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Just my opinion......

Discussion in 'Colorado Football Message Board' started by Ralphandler1, Sep 12, 2012.

  1. Ralphandler1

    Ralphandler1 Member

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    Ok so I gotta say this is getting f--kin ridiculous. I am a die hard CU fan and I understand the frustration of the past years as well as any. But I am losing my mind with people bashing JE, coaches and players. We all understand they lacked experience at the head coach and coordinator levels. Yes, the results the past 15 games have been poor at best. But folks it's game 2 on season 2. They came into a situation with almost no D1 talent or speed. They walked into a locker room last summer that lacked true heart or drive. We all said the day JE was hired it was gonna take a few years to get anything going. Just try to look objectively here..... last year was truly JE and other coaches first full recruiting year and chance to get all their guys. They also lost 28 seniors which is a big deal for anyone simply in terms of experience and leadership (even tho Hawk kids generally lacked both but of those 28 some were key). Now look at the best players so far this season..... Crawley, Powell, Wright, Major, Rippy, Mosely. 4 of them were in high school 6 months ago guys. They are young but the infusion of speed and talent is pretty obvious at this point. But you cannot reasonably expect true freshman to lead a team to glory right away. We need to give them a chance to develop and JE and company a chance to turn it around..... and 15 games is not giving that chance. Totally agree it is almost inexcusable to lose to CSU and Sac state..... But as many have pointed out look at coach mac in his 2nd and 3rd years. We have to give them time.

    MOST IMPORTANTLY please for god sakes stand by this team. It is hard during times like this. But these are kids working their tails off and trying (trying a lot harder than Hawk era). Stand behind the coaches for at least 2-3 years and give them a chance to turn things around like we promised. Calling for a firing after 1 full season is INSANE and anyone who knows anything about college football would agree. You know recruits and players read these forums occasionally..... show the future buffs that we as fans all stand behind them even in the bad times. Show them that Boulder and CU is place you wanna be.... Not a place where we are going to bash you and call for your head and fire the coach who you committed to after 15 games. Support the Buffs..... Give Embo the time and support we promised him. If we are still losing to CSU and Sac St to start his 3rd and 4th years then we can call this a failure..... but certainly not after 15 games. Hawk left an utter mess..... it takes time to clean up the ****.
     
    LongHaulBuff likes this.
  2. CVilleBuff

    CVilleBuff Club Member Club Member

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    There's a difference between "letting them get things going" and starting a season with losses to CSU (who just got blown out by North Dakota State in Ft. Collins) and Sacramento State. I am utterly speechless that you could rationalize losing to Sacramento State. Wow. Just wow.
     
  3. Duff Man

    Duff Man Moderator Club Member Junta Member

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    Basically, let them know we do not take our football seriously enough.
     
  4. J.R. Ewing

    J.R. Ewing Club Member Club Member

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    Ralphhandler, it would be different if we lost those games on a slew of turnovers and blown coverage by freshman. We didn't. We got pushed around by teams that wanted it more. In crucial parts of the game, the Buffs flopped. We were outgained in both games.
     
  5. Liver

    Liver modded mod Club Member Junta Member

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    really. could you imagine the reaction an 0-2 start (with losess to 2 truly awful teams) would garner in alabama?

    NUK-U-LAAAAAAAAAAAAR meltdown.
     
  6. CarolinaBuff

    CarolinaBuff Weekend Poster Club Member

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    To add to that, Sac State was blown out in their first game by New Mexico State. Granted, NMSU is a powerhouse program, but still.
     
  7. J.R. Ewing

    J.R. Ewing Club Member Club Member

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    Anyone remember the fans reaction and Saban's speach when they lost to UL Monroe?
     
  8. Quattro

    Quattro Banned BANNED Club Member

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    I'm just glad to know people are ok with NMSU surpassing us
     
  9. leftybuff

    leftybuff Iconoclast Club Member

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    Love the enthusiasm, and I agree it is unfair to expect a great deal given the disaster HaLk left. I really thought Embo's expectation of a bowl game was overly optimistic. I thought 4-5 W's was obtainable since CSU, Sac. St. and possibly WSU and Fresno were games where the Buffs had an edge talent-wise. That was certainly true of CSU and Sac. St.

    Dropping back to back games against your two worst opponenents to open the season doesn't inspire confidence. In fact, it is a huge red flag, especially when CSU has a first year coach putting in new systems, and having lost two of their best defenders in the off season. Sac. St., there just isn't any excuse I care to hear. They were picked ninth in the Big Sky with only 11 starters from last year's team. Piss poor is the only way you can spin that one, and I don't think it is a stretch to wonder aloud whether Embo and his staff are the right crew for the job.
     
  10. JWP303

    JWP303 Active Member

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    There are two separate issues here.

    1.) The systematic problems that have led to a bare cupboard and lack of talent that is obviously holding the program back.
    2.) Poor coaching that led to losses in two winnable games.

    I think you've created a straw man by pretending that the second isn't a real issue. Your argument assumes that fans are not able to criticize poor coaching because of the reality that our program is in a bad spot.
     
