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Coach Summers is the Answer

Buffs4Win

New Member
to which coach should get fired before the season is over. It takes real "chops" to turn a mediocre defense with some talent into a defense that is reminiscent of Embree-vs-Fresno St -level-of-incompetence.

Coach Tucker said-- we thought in jest-- that he didn't want to make Luckett worse after switching to DB. Apparently, HCMT wasn't joking. Almost to a man, the defense was worse than last year.

The argument that this is a new coaching staff with a new scheme does not obviate Summer's responsibility to adequately diagnose, evaluate, prepare, and strategize with the current roster.

The fact that the LB coach said this week that the LB's needed at least a few more weeks to understand the defense was not understatement or coach speak. He must have anticipated the impending disaster.

For the moment, let's put aside the missed assignments and wrong alignments (such as one DB covering two WR's). I can understand that happening once in a first game. I cannot understand that happening almost every series until the fourth quarter.

It's obviously a poor scheme and personnel decisions to have ILBs like Van Diest and Landman attempting to cover RB's in space.

It's equally bad to play a soft zone coverage (with DB's 12 yards from the line of scrimmage) on third and five--especially when the opponents have been playing pitch and catch for an entire half.

At what point does a veteran DC say (after not forcing a single punt for 3 quarters) that we are going to abandon some complicated 77 cut scheme, and just play man against a less athletic and less talented team?

From what I saw, the defense didn't improve until well into the fourth quarter when CSU became one-dimensional from score pressure.

How in the world is CU going to be able to stop a skilled team with multiple threats beyond a single WR and RB and one-dimensional QB?

I fear Barnett is right that the failure in scheme and coaching cannot be fixed in a week or two. And if that's the case, this is looking like a 3 win season despite NFL talent at a number of spots.

Moreover, I think trading Drake for Brumbaugh was a significant and inexplicable downgrade in both coaching and recruiting. I hope Tucker doesn't wait two years to make coaching changes. I think there is enough evidence now to say Summers isn't the answer (or is the answer to which coach needs to be fired)

It would have been a better. saner, decision to take last year's defense and build on it, rather than start from scratch--with the same personnel. I don't see Summers recovering to make this even a mediocre defense. I hope I'm wrong.

After an objective argument has been made, let the personal attacks begin:
 

Shldr2Shldr

Club Member
Club Member
Uhhhh

This is Tucker's defense from UGA. Summer's just makes the play calls.

The defense performed much better in the 2nd half, only allowed a net 3pts (since they did scoop and score).

The 1st half was rough. I agree. Looked like they got a lot figured out. I am willing to give the new coaching staff more than a single game before I start calling for their head.
 

Buffs4Win

New Member
Yes, I understand it is UGA's defense. I question the wisdom of installing it this year--given that there is enough talent to get six or seven wins, and a full year of recruiting for the new scheme. But reasonable minds may disagree.

But the main argument is still the personnel and play calling. Tucker has said that he is a "hands off" coach who doesn't try to second guess the coordinators and position coaches. This was stated by the tv broadcasters, so maybe that's wrong... But if it is right, then it is Summer's responsibility for those decisions right?

And it went well beyond the first half. Throughout the third quarter, CSU was playing pitch and catch and driving at will. If it wasn't for Onu's and Maddox's brilliant playmaking, the game was very easily lost.

I'm not saying that HCMT should fire Summer's after one game. What I am saying is the problems in coaching and strategy appear systemic. So, I'm not sure that a game should be considered a single data point--and thus ignorable. I think it points to many decisions going back through fall and spring camps. Again, I hope I'm wrong and we hold the nubs to 30 points. But if they score 50 or 60, which i think is quite possible, will that demonstrate a systemic problem?
 

vinniew_11

Well-Known Member
Yes, I understand it is UGA's defense. I question the wisdom of installing it this year--given that there is enough talent to get six or seven wins, and a full year of recruiting for the new scheme. But reasonable minds may disagree.

But the main argument is still the personnel and play calling. Tucker has said that he is a "hands off" coach who doesn't try to second guess the coordinators and position coaches. This was stated by the tv broadcasters, so maybe that's wrong... But if it is right, then it is Summer's responsibility for those decisions right?

And it went well beyond the first half. Throughout the third quarter, CSU was playing pitch and catch and driving at will. If it wasn't for Onu's and Maddox's brilliant playmaking, the game was very easily lost.

