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some stats (selectively excerpted) about our youth...

Discussion in 'Colorado Football Message Board' started by Liver, Sep 12, 2012.

  1. Liver

    Liver modded mod Club Member Junta Member

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    we've got 15 true frosh in the 2-deep. texas has 15, tcu has 15, usc has 11.

    we've 8 seniors. bama has 9, wiscy has 9, clemson has 11.

    http://www.cubuffs.com/fls/600/gameday/fsu12/cunotes.pdf?DB_OEM_ID=600

    i am fully aware that these schools had more base talent, by far, to work with. but, is it really too much to ask for our inexperienced team (that, even with the gaps above, has higher ranked athletes, across the board than either sac st or csu) to beat the bottom feeders from a non-qualifying conference and a lower division?

    really?

    no one sane is calling for the immediate termination of the staff-- that would never happen here 2 games into a season, but folks best realize that this staff is quite rightfully under the microscope and needs to perform better THIS YEAR. blaming it all on youth and inexperience and a prior culture is lame. i don't hear the coaches doing that. i hear embree and the staff OWNING the failure and vowing to work to improve it.

    we can debate about whether they will succeed in getting this turned around, but let's not pretend that it is all circumstances beyond their control.

    a level-headed conversation about what has gone wrong and what can be improved is not a bad thing.
     
  2. dply

    dply Doble hoja Club Member

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  3. buff4eva

    buff4eva New Member

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    Liver you are absolutely right. The young have played pretty well it is the QB and O-line play that has us in the tanker.
     
  4. tante

    tante Club Member Club Member

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    Bryant-Denny Stadium holds 101,821
    Camp Randall Stadium holds 80,321
    Memorial Coliseum holds 93,607
    Folsom Field holds 53,613
    ------>YOU
     
  5. Darth Snow

    Darth Snow Hawaiian Buffalo Club Member Junta Member

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    more stats: Not a single starting OL graded out better against sac state than they did against CSU. Good lord.
     
  6. J.R. Ewing

    J.R. Ewing Club Member Club Member

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    :wow: That unit has been shockingly bad. So much for Embo crediting their improvement for Powell's yards.
     
  7. BuffaloChuck

    BuffaloChuck Member

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    Absolutely. If they were suffering "hang-over" injuries from a tough rival game, I could understand except our 3rd and 4th stringers should be better than Sac State. And those early season aches and pains might be more telling about a coaching staff's S&C program. So would being outmanned by a city college squad from the 2nd Qtr on.

    Well, we have high hopes for this Saturday's game. I'm sure we'll see this staff's best product.
     
  8. SBG

    SBG Formerly known as EFNMB Club Member Junta Member

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    The S&C program is fine. That's not the problem, the problem is that this team is soft mentally and the coaches are being out-schemed.
     
  9. Uncle Ken

    Uncle Ken Orr no morr Club Member

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    Liver (YOU!) I know that you qualify your stats as "selective" but they are a little too selective.

    Yes, Texas has a lot of True Frosh. Fine, but are they balanced with a lot of returning seniors? A mass of inexperience is bad. Inexperience with present senior leadership is a different story. Same questions apply to TCU and USC. How is that inexperience balanced?

    We've got 8 seniors? Where? Kasa? Webb? That's apples and oranges to Bama's seniors. Polks is on the sidelines...etc...

    I'm not apologizing for the performance of our team. I just didn't think your comparisons were apt.
     
  10. BuffUp

    BuffUp W.T.T.F. Club Member

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    Liver - nice assessment...and I agree CU has been using the lack of recruiting and youth for an excuse for to long (before Embree and company). At some point it is up to the players to step up and force their will on the opposing players. I agree with all the statements about our players being soft physically and mentally, once again that is on the players as individuals. The coaches are responsible for preparing the players mentally and putting them in winnable situations and that is where this crew is dropping the ball. I am also a big believer in coaches that give pregame speeches that will motivate and make you want to run through a wall. Not sure if this is happening?? Embree seems a little passive in his speeches I have heard, but those are geared for the media??
     
  11. BlackNGold

    BlackNGold Club Member Club Member

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    It is fine to use stats but the problem is more than just the lack of Seniors. I noticed no team had the double whammy of a lot of true freshmen playing along with less than 10 seniors. Add the following information to the equation - those teams have all been winning over the past several years so their teams know how to win, they all have recruited better than CU has on a consistent basis.

    I am not excusing losing two games we should of won but right now we are trying to win a high stakes game with an exceptionally bad hand.
     
  12. Darth Snow

    Darth Snow Hawaiian Buffalo Club Member Junta Member

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    Ya. The upperclass production those programs are getting is not comparable to us.

    Starting Seniors:

    Polk - Hurt, has barely played
    Pericak - doing great
    Kasa - first year at TE, minimal contributor
    Major - big contributor, still not himself, limited speed wise.
    Rippy - big contributor, not himself, hurt, has barely played.
    And fin.

    That's it. So, for the first three games, we have only two real seniors playing snaps (don't count Kasa): Major and Pericak. :wow:
     
  13. BlackNGold

    BlackNGold Club Member Club Member

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    Do we have a Senior other than Kasa playing much on offense?
     