  11. Swish

    Swish Half a bubble off Club Member

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    Sounds like there is an echo in here. Flyer are you there??
    The voice of reason coming into play in the aftermath of this weekends disaster.

    At least no stones being thrown by this one.
     
  12. Ralphandler1

    Ralphandler1 Member

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    Some of you are clearly not understanding this...... I am not saying its ok to lose to them. In fact I believe I said it is almost inexcusable and by no means am I happy about it. However, did anyone that is not high or drunk expect this to turn around quickly? IT HAS BEEN 15 GAMES PEOPLE! McCartney lost to KSU, KU, Iowa st etc in 1984 when he was starting.... and for those who are not aware those were bottom of the barrel programs in the 80's. If that happened today you all would be calling for his head too and look how that one turned out a few years later! There have been a lot of growing pains.... all I am saying is give these guys a reasonable chance to fix the mess left by Talkins. Let them recruit (which as mentioned before they are doing a pretty good job of at the moment). And the point of my whole rant was instead of whining on a forum stand up for your team, your coaches and the players. They deserve that much. They deserve a legit shot to fix this situation and I am pretty damn sure 15 games is not a legit shot. Losing to those teams sucks..... but burried in that is some good signs IMO. Attitudes are no longer crappy on the team. They believe they can win, they expect better of themselves, the talent and speed in 1 recruiting class is better than the last 4 years of hawkins, a LOT fewer insane procedure penalties (ie more fundamental coaching starting to show). Seriously not rationalizing losing to bad teams but at this point I believe it is too early to be talking about firing JE. Most people agreed it would take 3 years to get it going the right way.....so lets give it 3 years. And in the meantime stand up for your team instead of berating them. At the END of year 2 I think it is ok to talk about getting rid of one or two POSITION coaches if they are not cutting it on field or recruiting trail, but again it is far too early for that as we approach game 3 of the season.
     
  13. tante

    tante Club Member Club Member

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    I'm sick of hearing the same thing from all the different new posters. Guys the Freshman are playing pretty good: Thomas, Tupou, Wright, Powell, Crawley and Mosley. What we are worried about is the QB with 20+ games of BCS experience and the O-line that don't have a single true freshman.
     
  14. Liver

    Liver modded mod Club Member Junta Member

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    mora at ucla.

    argument over.
     
  15. CVilleBuff

    CVilleBuff Club Member Club Member

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    Exactly. It would be one thing for the freshmen to just be completely struggling right now. What these posters don't understand is that WE HAVE NO IDENTITY, or if we do, our identity is that we suck and get bullied. Essentially every aspect in terms of style of play that Embree & Co. have talked up incessantly is nowhere near fruition. That is the major concern (As an aside, there's also Embree looking like a deer in the headlights on the sidelines -- Ironic that Paul Chryst has that exact same look, how's Pitt doing?)
     
  16. leftybuff

    leftybuff Iconoclast Club Member

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    Rich Rod at AZ

    Todd "My bags are packed" Graham at ASU

    you don't even have to look outside the P12, hell the P12 S, to dispel the "gee, we need to give it time" argument.
     
  17. Ralphandler1

    Ralphandler1 Member

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    Was that referring to me being a new poster? Cause I have been reading this forum since 2008, and I usually post only occasionally when I have something legit to say. I get that everyone is upset about the performances. But people seriously wanna fire a coach 15 games in after 1 full recruiting season? If you thought it was hard to lure a coach to CU before just try to do it with lower than avg pay and the knowledge that a fan base turns on you in less than 1.5 years and you can get fired before you get a legit shot to do anything. ( Not to mention try getting assistants to come with ZERO job assurance from the school and knowing that the school is willing to boot the staff after 15 games.) Come on we are not Michigan or Notre Dame.... We dont have the ability to fire coaches on a whim. We picked Embo and its time to get his back for a while.
     
  18. Clean Undies

    Clean Undies Flagship of the 12-Pac Club Member

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    Honest question...what is your take on bashing Bohn, DiStephano and Benson for putting Embree in a position where its difficult to succeed?
     
  19. BuffClass90

    BuffClass90 Banned BANNED

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    Maybe the team needs to hear it from us? They've talked about their attitude the past few years, and I'm paraphrasing, of not really caring a lot and giving up early. Orms made this point in his press conference.

    Maybe if we get pissed off it will fire them up? Maybe hearing them being booed will piss them off...I don't care if they get mad at the fans, just play with some intensity and flip us off at the end of the game when they win. Passion and intensity will win us games.

    I am becoming more convinced that the problem is with the players as well as the coaching staff. These kids don't have the heart of the Buffs yet...and instilling that attitude is one thing I have confidence the coaching staff can do. They are young and some players are stepping up as leaders. Who knows what's needed to light a fire under these kids and get them playing hard for 60 minutes? If we do that, we have a fighting chance against Frez. We have decent talent for a BCS team, but enough talent to where the first 2 games shouldn't have gone past halftime.
     