I'm not saying that HCMT should fire Summer's after one game. What I am saying is the problems in coaching and strategy appear systemic. So, I'm not sure that a game should be considered a single data point--and thus ignorable. I think it points to many decisions going back through fall and spring camps. Again, I hope I'm wrong and we hold the nubs to 30 points. But if they score 50 or 60, which i think is quite possible, will that demonstrate a systemic problem?
It was literally the first live action they have seen outside of their own guys. We literally have no idea, good or bad, how this defense will be. Yes, there are depth issues. But to say, Summers is the cause for a poor first half performance and is the weak link, is in fact, weak.
 

DBT

Club Member
Club Member
to which coach should get fired before the season is over. It takes real "chops" to turn a mediocre defense with some talent into a defense that is reminiscent of Embree-vs-Fresno St -level-of-incompetence.

Coach Tucker said-- we thought in jest-- that he didn't want to make Luckett worse after switching to DB. Apparently, HCMT wasn't joking. Almost to a man, the defense was worse than last year.

The argument that this is a new coaching staff with a new scheme does not obviate Summer's responsibility to adequately diagnose, evaluate, prepare, and strategize with the current roster.

The fact that the LB coach said this week that the LB's needed at least a few more weeks to understand the defense was not understatement or coach speak. He must have anticipated the impending disaster.

For the moment, let's put aside the missed assignments and wrong alignments (such as one DB covering two WR's). I can understand that happening once in a first game. I cannot understand that happening almost every series until the fourth quarter.

It's obviously a poor scheme and personnel decisions to have ILBs like Van Diest and Landman attempting to cover RB's in space.

It's equally bad to play a soft zone coverage (with DB's 12 yards from the line of scrimmage) on third and five--especially when the opponents have been playing pitch and catch for an entire half.

At what point does a veteran DC say (after not forcing a single punt for 3 quarters) that we are going to abandon some complicated 77 cut scheme, and just play man against a less athletic and less talented team?

From what I saw, the defense didn't improve until well into the fourth quarter when CSU became one-dimensional from score pressure.

How in the world is CU going to be able to stop a skilled team with multiple threats beyond a single WR and RB and one-dimensional QB?

I fear Barnett is right that the failure in scheme and coaching cannot be fixed in a week or two. And if that's the case, this is looking like a 3 win season despite NFL talent at a number of spots.

Moreover, I think trading Drake for Brumbaugh was a significant and inexplicable downgrade in both coaching and recruiting. I hope Tucker doesn't wait two years to make coaching changes. I think there is enough evidence now to say Summers isn't the answer (or is the answer to which coach needs to be fired)

It would have been a better. saner, decision to take last year's defense and build on it, rather than start from scratch--with the same personnel. I don't see Summers recovering to make this even a mediocre defense. I hope I'm wrong.

After an objective argument has been made, let the personal attacks begin:
Strong debut! While I share some of your concerns I’m going to hold off on hitting the panic button.
 

Heywood

Your own, personal, Heywood
Club Member
to which coach should get fired before the season is over. It takes real "chops" to turn a mediocre defense with some talent into a defense that is reminiscent of Embree-vs-Fresno St -level-of-incompetence.

Coach Tucker said-- we thought in jest-- that he didn't want to make Luckett worse after switching to DB. Apparently, HCMT wasn't joking. Almost to a man, the defense was worse than last year.

The argument that this is a new coaching staff with a new scheme does not obviate Summer's responsibility to adequately diagnose, evaluate, prepare, and strategize with the current roster.

The fact that the LB coach said this week that the LB's needed at least a few more weeks to understand the defense was not understatement or coach speak. He must have anticipated the impending disaster.

For the moment, let's put aside the missed assignments and wrong alignments (such as one DB covering two WR's). I can understand that happening once in a first game. I cannot understand that happening almost every series until the fourth quarter.

It's obviously a poor scheme and personnel decisions to have ILBs like Van Diest and Landman attempting to cover RB's in space.

It's equally bad to play a soft zone coverage (with DB's 12 yards from the line of scrimmage) on third and five--especially when the opponents have been playing pitch and catch for an entire half.

At what point does a veteran DC say (after not forcing a single punt for 3 quarters) that we are going to abandon some complicated 77 cut scheme, and just play man against a less athletic and less talented team?

From what I saw, the defense didn't improve until well into the fourth quarter when CSU became one-dimensional from score pressure.

How in the world is CU going to be able to stop a skilled team with multiple threats beyond a single WR and RB and one-dimensional QB?

I fear Barnett is right that the failure in scheme and coaching cannot be fixed in a week or two. And if that's the case, this is looking like a 3 win season despite NFL talent at a number of spots.

Moreover, I think trading Drake for Brumbaugh was a significant and inexplicable downgrade in both coaching and recruiting. I hope Tucker doesn't wait two years to make coaching changes. I think there is enough evidence now to say Summers isn't the answer (or is the answer to which coach needs to be fired)

It would have been a better. saner, decision to take last year's defense and build on it, rather than start from scratch--with the same personnel. I don't see Summers recovering to make this even a mediocre defense. I hope I'm wrong.

