Extend Bzdelik now?

[Buffnik]

One of my big issues with Patton was the lack of discipline, both on and off the court. Bzdelik inherited an absolute nightmare in terms of the academic situation (APR had just come into existence) and pending scholarship losses. But, Patton was able to recruit some very good players and had success that CU hadn't seen in almost 3 decades. Not a great coach, but a pretty good one and I think that Patton gets a raw deal from CU fans. Pretty decent 11 year run from him considering how bad CU was when he took over and the lack of support he had (no practice court, a CECC that hadn't had the court or locker room refurbished since it was built, no strength & conditioning coach for basketball, etc., etc.).

 

[Bisonic]

Why are you saying Hagan in terms of bball recruiting? Who did he help with?

No info from here. I was just reacting to the anti-Patton post above. I don't know any way that Hagan fits into the basketball picture. That struck me as odd.

And yes it's true - some of the guys he recruited really were on the radar, like Harrison and Pelle as you mention. Other guys he came out of nowhere to pull in.

I think it's worth noting for some of the younger CU BB fans that the first 5-6 years of Patton's career, the Buffs played really intense defense, which kept us in lot of games after Chauncey. He coached and they played with a LOT of fire, kinda like that Mizzou team we saw yesterday. Over time I think that faded.

On offense he really never developed an scheme that he could consistently fall back on when the wheels fell off. I think that had as much to do with his ultimate failure here as anything. He just didn't have that basketball pedigree that so many other coaches had.

Regardless of his weaknesses, he raised our expectations here. Then he didn't live up to the expectations that his own teams set. Some fans have zero perspective about that. I even believe Mike Bohn never really got that.

 

[Bisonic]

Do NOT extend Bz. I love coach, and I think he's gotten things going well. However, I hate this entire notion of extending coaches based on mediocre accomplishments, just to ensure they don't leave. Nothing is guaranteed - he can leave anytime he wants. Wait until the end of the year, and if this season showed very good progress, then yes. If we don't land a legit big, and the season ends sourly, then wait until after next season.

This is my feeling exactly. I can't recall when Bzdelik's contract is up but extend him before he goes into his last year IF things are looking promising. (I'm guessing he's under contract through the 11-12 season. So see how next season goes, then extend if it makes sense.)

I seriously doubt Bzdelik would put much pressure on this cash-strapped Athletic Department to extend him before then. At least I hope he wouldn't.

 

[GoldenBuff]

"I'm a big boy," he said. "I understand that the only thing that matters is winning. We can do all these wonderful nice things, but the only thing that matters is winning. And I've been honest with people in saying we've got to build to that point.


"I've told the administration, 'I might not be the right fit for you because I want to build this right, so that when it's right, it's rock solid and it's there forever.'

These two quotes from the post article say it all. If we need to extend him now to keep him here, then I'm all for it. This guy is the real deal. Whether you think that CU basketball was burned to the ground, we can all agree that coach is building this program the right way. He isn't done yet and there's a long way to go but I think we can all agree that he's on the right track. Also, from what he says above, he is actually committed to making this program better and leaving it better than he found it.

 

[Idot Buff]

These two quotes from the post article say it all. If we need to extend him now to keep him here, then I'm all for it. This guy is the real deal. Whether you think that CU basketball was burned to the ground, we can all agree that coach is building this program the right way. He isn't done yet and there's a long way to go but I think we can all agree that he's on the right track. Also, from what he says above, he is actually committed to making this program better and leaving it better than he found it.

Well said.....

 

[buffs04]

Basketball isn't football, it shouldn't take 5+ years to turn a program around. If CU hoops isn't better next year, it won't ever be under Bzdelik.

I don't buy the hype. Win games. We are at or near the bottom of the big 12. What has this man done to deserve an extension? Take Kansas to OT and lose? I don't care about almost wins.

Bottom line: win. He isn't doing it. Bzdelik is running a loser program.

 

[Sexton Hardcastle]

Basketball isn't football, it shouldn't take 5+ years to turn a program around. If CU hoops isn't better next year, it won't ever be under Bzdelik.

I don't buy the hype. Win games. We are at or near the bottom of the big 12. What has this man done to deserve an extension? Take Kansas to OT and lose? I don't care about almost wins.

Bottom line: win. He isn't doing it. Bzdelik is running a loser program.