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  20. tante

    tante Club Member Club Member

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    does the team look better last year or this year? what team was better 2010 or 2012?
     
  21. Buffnik

    Buffnik Real name isn't Nik Club Member Junta Member

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    I support these coaches and players. I show up. I give my money. I spend a ton of time trying to increase support through digital media. Hell, I did my best to rally folks in the 2010 preseason to continue supporting the team and AD.

    I want nothing more than to be over-the-top positive Saturday night after a great performance in Fresno.

    But I refuse to pretend it's raining when someone's pissing on my leg. It's not a one-way street. The coaches and AD are paid a lot of money to be held accountable for poor performance. We fans can't be expected to only shower praise and open our wallets no matter what they do.
     
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  22. Ralphandler1

    Ralphandler1 Member

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    Clearly I must not understand.... not like I have played football ever, not like I have been a season ticket holder since 1986. You're right we have no identity right now..... we dont have the talent at the moment to do what we want. And please god stop comparing us to UCLA or others who look good with new coaches. There was just a tad more talent at those schools than we had. CU was literally at the bottom of the barrel for talent at the end of Hawk era. What do you expect the staff to do with 1 full recruiting season.... they still have most of their players that they didn't pick.

    Look if you want to fire JE great..... I think it would be a mistake cause you will NEVER get a big name in here if you do that. You flush this season and likely the next 3. There is not a coach alive who will walk into Folsom and win 6+ games with this exact team.
     
  23. Ralphandler1

    Ralphandler1 Member

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    I think this team looks about 10 times better top to bottom than they did last year. Few positions like QB they looks worse. But overall talent, speed, discipline is far better IMO
     
  24. Ralphandler1

    Ralphandler1 Member

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    That is a good question.... I think the mistakes are doing things like not allowing contracts on assistants. Not firing Hawk after 4 years when it was clear he would not survive. But no matter who they picked to come in last year they were not gonna be immediately successful. I blame them for things that led us to this situation for sure.
     
  25. Quattro

    Quattro Banned BANNED Club Member

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    UCLA may have more talent but we have more than Sac State and CSU, and we have looked awful against both of those teams. NO ONE is asking for six wins anymore, they're asking for good coaching, and we're not seeing it. The OL play sucks, RB play has been below average, QB play has sucked, and this team has no fire and want, and they're just going through the motions. Someone needs to motivate these guys. We have the easiest OOC schedule in the country this year and we're 0-2. The schedule doesn't get any easier. We are starring down a .50 cal barrel at a 0-12 or 1-11 season.
     
  26. Duff Man

    Duff Man Moderator Club Member Junta Member

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    This is where the disconnect is occurring...
     
  27. azbuff

    azbuff Club Member Club Member

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    I think a lot of posters' criticism of Embo is over the top, but KU fired Turner Gill after two seasons. And hired Charlie Weis. He may have been a terrible choice (we'll see), but you can't argue he isn't a big name.
     
  28. CVilleBuff

    CVilleBuff Club Member Club Member

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    "Please god stop comparing us to UCLA or others"...I'm sorry, could you show me where I did that in my previous two posts? For the record, though, Arizona was 2-7 in the Pac-12 last year (same as CU), and is now in the top 25. Meanwhile, you've yet to comprehend that no one here is demanding CU be in the top 25, let alone bowl eligible this season. All anyone demands is a SEMBLANCE of improvement in year 2 as Embree faces a drastically easier schedule. Well, guess what? We've now lost in humiliating fashion to, by far, the two weakest opponents on our schedule. That's not improvement. Yet again, I also stress to you that WE HAVE NO IDENTITY. That reflects poor coaching more than anything else. And you keep saying "let Embree bring in more recruits" --- take a long look at this class this year. It's not very good. In fact it's downright weak, and it's about to get a whole lot worse if we go 0-12 or 1-11.

    Everyone wants Embree to do well in the worst way, but we're now 3-12 under him and seemingly heading in the wrong direction (I didn't even know that was possible, but these first two games proved it). Sometimes you have to call things for what they are. Everyone here wants Embree to finish out the season, but if he goes 0-12 or 1-11, there is simply no way he will EVER turn this program around.

    And frankly very few coaches are going to care if Embree is let go after 2 seasons. I'm honestly not sure anyone in the coaching world even knows Jon Embree exists.
     
  29. tante

    tante Club Member Club Member

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    we are playing about 6 freshman and you think talent is 10 times better? We lost several guys that went to NFL training camps and you think everything is better? How in the hell did we lose to both CSU and Sac State?
     
  30. Swish

    Swish Half a bubble off Club Member

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    Handler I appreciate your passion but even with all the griping no one here has given up on the Buffs. Sick of poor performance yes, desire to vent and over analyze the problem yes, give up no.

    With all due respect if you really are sick of the complaining going on here about the Buffs perhaps this is a place you shouldn't be. At least until this crap storm blows over. Because while the members are not going to start jumping ship in droves they are going to complain.
     

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