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Recruiting really was bad under Hawkins...
- Thread starter BlackNGold
- Start date
Highlander27
Well-Known Member
Too much whining in here.
Our results have sucked on the field. Makes it harder to recruit key kids, see Erich Wilson. We'll lose our share if we can't show any improvement come November. That being said, I think this staff has taken a very proactive step with the kids we do have signed in preparing them for the worst. What's Embree's quote... "when you come, I want you to see what the program will be, not what it currently is." I think this is a genius line and while it won't work for all, I think he's building that credibility in the minds of these young recruits that they are needed here and have the opportunity to do something special in turning a program around.
Talent wise, I have no complaints at the positions we've garner recruits from. I'm going to lump Connor Wood in this class even though he's a X-fer. Picking up two potential program changing QB's in the same cycle is HUGE. I don't care for the negative folks that say, "He transferred from Texas, hard to believe he'll be REALLY good." The fact is the guy has a great video coming out from HS, Texas thought enough of him to offer him one of their select scholarships and he get maybe got beat out at the positing by a couple of other 5*/4* players at his position. The film doesn't lie though, he's a player and CU is a great opportunity for him to step up on the main stage and apply what he's learned from thus far. Is he by any chance a finished product? No. Neither was Luck his Sophomore year when he started, he was fortunate to be balanced by a great running game, something I know EB/Embree would love to have in Boulder. Factor in the great addition of Shane Dillon who will now be allowed to sit his first year and really get into college, put on some solid weight, get adjusted, we are setting ourselves up for success down the road in the Pac 12 conference. If you don't have a QB in this league, you are screwed. Just look at Cal the last few years. WSU. Oregon State. UCLA. No consistency at the position under center and you hang in the middle of the standings or less. Buff fans should be stoked just based on this position, this recruiting class.
Go in and factor Payne who looks like a great player in his own right, bringing the size and mentality we want at the position, along with Crower and things set up nicely at HB too. I think we would like to add another body here, especially with the loss of Wilson. HB is a tougher position to evaluate, easier to find people who can contribute. It's one of the few positions where Hawkins didn't leave us completely bare, with Stewart and TJ. Both guys had no offers really but have produced well on the field. I like the early makeup of this group.
WR is where this class has truly started to shine IMO. I think Thomas x 2, Williams are all going to be players for us. Jeff is going to be the traditional tall possession WR we've seen at CU during the early GB days except his skills blow out what we've had before. Guy has serious vertical and playmaking ability. Gerald is going to be moving around from the outside, to the slot and I think we do some gadget style plays with him and DD Goodson. They'll fill our "Percy Harvin" role if you will. Williams looks like a potentially great slot type receiver who can morph into a Wes Welker type and catch a lot of passes underneath. Both he and Gerald T. have great speed which can lift the coverage and keep defenses honest. That is something most are taking for granted this year. Teams don't respect Hansen throwing the ball, rightfully so. We're also a drastically difference offense without P-Rich's speed on the field. Stanford, UW, ASU, Oregon have all had the same approach to playing us.... load 8 in the box, run blitz CU so they are playing in 2nd/3rd and longs. If they decide to throw early, those 8 in the box are going to clog the passing lanes and Hansen's inaccuracy will result in incompletions or turnovers... which they have. You add more accuracy & better talent at the QB position and SPEED to our WR core, we've introduced some totally new elements to our offense and passing game we don't currently have. I think this is a two-fold deal: the higher efficiency with which they will work will only make the running game that much better/easier for our backs and linemen.
OL recruiting hasn't been the best but we're still somewhat early in the game. We're getting banged around by fans here because CO has some good kids in state, none of which have pledged CU. While it sucks to lose these guys, we seem to have some building depth at tackle right now, and some young guys loaded in at center where we could be alright. Guard is a troublesome position for us but I think that's where J. Irwin and Kough slide in. What have we seen so far on the OL? I see us adding a lot of guys that have better frames to add weight and are tough. There is no quick way onto the field for an offensive lineman. It takes a few years to mature and ween into starting for a BCS conference. None of our guys are being given this maturation process, instead they are being thrown into the fire. Combine that with some unsavory play from select seniors and the crowding of the box that we've seen this year, we're getting our ass handed to us. I think that consistency coaching the kids is going to help us. I think running the same system for more than a year is going to help us. Bakh, Harris, Dannewitz, Nembot, Mustoe will all grow during this offseason and get better moving into next season. Factor that in with some of the other young guys we have on the line, and some of the new kids we are bringing in, we'll slowly start getting better at these positions but it's going to take time. Injuries have not helped us either. The coaches really need to close out strong here like they did with Asiata last recruiting cycle, and get a few more big bodies.