  14. Darth Snow

    Darth Snow Hawaiian Buffalo Club Member Junta Member

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    Only other seniors playing on offense are Dannewitz (spot duty against SacSt) and Ebner (spot WR duty)
     
  15. tante

    tante Club Member Club Member

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    juniors are considered upperclassmen too.
     
  16. Darth Snow

    Darth Snow Hawaiian Buffalo Club Member Junta Member

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    Yup. I think there are 10 or less in the two deep.
     
  17. Chromeburn

    Chromeburn Member

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    Those schools recruits > embree's recruits
    Those schools seniors > Hawkin's seniors

    When I see the buffs freshmen up close they look like a bunch of baby faced kids. When I see Alabama's freshmen they look like a bunch of man childs. Don't compare any stats between those schools and the buffs. It's apples and oranges.
     
  18. Quattro

    Quattro Banned BANNED Club Member

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    And when I see out schedule I see the easiest schedule in the country OOC wise and we're 0-2. Enough excuses.
     
  19. J.R. Ewing

    J.R. Ewing Club Member Club Member

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    To sum things up. Embree has plenty of excuses for this team sucking, but no excuses for it sucking this badly.
     
    Darth Snow likes this.
  20. leftybuff

    leftybuff Iconoclast Club Member

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    If there were a contest to define the problems with the Buffs in 21 words or less, this post wins going away....
     
  21. MtnBuff

    MtnBuff Not allowed in Barzil 2 Club Member

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    What is outstanding in this situation, and it doesn't fit into a stat sheer but is a real difference, is the utter lack of leadership that we receive from our seniors. Who do we have that steps up and changes attitude on the field? Who do we have that could even seriously consider holding teammates on the field accountable.


    Now you can hold Embree at least partially accountable for this because leadership is developed but the raw material is also lacking. As mentioned before for seniors Polk would be the best bet but is hurt. Major and Rippy are both recovering from injuries, Perichek (sp) is solid but doesn't seem to assert himself in this area.

    Offense is a black hole with virtually nobody who qualifies.


    We can also look at the lack of leadership from the standpoint of leaders by example. Who on the team has stepped up and made a gamechanging play. We aren't getting big turnovers, we aren't getting big openfield tackles or tackles for loss. On offense who is making the gamechanging block, the move that turns a play into a big gainers.

    Part of our problem is coaching decisions, a bigger part is simple lack of talent. I think overall the biggest issue of all is lack of leadership and a lack of winning attitude. If Embree is going to succeed this is going to be the hardest thing to turn around. Winning programs expect to win and find ways to do it, losing programs expect to lose and it happens as well.
     
  22. Creebuzz

    Creebuzz Club Member Club Member

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    Ironically, this year's seniors should have been 5th year players from Hawkins only top 25 class (2008) when Givens, Darrell Scott, Max Tuioti-Mariner, Lynn Katoa, Ryan Wallace, Major, Rippy, and Polk all signed with the Buffs. Of course, not all would have redshirted, but the whiff on several players in this class hurt, especially the two highly touted offensive linemen.
     
  23. White_Rabbit

    White_Rabbit Club Member Club Member

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    "If you have everyone back from a team that lost ten games, experience isn't too important."
     
  24. SJBuff

    SJBuff Club Member Club Member

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    Yes!!!
    This was the #1 thing that Embree focused on last year. He's had a whole year and a half (including spring '11) to change this attitude. That's a lot of time to get the kids to buy into your philosophy. I thought he was making progress on this last year too based on how we played late last season (even in some of the blow out games we had kids flying around and hitting hard) and I thought we turned the corner in the Utah game. It appears I was wrong because our buffs still appear to be as mentally fragile as we were last year.

    For all you Embree defenders: WE DON'T NEED BETTER ATHLETES TO CHANGE THE TEAM'S ATTITUDE. WE NEED BETTER COACHING! CSU changed their attitude in one spring. So did ASU and UCLA. Why does Embree need multiple seasons to change what a good coach can do in one offseason? (Maybe because he's not ready to coach at this level).
     
  25. MtnBuff

    MtnBuff Not allowed in Barzil 2 Club Member

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    I wouldn't jump on that bandwagon yet. After folding like a house of cards against NDSU, CSU looks like the same bunch of losers they have been for years. A lot of their own fans recognize it and are now talking 3 wins again.

    This however points out the terrible shape we are in attitudewise. In a battle of bad attitudes we gave CSU reason to believe. We failed to hit them at the LOS, failed to make plays when we had the chance, and they gladly took a game we gave them.

    I don't think you can always change that attitude in one year or even a couple. With that in mind I am very concerned about the severe backslide we have taken after winning 2 of the last 3 last year and having an off-season of hope.

    You may be very right though in that Embree and his staff have never been on the point before in terms of being responsible for leading and directing attitude. To make it worse the years they spent in the NFL actually hurts them more because guys who aren't at least reasonably motivated and possessing quality attitudes rarely make the NFL. Unless a guy is a star if he has a bad attitude you just cut him, not an option at the college level.
     

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