Embree
     
  6. SINKRATZ

    SINKRATZ Club Member Club Member

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    Bullsh!t - no one here thinks we're Alabama or LSU, but also I refuse to accept that we are now Indiana or Duke.
     
  7. BuffaloSoldier76

    BuffaloSoldier76 Unsound Meat Club Member

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    Good, reasonable post.

    Here's the problem. It has been seven years...SEVEN YEARS...since we last had a winning record. Based on what we've seen out of the first two games of this season, there are no signs of life on that team. If you were a decent high school football prospect and you had a choice between Colorado and any other school in FBS, would you choose Colorado? Can we offer recruits the opportunity to play in bowl games or championship games? No. Do we offer them top-level training facilities? No. Can we provide them with proven coaching that can put them on the fast-track to an NFL career? No. Does the university leadership provide support to the football program that would make a parent feel like they are putting their son in good hands? No. I love the Buffs, but they are awful and getting worse.

    I agree with you that we all need to take a step back from this situation, take a few dozen deep breaths, and approach the situation more realistically. This one just hurt a lot. People are going to blow off their steam. Be thankful that in this day and age, we have the Internet to blow that steam off on. 40 years ago, people this frustrated with their team used to beat their wives and kids to vent this level of frustration.
     
  8. L Buff

    L Buff Commissar of the Albuffs Collective Left Club Member

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    Chem ... your post is far too restrained, well considered, and thoughtful for this board and all the ship-jumpers on it.

    Get with the program dude. :rolling_eyes:
     
  9. Sexton Hardcastle

    Sexton Hardcastle Club Member Club Member

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    You're right matt. Its silly to think we should easily beat DII competition. I mean who do we think we are? :lol:
     
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  10. CVilleBuff

    CVilleBuff Club Member Club Member

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    Recruiting a decent class in your first real cycle isn't exactly the hardest thing to do when you sell promise. However, if we 0-12 this year and lose guys like Parsons, perhaps you'll understand that the Embree regime is hopeless and the sooner we cut ties, the better.
     
  11. BuffClass90

    BuffClass90 Banned BANNED

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    :lol: I resemble that remark.
     
  12. CUFan

    CUFan Welcome back Club Member

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    Nothing about CU football makes me angry anymore. Every season we hit a new low. We are comically bad.

    These two games clearly show this staff is in over their heads. As CU fans we've seen so much bad football we know when it's time to move on. Sadly we also know the CU admin doesn't care and we will have to live with this garbage for too long causing more long term damage than necessary.
     
  13. buffedup

    buffedup Cooler than a Popsicle Stand. Club Member

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    The thing that drives me nuts is that so many Embree "supporters" think most of the folks on this board are overreacting to the losses, and that he needs time to rebuild. Most of the people here are actually quite patient and willing to take their lumps for the big picture. However, there are certain limits and warning signs that simply cannot be ignored:

    1. Losing to a bad FCS school at home, especially after playing a game this season. This is the TOP reason that Embree is getting the heat that he is. Sac State got blasted by New Mexico State last week. Colorado should have rolled Sac State. We have been down this road before with Hawkins and Montana State. We simply cannot afford to wait another 5 years.
    2. Losing to a very bad CSU team. One of the largest coaching metrics is beating rivals. Embree did fine last year with beating the lambs and Utah (not really a big rivalry, but you know what I mean). Embree is now the ONLY coach in Colorado history to lose to a 1st year CSU head coach. This is a very troubling sign.
    3. Losing seasons. Most people are ok with giving a coach a mulligan year. Embree got his last year. Many were even prepared for another one this season as long as we saw progress with this young team. This may still happen, but we are more likely to be 0-12 than win a single game. This is inexcusable given our schedule this year.
    4. Coaching. Embree made some very bad calls against CSU that cost Colorado the game. The coaches also are struggling to adjust in game as well as put the right players in place to succeed. The coaches themselves have said that they can't figure out what the issue is. That is very concerning.

    Embree has the rest of the season to turn the ship around in my book, so it is not too late. However, I am willing to bet that this is highly unlikely given what I have seen before, and that he will need to be let go.
     
  14. Duff Man

    Duff Man Moderator Club Member Junta Member

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    Chuckling.

    In all seriousness, it is not just two games. Not sure what people are not getting. The 3-10 season last year where we were not competitive in most of the losses is not just wiped away. The poor start to recruiting for the 2013 class needs to be taken into account as well.