:lol:

 

[buffs04]

I take it you don't agree. My choice of words may have been poor, but I still don't understand why people regard Bzdelik's work here as a job well done.

 

[sackman]

It's pretty damn frustrating to see flashes of brilliance (KU) followed up by turds in the punchbowl (Mizzou).

Objectively, it's clear that there is improvement in the basketball team. The problem is that the improvement hasn't been sufficient to show up in the W/L statistics.

 

[Hank]

Let me say first that it was time for Patton to move on.

With that said, many have said here that the goal for our basketball team should be a .500 record in conference with an occasional NCAA appearance. Well folks, that is exactly what Ricardo delivered. Not including his last year (because the decision not to bring him back had already been made), Ricardo delivered a 74-86 record in 10 seasons of Big 12 play. We had a winning conference record in 4 of those seasons.

Ricardo's coaching was frustrating, but he did deliver results. The means shouldn't matter. The man deserves more respect than most CU fans are willing to give.

 

[Hank]

On the other hand, I think that the Big 12 is a better basketball conference now than it was 10 years ago.

 

[Scotch]

No info from here. I was just reacting to the anti-Patton post above. I don't know any way that Hagan fits into the basketball picture. That struck me as odd.

And yes it's true - some of the guys he recruited really were on the radar, like Harrison and Pelle as you mention. Other guys he came out of nowhere to pull in.

I think it's worth noting for some of the younger CU BB fans that the first 5-6 years of Patton's career, the Buffs played really intense defense, which kept us in lot of games after Chauncey. He coached and they played with a LOT of fire, kinda like that Mizzou team we saw yesterday. Over time I think that faded.

On offense he really never developed an scheme that he could consistently fall back on when the wheels fell off. I think that had as much to do with his ultimate failure here as anything. He just didn't have that basketball pedigree that so many other coaches had.

Regardless of his weaknesses, he raised our expectations here. Then he didn't live up to the expectations that his own teams set. Some fans have zero perspective about that. I even believe Mike Bohn never really got that.

Let me say first that it was time for Patton to move on.

With that said, many have said here that the goal for our basketball team should be a .500 record in conference with an occasional NCAA appearance. Well folks, that is exactly what Ricardo delivered. Not including his last year (because the decision not to bring him back had already been made), Ricardo delivered a 74-86 record in 10 seasons of Big 12 play. We had a winning conference record in 4 of those seasons.

Ricardo's coaching was frustrating, but he did deliver results. The means shouldn't matter. The man deserves more respect than most CU fans are willing to give.

:nod: Yup.

 

[Darth Snow]

extend when he posts a better then .500 record. Until then, no more money sent his way.

 

[BlackNGold]

Jumping in here late. I have been going to CU games since Sox was the coach so I have some historical perspective.

1. ) On extending Bzdelik, I am opposed to it. He needs to show that he can get it done. I have concerns with some things on his philosophy but that is not relevant if he can win. Are we seriously talking about extending a coach who has not had a winning record, has not won a road game in conference in over 2 years, has finished in the bottom fourth of the Big 12 every year....I am astounded. When the team starts winning in crunch time I will be impressed, right now this team does not get it done at crunch time - some may be encouraged with close losses but seem to overlook some bad losses. You cannot win with everybody on your team being a 2 or 3. Our inability to win on the road is reminiscent of Joe Harrington and Tom Miller.

2.) It does sadden me how many fans are so quick to disparage Ricardo Patton - Ricardo was a good coach, not great but good. You don't have his record at CU and be a bad coach. Ricardo's team played hard and they played tough defense. Patton never received much support from the AD when he was here, no new facilities, etc. He went and recruited and sold the players on the school in spite of the limitations. Patton did more for CU basketball than had been done by his 3 predecessors...something that should get him a little more credit. If you want to know the type of person RP was ask Chauncey Billups, David Harrison, and some others. Sox Walseth was a big fan of Ricardo's who would go over and visit the retired coach.

3.) Assertion that Ricardo Patton burned this program to ground is ludicrous. He supposedly had one his best classes ever come into the program at the end, Bohn met with the Freshmen to tell them to hang in their until they got a new coach, who promptly ran them off. Four of those players are still playing Division 1 Ball unfortunately for CU Thorne is the only one with the Buffs. It was Bzdelik's decision to start over.