This post is getting longer than I thought but DL recruiting right now looks very good to me. I know we want to add a few more bodies and we're in on some good looking players. Will they take the jump? Depends on how the coaches can hook them. Solis is good enough to be playing at a number of great schools on the west coast but he's been devoutly loyal to us through it all. We just have to find the right kids who buy into our program/Embree like he did and keep adding. It would be very helpful if we picked a defense and stuck to it. Our we a 3-4, 4-3? I think we want to run a 3-4 but it's still early and need more depth. Solis and Hennington look like good/great players for the 3-4. I think Z. Webb has a great body for the NT position but needs a lot of technique work. Final additions from a guy like Samson K., Solis' teammate Stewart or Tupou would give us some solid big bodies to start building around.
LB has been a sore spot for me. We need more attention paid here. I'm not freaked out by it because Cabral has always done well recruiting the spot. We just don't seem to have much in the pipeline. I don't think we have a handle on the situation like the coaches do either. In my mind Katoa and Harlos are S's but every Embree comment which comes out about them calls them LB's. Maybe the need is not as pressing as we think.
I'm not as worried about DB as some are. I think we have some young players at these positions. Washington is going to be a player, just needs to coordinator that blazing speed of his and take better angles. Henderson has been better than anybody could have projected this year. Just has to get more instinctual, improve his speed a bit in the offseason and get stronger. The guy could be a 4 year starter for us. Haven't seen many of those at CU. Personally, i'm fine with bringing athletes turned CB's into the program. The buffs need a large injection of speed in the program. If that's the best way to do it, fine. Coaches will need to make their money off growing these players and will live and die by that. Brown has shown to be up to task on this front before.
Overall, I like some of the things we are doing. I've never been enamored with stars and *class rankings*. Yes, its' fun for the fans to beat their chest when these things come out but it's largely an arbitrary number predicted most likely by a guy who's never even played the game before. I don't put much stock in it. I trust the coaches have an eye for talent, what will fit their system, and who they want in the program from a contribution standpoint. It's going to take some time. We have D and F rated players right now with a couple good one's, like P-Rich to name one off the top of my head. We need to slowly turn those D's and F's into C's and B rated rated players through coaching, recruiting, and attrition. In the mean-time sprinkle in a few game breakers who class and you have an opportunity to win some games and be the program it should be. This won't happen overnight and with the five game slate we're on vs. Stanford/UW/Oregon/ASU & SC, it seems like forever as we get our face bashed in. These things will take time. Hopefully we can close on some win's down the stretch and the coaches can truly focus on recruiting this offseason in lieu of having other responsibilities.
Our results have sucked on the field. Makes it harder to recruit key kids, see Erich Wilson. We'll lose our share if we can't show any improvement come November. That being said, I think this staff has taken a very proactive step with the kids we do have signed in preparing them for the worst. What's Embree's quote... "when you come, I want you to see what the program will be, not what it currently is." I think this is a genius line and while it won't work for all, I think he's building that credibility in the minds of these young recruits that they are needed here and have the opportunity to do something special in turning a program around.
Talent wise, I have no complaints at the positions we've garner recruits from. I'm going to lump Connor Wood in this class even though he's a X-fer. Picking up two potential program changing QB's in the same cycle is HUGE. I don't care for the negative folks that say, "He transferred from Texas, hard to believe he'll be REALLY good." The fact is the guy has a great video coming out from HS, Texas thought enough of him to offer him one of their select scholarships and he get maybe got beat out at the positing by a couple of other 5*/4* players at his position. The film doesn't lie though, he's a player and CU is a great opportunity for him to step up on the main stage and apply what he's learned from thus far. Is he by any chance a finished product? No. Neither was Luck his Sophomore year when he started, he was fortunate to be balanced by a great running game, something I know EB/Embree would love to have in Boulder. Factor in the great addition of Shane Dillon who will now be allowed to sit his first year and really get into college, put on some solid weight, get adjusted, we are setting ourselves up for success down the road in the Pac 12 conference. If you don't have a QB in this league, you are screwed. Just look at Cal the last few years. WSU. Oregon State. UCLA. No consistency at the position under center and you hang in the middle of the standings or less. Buff fans should be stoked just based on this position, this recruiting class.