After an objective argument has been made, let the personal attacks begin:
@MtnBuff this guy stole your keyboard. Are you gonna take that ****?
 

TSchekler

Club Member
Club Member
I’m not on the fire Summers train, but OP makes plenty of good points that shouldn’t be brushed off so easily. The second half looked better because of turnovers. Without them, our defense still wasn’t stopping them, though. It was well into the 4th quarter, when CU had forced them into being one dimensional, before their first punt.
 

sliderNcider

Hasta la Viska
Club Member
That's probably what you get when you inherit a an extremely poor DL and secondary. Even LB was questionable. One of our 2 starters (JVD) had barely played
 

buffaholic

Club Member
Club Member
They hired Tucker with one of the key points being that they could bring in a defense from Saban/Kirby and install the thing. If not in the spring/August period of year 1, then when? And what defense doesn't require a LB to cover a TE/RB in space? Last I checked, it's 11 v 11.
 

JMBuffs

Well-Known Member
So we're excusing the 4 turnovers as if they were not a product of our D?

There are some concerns for sure, but this should have been evident during the offseason as 3 players switched positions and a plethora of JC's came over.

It takes time to install, but the install is necessary. Took Coach Mac and GB time.
 

dpnoffs

Club Member
Club Member
So everyone agrees that players that have not played a game in 2- years and some playing their first college game should look like seasoned players. Nothing wrong with that
 

Bliff Cranch

Should be in the Fall of Hame
Club Member
Defensively, I saw three things Friday night: 1) Many LBs and secondary players out of position due to confusion - a natural consequence of a)limited time in system and practice sessions and b)these are 20yos; 2) thinking and over-thinking versus instinctual play caused by my first point; and 3) being out of position and confused caused a tendency to chase and react which forced arm tackling and frequent misses.

All coachable and correctable. Won’t get fixed in a week but I expect vast improvement versus the Nubs.
 

Bliff Cranch

Should be in the Fall of Hame
Club Member
A valid defensive concern is the DL. Hill had all day to throw. Not good. Now, I do think the pass rush was pretty vanilla. I didn’t see many (any?) stunting, etc so that too could be a consequence of a learning curve in the system. DL remains a big worry, nonetheless.
 

TSchekler

Club Member
Club Member
So we're excusing the 4 turnovers as if they were not a product of our D?

There are some concerns for sure, but this should have been evident during the offseason as 3 players switched positions and a plethora of JC's came over.

It takes time to install, but the install is necessary. Took Coach Mac and GB time.
Definitely have to give them credit for forcing 4 turnovers and capitalizing on them. Turnover margin is easily the best predictor of success in any given game.

My issue comes from the fact that CSU essentially moves the ball at will from start to finish and the only time our defense stopped them was with the turnovers. What happens if ****braska (or any other team) protects the ball better than CSU? Can our offense score on every single possession to keep up?

Again, my frustration comes from our players not being able to execute basic fundamentals of keeping contain, not communicating well, bad alignments, blown assignments, etc. They weren’t playing fast because they were thinking way too much on every play.
 

LaserDeathHawk

Club Member
Club Member
He was hired for this system but it seems the players don’t fit the system...or maybe we don’t know yet after one game with a brand new staff and young players
 

Uncle Ken

Orr no morr
Club Member
I'm gonna go full DBT here:

The defense as an entire unit looked suspect against what I believe is a bad offense on Friday night. Let's wait and see if that changes.
 

cnbuff410

Club Member
Club Member
Calling for coach fire is stupid, otherwise it's a solid post from OP. The performance of the defense in the first game is VERY concerning, there is just no other way to put it in
 

Big Jim

WTF?
Club Member
to which coach should get fired before the season is over. It takes real "chops" to turn a mediocre defense with some talent into a defense that is reminiscent of Embree-vs-Fresno St -level-of-incompetence.
There is hyperbole and then there is something way, way beyond hyperbole and then there is this hot take beyond that. Didnt bother to read anything after the opening paragraph.
 

CULifer

Well-Known Member
Can someone educated answer an honest question?: What adjustments exactly did you see made for the 2nd half? Any specific ones?
 

TSchekler

Club Member
Club Member
Can someone educated answer an honest question?: What adjustments exactly did you see made for the 2nd half? Any specific ones?
Much better emphasis on our OLBs keeping contain and covering in the flat. Fewer communication breakdowns. That’s about all I can specifically think of, but CSU still moves the ball on them.
 
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