4.) The Big 8/Big 12 has been a tough Basketball conference for a long time. It is no tougher now than it was 10 years ago. Ten years ago KU, ISU, UT, Oklahoma State, Oklahoma all were top 25 teams and Missouri was also a Tourney Team. By the way CU beat both ranked ISU and Oklahoma that year - ISU was an elite 8 team.

 

[tante]

Jumping in here late. I have been going to CU games since Sox was the coach so I have some historical perspective.

1. ) On extending Bzdelik, I am opposed to it. He needs to show that he can get it done. I have concerns with some things on his philosophy but that is not relevant if he can win. Are we seriously talking about extending a coach who has not had a winning record, has not won a road game in conference in over 2 years, has finished in the bottom fourth of the Big 12 every year....I am astounded. When the team starts winning in crunch time I will be impressed, right now this team does not get it done at crunch time - some may be encouraged with close losses but seem to overlook some bad losses. You cannot win with everybody on your team being a 2 or 3. Our inability to win on the road is reminiscent of Joe Harrington and Tom Miller.

2.) It does sadden me how many fans are so quick to disparage Ricardo Patton - Ricardo was a good coach, not great but good. You don't have his record at CU and be a bad coach. Ricardo's team played hard and they played tough defense. Patton never received much support from the AD when he was here, no new facilities, etc. He went and recruited and sold the players on the school in spite of the limitations. Patton did more for CU basketball than had been done by his 3 predecessors...something that should get him a little more credit. If you want to know the type of person RP was ask Chauncey Billups, David Harrison, and some others. Sox Walseth was a big fan of Ricardo's who would go over and visit the retired coach.

3.) Assertion that Ricardo Patton burned this program to ground is ludicrous. He supposedly had one his best classes ever come into the program at the end, Bohn met with the Freshmen to tell them to hang in their until they got a new coach, who promptly ran them off. Four of those players are still playing Division 1 Ball unfortunately for CU Thorne is the only one with the Buffs. It was Bzdelik's decision to start over.

4.) The Big 8/Big 12 has been a tough Basketball conference for a long time. It is no tougher now than it was 10 years ago. Ten years ago KU, ISU, UT, Oklahoma State, Oklahoma all were top 25 teams and Missouri was also a Tourney Team. By the way CU beat both ranked ISU and Oklahoma that year - ISU was an elite 8 team.

1 - absolutely agree, lets see what he does next year first

2 - I think we are quick to criticize Ricardo because he was a terrible coach in his final year, we gave him 800k and he rewarded us with 7 wins. He absolutely was medicore his final few years at CU. We got killed by old dominion at home in the NIT tourney on a team with a bunch of seniors.

3 - it was his so-called best classes, I'm sure most people would disagree. Quick how many guys from his best class ever are playing at BCS schools - one Thorne. The class fizzled like his career.

4 - absolutely agree, RP gave us some great wins at home and we should commend him for that. I agree that he helped the program and at this time was our best coach in a long time, but it was time for him to go.

 

[BlackNGold]

1 - absolutely agree, lets see what he does next year first

2 - I think we are quick to criticize Ricardo because he was a terrible coach in his final year, we gave him 800k and he rewarded us with 7 wins. He absolutely was medicore his final few years at CU. We got killed by old dominion at home in the NIT tourney on a team with a bunch of seniors.

3 - it was his so-called best classes, I'm sure most people would disagree. Quick how many guys from his best class ever are playing at BCS schools - one Thorne. The class fizzled like his career.

4 - absolutely agree, RP gave us some great wins at home and we should commend him for that. I agree that he helped the program and at this time was our best coach in a long time, but it was time for him to go.

BCS is a football moniker not basketball. There are a lot of teams like Georgetown, Gonzaga, etc that don't even have football teams but are national powers in Basketball. Jeremy Williams and Silas Xavier could play for a lot of teams.

 

[UrbanaBuff]

I like Buzz. His teams play hard and have fought some solid teams right down to the end. You'd have never guessed that we finished 7th out of 8 teams in Maui, because they played great.

But we have to start converting some of those close ones into W's, like OU. What frustrates me though is the road-jinx and that the team tends to play to its competition. We've lost games this year that we should have had... CSU (!), Tulsa, Oregon St, Iowa St. We probably had equal or greater talent than these teams, yet all four were on the road, and all four were L's.