Go in and factor Payne who looks like a great player in his own right, bringing the size and mentality we want at the position, along with Crower and things set up nicely at HB too. I think we would like to add another body here, especially with the loss of Wilson. HB is a tougher position to evaluate, easier to find people who can contribute. It's one of the few positions where Hawkins didn't leave us completely bare, with Stewart and TJ. Both guys had no offers really but have produced well on the field. I like the early makeup of this group.
WR is where this class has truly started to shine IMO. I think Thomas x 2, Williams are all going to be players for us. Jeff is going to be the traditional tall possession WR we've seen at CU during the early GB days except his skills blow out what we've had before. Guy has serious vertical and playmaking ability. Gerald is going to be moving around from the outside, to the slot and I think we do some gadget style plays with him and DD Goodson. They'll fill our "Percy Harvin" role if you will. Williams looks like a potentially great slot type receiver who can morph into a Wes Welker type and catch a lot of passes underneath. Both he and Gerald T. have great speed which can lift the coverage and keep defenses honest. That is something most are taking for granted this year. Teams don't respect Hansen throwing the ball, rightfully so. We're also a drastically difference offense without P-Rich's speed on the field. Stanford, UW, ASU, Oregon have all had the same approach to playing us.... load 8 in the box, run blitz CU so they are playing in 2nd/3rd and longs. If they decide to throw early, those 8 in the box are going to clog the passing lanes and Hansen's inaccuracy will result in incompletions or turnovers... which they have. You add more accuracy & better talent at the QB position and SPEED to our WR core, we've introduced some totally new elements to our offense and passing game we don't currently have. I think this is a two-fold deal: the higher efficiency with which they will work will only make the running game that much better/easier for our backs and linemen.
OL recruiting hasn't been the best but we're still somewhat early in the game. We're getting banged around by fans here because CO has some good kids in state, none of which have pledged CU. While it sucks to lose these guys, we seem to have some building depth at tackle right now, and some young guys loaded in at center where we could be alright. Guard is a troublesome position for us but I think that's where J. Irwin and Kough slide in. What have we seen so far on the OL? I see us adding a lot of guys that have better frames to add weight and are tough. There is no quick way onto the field for an offensive lineman. It takes a few years to mature and ween into starting for a BCS conference. None of our guys are being given this maturation process, instead they are being thrown into the fire. Combine that with some unsavory play from select seniors and the crowding of the box that we've seen this year, we're getting our ass handed to us. I think that consistency coaching the kids is going to help us. I think running the same system for more than a year is going to help us. Bakh, Harris, Dannewitz, Nembot, Mustoe will all grow during this offseason and get better moving into next season. Factor that in with some of the other young guys we have on the line, and some of the new kids we are bringing in, we'll slowly start getting better at these positions but it's going to take time. Injuries have not helped us either. The coaches really need to close out strong here like they did with Asiata last recruiting cycle, and get a few more big bodies.
This post is getting longer than I thought but DL recruiting right now looks very good to me. I know we want to add a few more bodies and we're in on some good looking players. Will they take the jump? Depends on how the coaches can hook them. Solis is good enough to be playing at a number of great schools on the west coast but he's been devoutly loyal to us through it all. We just have to find the right kids who buy into our program/Embree like he did and keep adding. It would be very helpful if we picked a defense and stuck to it. Our we a 3-4, 4-3? I think we want to run a 3-4 but it's still early and need more depth. Solis and Hennington look like good/great players for the 3-4. I think Z. Webb has a great body for the NT position but needs a lot of technique work. Final additions from a guy like Samson K., Solis' teammate Stewart or Tupou would give us some solid big bodies to start building around.
LB has been a sore spot for me. We need more attention paid here. I'm not freaked out by it because Cabral has always done well recruiting the spot. We just don't seem to have much in the pipeline. I don't think we have a handle on the situation like the coaches do either. In my mind Katoa and Harlos are S's but every Embree comment which comes out about them calls them LB's. Maybe the need is not as pressing as we think.
