Discussion in 'University of Colorado Recruiting Archive' started by Jens1893, Jun 24, 2011.
Honestly, get the W's first.
The most painful punch to the guts was from Thurston. CU should never lose top prospects to Nebraska. NEVER. It just shouldn't happen.
Callahan would be the next most painful, IMO. We need to close the borders. We can't be losing Colorado talent to other schools. The way we have to succeed is to get the top 5-6 players out of Colorado every year, and then get players from California, Texas, Hawaii & beyond to fill in the rest of the class. Losing those two guys really, really hurts.
It's a severe blow, IMO. I think that unless this staff can flip one or both of these players, this class will have to be considered a disappointment. That's regardless of who else they get. We need to keep the Colorado players. That's imperative.
Only way to get big time recruits is to win games.
Nobody wants to play for a loser program, end of story.
Thurston and Cope-Fitzpatrick were the two who mattered. But they mattered a lot.
For perspective, here's where we are on June 24th:
QB - 1 (4* from CA)
RB - 1 (3* from TX)
WR - 1 (3* from TX)
DT - 1 (3* from CO)
LB - 1 (3* from CO)
Here's what I think our minimum needs are by position:
QB - 1
RB - 2
WR - 3
TE - 2
OT - 2
OG - 2
DT - 2
DE - 1
LB - 2
CB - 2
S - 1
That adds up to 20 and gives us 5 to play with plus one extra scholarship for every recruit who enrolls in January.
My main concern is at TE, where there simply aren't any more 4* prospects out there. We've got a better chance at flipping McNamara than Cope-Fitzpatrick, imo. After that, Caleb Smith is the best of the guys available (visited for our camp). Below that, there are a number of low to mid 3* types including Sean Irwin. Ian Taubler out of Fresno just committed to UCLA, so that's pretty much it for 3* or higher TEs available in the west. We're going to have to focus on some guys in Oklahoma and Texas.
Next, we're down to only a few top prospects at OT. We really need to flip either Callahan or Thurston. Pray for Walker Williams. If he came with Caleb from Washington, it would seriously change things. We also have to hope that we land Colby Cyburt. If there's a silver lining in the Cope-Fitzpatrick situation, it's that USC is pretty much full now and Cyburt didn't pick up an offer at their camp.
Other positions are still very much in play and I'm feeling find for late June. Hoping for a big time RB, WR and CB as guys who would contribute a lot early. Beyond that, I think we're ok.
This week doesn't mean ****. It's June, not February and there's still a season of football to be played.
The staff at Nebraska has been building a relationship with Thurston for years, CU, for months, none of what's happening is a surprise. It's going to take time for the staff to build relationships and get wins. Right now they have few relationships and zero wins.
How long has Callahan been talking to Grimes (The O-Line coach at Auburn)? Years.
Miles lost his shot while he played tiddly winks and Dillon took his spot.
And as much as I love Colorado, right now I'd pick Oregon over CU too if I was a relatively unbiassed kid like Baylis.
People are losing sight of the fact that this staff has 5 solid recruits on board right now, which is more this early than ever before. Two of whom are from Texas... why Texas? Because it's one of the few areas the staff has long term recruiting relationships built up. CU is also seeing more interest from east coast recruits than ever before... why? Where did Embree and Blacken just come from? Where are the majority of their current relationships? No one on this staff has spent significant time recruiting Colorado prior to their hiring. The staff can do it, it's just gonna take time.
No one likes seeing recruits chose other schools, but right now, RIGHT NOW, in June, with a new staff, other schools are going to come out on top in probably 9 out of 10 recruiting battles.
Pull a solid season and I wouldn't be surprised to see some of these instate kids come back into the fold.
Who is the sixth? I only see five.
So if they pull two 4* O-Lineman from out of state, this class is a disappointment because they didn't get Thurston and Callahan? That's the most ridiculous thing I think I've heard and there are a lot of fans saying a lot of ridiculous things right now. Talent is talent whether it comes from Colorado or anywhere else. Locking down the state is the most overrated fan rant in recruiting. Completely unnecessary when the majority of the talent needs to come from other states the majority of years anyway.
What two 4* linemen are left that CU has offered?
This doesn't jive with the quote Sacky added in Thurston's recruiting thread in which he said CU was the leader because he didn't know much about other schools.
I tend to agree, but I am a little concerned because CU seems to be getting beat out regularly with in state prospects. That is not a good sign. I like that they are going after highly regarded talent as opposed to the D II method (whatever that was). D II did pull some pdecent talent but some of his signings were head scratchers.
IMO, this year's class, if it falters, can be laid at the feet of Bohn. Keeping the village idot for an extra year set the program back two years. OTOH, Embo and staff salvaged the last class on short notice, I think if we sit back and let them do their jobs, we may be pleasnatly surprised come February 2012.
I remember BB (or someone reputable) saying in some other thread that there are so many OL this year that this year's 3 star guys could be some other year's 4 star guys. Too early to say the sky is falling there, at least.
I'm ready to start a lynch mob at Dan Hawkins' house right about now.