    A 3-12 record after 15 games, including a loss to a below average Big Sky team, will put any head coach at a BCS school squarely on the hot seat. To start acting like fans are suddenly unreasonable because we expect better than that is pure horse****.
     
  15. rosstr

    rosstr Well-Known Member

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    1. Embree's recruiting has been serviceable but it will now freefall.
    2. I have a ton of heart for CU but I have no credentials for being its head coach. Neither does Embree.
    3. We are looking at 10 straight years of losing seasons...

    Sorry, but perception is reality and the ship has sailed on Embree. He was a no-name, no-credentials guy and we pay him a couple ham-sandwichs/yr to coach. And that's about his market value. Recruiting will be impossible at this point and keeping him to save 250k would be an epic mistake.
     
  16. rosstr

    rosstr Well-Known Member

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    This University is a 2 billion dollar enterprise and for its leaders to let the face of the university (football) embarrass the rest of it in the nations most public forum is disgraceful. All in the name of saving a couple 100k.
     
  17. Matt

    Matt Nerd Drone Pilot Club Member

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    Actually this will be the 7th straight year of losing seasons. CU went 7-5 in 2005.
     
  18. Uncle Ken

    Uncle Ken Orr no morr Club Member

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    Oh, dear Christ. Is this even serious? You are screechiest, lesast restrained, most emotional poster on this entire board. Seriously, none screechier, less restrained or more emotional. I hope you're not implying otherwise. Sorry for the personal attack, but you were due.
     
  19. rosstr

    rosstr Well-Known Member

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    "looking" is future tense...
    And they went 7-6 in 2005...
     
  20. Duff Man

    Duff Man Moderator Club Member Junta Member

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    :rolling_eyes:

    (Saving LBuff the time and effort)
     
  21. Matt

    Matt Nerd Drone Pilot Club Member

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    A team that has not had a winning season since 2005. A team that hasn't not be relevant since 2001. Though CU did do well in 2002 at 9-4. That is who we are.
     
  22. chipwich

    chipwich Administrator Club Member Junta Member

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    I was willing to cut Embree some slack but rebuilding or not you can't be losing to schools like Sac State. I think he is in way over his head.
     
  23. Uncle Ken

    Uncle Ken Orr no morr Club Member

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    Sorry, I went on to read your "chuckle" and realized the issue had already been addressed. I just felt screechy, lacked restrained and got emotional in the moment.
     
  24. SINKRATZ

    SINKRATZ Club Member Club Member

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    Are you joking? YES, no matter how many losing seasons we have, there is no excuse for losing to a DII team...ever.
     
  25. Buffnik

    Buffnik Real name isn't Nik Club Member Junta Member

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    Yep. We're more like Washington or Syracuse.
     
  26. SINKRATZ

    SINKRATZ Club Member Club Member

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    I've always liked the Wisconsin comparison too - not a perennial power, but always competitive and can rise up to compete for a conference title every 5-6 years. Great college town that still has to compete for eyeballs and dollars with a popular NFL franchise in it's backyard. I'd love to have a program like that and it doesn't seem impossible with the right leadership (though admittedly I have no idea how their booster situation compares to ours). We're never going to be Alabama, but that probably shouldn't be the goal anyway.
     
  27. Sexton Hardcastle

    Sexton Hardcastle Club Member Club Member

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    This is silly were even arguing this. Nobody here in their right minds think were in the same league as LSU, or Bama. Nobody.

    Even the Hoosiers can win the games that their supposed to win. How sad is that? :lol:
     
  28. CarolinaBuff

    CarolinaBuff Weekend Poster Club Member

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    fify
     
  29. White_Rabbit

    White_Rabbit Club Member Club Member

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    UW is a pretty decent comparison. They had a good year in 01, things went downhill quickly from there. 2 bad coaching hires have haunted them, but then they got a hot young coordinator who could recruit and are on their way up. They've had a 0 win season and a 1 win season within the decade too.
     
  30. rynobuff

    rynobuff Club Member Club Member

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    It's not even that anymore... we have fallen BELOW that level of Indiana, Duke, etc. But what you said is exactly right, we should all understand by now that we are not anywhere near the type of program we were in the 90's and may never get quite back to that level, but no ****ing way in hell should we be where we are now. There is no excuse for us not to be an annual bowl team honestly imo, the University of Colorado has too much to offer. Our expectations need not be CU of the 90s, but damn well should be at least a middle of the PAC12 type of team... we have too much tradition to be the Duke of the Pac12.
     

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