I'm not as worried about DB as some are. I think we have some young players at these positions. Washington is going to be a player, just needs to coordinator that blazing speed of his and take better angles. Henderson has been better than anybody could have projected this year. Just has to get more instinctual, improve his speed a bit in the offseason and get stronger. The guy could be a 4 year starter for us. Haven't seen many of those at CU. Personally, i'm fine with bringing athletes turned CB's into the program. The buffs need a large injection of speed in the program. If that's the best way to do it, fine. Coaches will need to make their money off growing these players and will live and die by that. Brown has shown to be up to task on this front before.
Overall, I like some of the things we are doing. I've never been enamored with stars and *class rankings*. Yes, its' fun for the fans to beat their chest when these things come out but it's largely an arbitrary number predicted most likely by a guy who's never even played the game before. I don't put much stock in it. I trust the coaches have an eye for talent, what will fit their system, and who they want in the program from a contribution standpoint. It's going to take some time. We have D and F rated players right now with a couple good one's, like P-Rich to name one off the top of my head. We need to slowly turn those D's and F's into C's and B rated rated players through coaching, recruiting, and attrition. In the mean-time sprinkle in a few game breakers who class and you have an opportunity to win some games and be the program it should be. This won't happen overnight and with the five game slate we're on vs. Stanford/UW/Oregon/ASU & SC, it seems like forever as we get our face bashed in. These things will take time. Hopefully we can close on some win's down the stretch and the coaches can truly focus on recruiting this offseason in lieu of having other responsibilities.
I agree with Embree's quote... "when you come, I want you to see what the program will be, not what it currently is."
The problem is kids want to win and want to be part of a winning program - kids will sit the bench at a winning school before they waste 4 years trying to build a program... (most) kids I should say, there are exceptions in everything. Kids are smart enough to know that 4 years will go by quickly and if they have been associated with a losing program, it will not help them get to the next level. Same as high school - if your kid is playing at a losing school they do not get recruited like that same kid playing for state titles...
The problem is kids want to win and want to be part of a winning program - kids will sit the bench at a winning school before they waste 4 years trying to build a program... (most) kids I should say, there are exceptions in everything. Kids are smart enough to know that 4 years will go by quickly and if they have been associated with a losing program, it will not help them get to the next level. Same as high school - if your kid is playing at a losing school they do not get recruited like that same kid playing for state titles...
Of course the other side of that argument is that a three year starter at a building school has a better chance than a guy who never gets into the line-up at a perennial winner, likely a factor in Wood transfering into here.
How many guys during the Pete Carroll era at U$C never got off the bench who would have started and developed elsewhere? Same thing applies to the benches at LSU and Bama' this year. Their benches could potentially be the core of a top 25 team elsewhere.
No they're not. To a 19 year old, 4 or 5 years is an eternity.
Walter White
Member
Embree recently made some unfortunate comments after losing some recruiting battles, saying how kids are “jersey chasers” or something like that. Complaining that some kids just collect offers and just commit to the “hot team”. Saying that he only wants kids who want to play for CU.
These are not encouraging words. That’s a bad attitude. You can’t be naive in this game. This is big boy football. It’s your job to sell them, and frankly, what you are doing is no different than what the players are doing. You weigh your options and go with what you think is the best. JE is going to end up with dudes with lots of passion for CU…because CU is the only school that offered.
These are not encouraging words. That’s a bad attitude. You can’t be naive in this game. This is big boy football. It’s your job to sell them, and frankly, what you are doing is no different than what the players are doing. You weigh your options and go with what you think is the best. JE is going to end up with dudes with lots of passion for CU…because CU is the only school that offered.
That's the truth though. 18 year olds love Oregons jerseys and they're the hot team right now. Embree has been at this a while and is considered one of the top recruiters in the nation, we aren't going to end up with kids where CU is there only offer.
I'm rich bitch!
Walter White
Member
I know he is right, but he should not be complaining about it in public. That's the reality he has to deal with.
Walter White
Member
Show me the money.
You gotta link for this or are you just making **** up?
I'm sure Embo told him in private at their weekly meeting together.
well, duh(k)
Forgot to use the sarcasm font. My bad. Won't happen again.
What if you don't have money to show? Instead of begging kids to come play for the buffs even though we suck and have little money (a very tough sell) maybe Ebree is flipping it around and sending a message to all the recruits by telling some kids "you're not good enough to be a part of this team, to be a part of something special." The tactic may turn some kids off but I bet there are more than a few who see that as a challenge and it makes them want to be buffs even more. Not a bad sales pitch if Embo can pull it off.
Let's hope this isn't his tactic