I don't know much about recruiting, but a couple things stand out to me as reasons it's not time to panic yet. As I understand it, the coaches are still pretty limited in the amount of off-campus contact they can have with recruits, correct? My sense is also that the success the coaches had with the last class had a lot to do with their ability to sell themselves and the programs during the in-home visits with the recruits and their parents. If Embree can't yet get in the homes and sell his vision of Colorado to the recruits and their parents, it's not too surprising that recruits aren't buying into what we have yet. I imagine things will start to pick up a lot when the rules allow Embree to get back out on the road and sell the program.
+1 Most logical post on this thread. People need to calm down. We had 5 recruits (really 3) in December of last year and look what happened. Its JUNE for god sake and we have 4 decent and one great recruit in Dillon. CU has had half a decade of losing games and facilities that can't compare with some of these other programs that have been winning lately. With that considered we are doing great. Take the buff colored glasses off, this isn't 1994, its 2011. We win games and the recruits will come.
Another point, most of the kids looking for scholly's right now were 11-12 years old the last time CU was even remotely considered a conference power (2005) and not even out of elementary school the last time they were a true national player (2001). For the most part their teenage years have been spent watching D II corkscrew the program into the ground. A lot of goodwill has to be built to do what needs to be done on and off the field. That will take time.
I definitely agree. It's definitely crappy that these kids went elsewhere, but it also sucks big time that there aren't really any big time prospects to fall back on. We whiffed hard on our top 4 at TE, a position I thought we would have very little problem selling kids on. Doesn't help that JCF was just here and glowing about his visit.
On the OL, I figured numbers were simply on our side. We have 4 in state kids that have 4* rankings and impressive offer lists, yet we're probably not going to get any of them. That's pathetic. I understand that local kids might not be overly high on CU right now, but Hawk was able to sell the in state kids on CU after the last few years of Barney. Hawk was a disaster too, but at least we weren't getting steamrolled 70-3 and having rape scandals going on. You would think the parents would be on our side in this thing now. If we can get Colby Cyburt and Walker Williams, I'll be pretty happy, but man Thurston and Callahan are going to be very good players.
There are still alot of good prospects uncommited.
People really need to stop gushing about the FIVE(!!!!!!!!!!!!) recruits in June. That should be expected. Here's the issue with in-state recruiting: we are not finishing second or even third in most cases, we are entirely outside the conversation. Something is very wrong with that picture.
If CU is doing "great," then most Pac-12 schools are off the charts.
Cyburt is going to be a key recruit going forward, as is Travis Averill. If we strike out on both, I am going to be really disappointed.
BTW, I think the odds that Callahan will be a Buff on signing day are 40/60.
Hopefully Auburn has a mediocre year which is pretty probable.
How can anyone expect us to have a fantastic recruiting season after the last five years of hell? No ****ing way. Give Jon and his staff a chance. This is a long reclamation project, and we need to be unbelievably patient. It is what it is.
Hell, Hawkins landed Ryan Miller after a 2-10 season. Are you telling me that we shouldn't expect Embree to out-recruit Hawkins? Thurston is just up the road - literally. JUST. UP. THE. ROAD. The kid can probably see the Flatirons from his house. He listed CU as his favorite just a couple months ago. I'm off the charts pissed. The more I think about it, the more pissed I get. I'm going to have to take an allbuffs break for a while. This has me thinking we hired the wrong guys.
As long as Embree pulls in a great class in 2015, it is all good.
I just hope we can land a top 75 class. That would be an incredible job by this staff.
I know nothing about Thurston, but I can imagine that if I was his age and watched the Buffs the last several years, I would be incredibly skeptical of where the program is going (because of the W/L record). Ryan bought into Danny's garbage that he was rebuilding a burned to the ground program...it sounded good at the time for all of us. But, Ryan had seen success with Buff football. The high schoolers today have not. Hey, I wish things were going better at this stage, but I think you need to take a reality check. This is going to be a long process.
When did Ryan Miller commit? Was it in the summer or after the season?
It starts right now though. We graduate a HUGE senior class after this season and if we cannot dramatically improve the recruiting this year, where does leave us? I am really starting to wonder why so many CU fans are willing to write off this recruiting class.
Would you expect to see things pick up once the season starts and see the product and see improvement every week?
I expect that will make a huge difference one way or the other. As it stands, we have unproven coaches at a program that hasn't done **** since current prospects were 12 years old. If we can prove that this is a program on the rise and that Embo & staff are getting it done, the perception changes to a program on the rise.
Frankly, it would have been easier for early recruiting results if we had hired a nationally known coach (like Hawkins was - highest winning % in the nation when he came here) or a coordinator from an elite program (such as McElwain at Alabama). I don't believe that would have been the best move for the program in the long term since we had to re-connect to our winning tradition before we could move forward, but the early returns would have likely been better on the recruiting trail.
When it's all said and done, I still expect a Top 35 recruiting class as a minimum standard for this class. Mark that, because I promise to stick by it and hold Ebree and staff accountable.
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