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Kronshage Twitter mistake

SpacemanSpiff said:
Got him, you and Lefty as representatives of the Voice of Reason!

The kid is 18. And to play the HotRack 100 questions game...Did he do something stupid. Yep. Did he do something criminal? Nope. Does he have a lot to learn about living life in a fishbowl? Yep. Did CU do due diligence in checking into his character during the recruiting process. Yep again. They obviously felt like he was a good player and a good kid when they offered him a scholly. My guess is that MM uses this a teaching opportunity for this young kid. Does he understand what he did, why it got publicity and why people are upset about it? Does he regret it? Does he want to use it to grow as a person? If Yuri can survive his Twitter firestorm, then Sam can too.

Oh, and thank God there wasn't Twitter, Facebook and YouTube when I was a kid! Luckily, most of my f-ups weren't published for the world to see.
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That's the truth. Allowing kids to make statements carved in internet stone was probably an idea destined for trouble.
 
Lefty, if Mac wants to keep him I'm fine with that, but here's where I disagree with you:

1) I don't subscribe to the notion that well he's just a kid and kids make mistakes, live and learn. 18 year olds to me are not kids, and he's certainly old enough to know right from wrong at this point. I did plenty of stupid things at his age and even older, but there were consequences beyond just a stern talking to. Maybe this is one lesson he learn the hard way.

2) I've said it before, but being given a full-ride scholarship is a privilege that not many people are fortunate enough to get and I think there should be a level of responsibility that goes along with it. Like it or not, football players should be held to a higher standard than other students because they are on scholarship and because they are a more visible representative of the school. I'm sure there is code of conduct language in his scholarship agreement that he just violated.

This will be an important teaching moment in his life no matter what happens with football, but to me this is about learning accountability - the things you do and say in life often have consequences and now he's going to have to own whatever happens to him.
 
I get the sense that these two young men know each other, perhaps from youth leagues or sport camps or somehow else. Yet, he traveled outside the acquaintance zone when he rode the twitter express.

The timing of it all is another facet. Coach newmac doesn't really have an AD to fall back on -- I think he's gonna have to handle this one alone. Ceal may distance herself from the situation by using the "interim" card.

It'll be interesting to see how this plays out.
 
HCMM said he honored all the Embry verbals because "It was the right thing to do". If he doesn't like this kid as a player, it's the perfect opportunity to let him go.

If he stays, this kid better have his head on a swivel during 9 on 7s.
 
HotRack said:
Think there's a lot more that rival recruiters can use to denigrate us more than if MikeMac decides to keep Kronshage around, like...

"Colorado went 1-11 last year, why do you want to go to that ****hole of a program." If rival programs are stooping to a high school junior saying something stupid to sway a recruit, then we're back to prominence, but I digress.

Look, my general "political" principle I strive to live by is don't be an asshole to others. Do I live up to it all the time? No. I have my moments. But I am one who believes in second chances. For all we know, this is Sam's first **** up. Is it pretty blatant? By many perceptions, **** yeah it is. But does that mean the kid is a complete waste of space? No, it doesn't.

In my 17 years in the Navy, I've seen stupid **** like this happen all the time. I've had to step into the middle of and break up fights between the engine room lower level and engine room forward watch on a Trident submarine while on my midwatch tour because one called the other a racial slur of some sort. Did I immediately write up the kids and take them to mast? No. I didn't. Should I have by the regs of the UCMJ? Yes, I should have. Did I take a few extra moments on the tour to dress them down call them both out for being assholes to their entire crew because the dumbass fight they were having risked the lives of 150 other people/shipmates? You bet I did. Was there a problem in my division again between those two? Nope. Did both go on to successful Naval careers? Yep. What would have happened to those kids if I didn't take the time to calm things down and instead chose to write them up and take them to the green table? Don't know, a lot of people have come back from being busted in rank and losing pay, but it's nice to know that in that one instance BOTH individuals learned from their mistakes and moved on to become great sailors.

And guess what? These kids were the same age Kronshage is now. Unfortunately, kids at that age are prone to be assholes to each other. I know I was an asshole at that age. And I think if all of us look inside we all know we were assholes in our own way to others as well.

Rambling point I'm trying to make is all of us "35" year olds I think have forgotten our lives as the 17/18 year old asshole and neglect to think what sort of greater asshole we may have turned out to be if someone hadn't come along and told us what an asshole we were being and given us that second chance.

Again, I will support MM in the decision, but for us previous assholes to all of a sudden take the "educated" turn due to "enlightenment" received in the lily white confines of CU-Boulder are fooling ourselves with the immediate condemnation of a 17 year old kid here.
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Repped here as well.

Nobody is saying that what he did is okay, is acceptable, or should be ignored or passed by.

What we have to keep in mind is that this is a kid (not a 35 year old) who said something stupid in the moment on a twitter account. It also isn't the first time he has said done something stupid there. He also recognized his error and pulled it and appologized. Had this been anybody other than a kid who is in the public eye because he is a football player his consequences for the action other than catching some grief would be absolutely zero.

Instead we have people who want to act like he physically attacked an innocent bystander, broke out windows and did property damage, put drugs in some girls drink and posted her nude photos, put on klan robes and marched in the streets. Yes what he did was wrong but in the context of being 18 yo it was much more stupid than harmful. This in itself is not a reason to change his life forever.

Now if it turns out that he does have some sort of ingrained character flaw that can't be changed then let him pay the consequences for that but nobody here has any idea about where the stupidity comes from since we don't know him personally. This is a decision that has to be left to M2 and his staff and I am more than willing to trust their judgement until such time as that judgement is shown to be flawed.

I also hate to say this, but in this case tini' is a lot closer to the culture of the age group that spawned this than any of the rest of us. He shouldn't have the ultimate say on the outcome but his input is valuable in terms of putting things in context. Peer expectations are much different depending on your age group and who you associate with. If I had posted something like this on a twitter account I could at minimum expect to be called on the carpet and potentially lose my job. If one of my students posted the same thing he might be looking at a couple of days out of school (mostly to make the school feel like it did something) and a significant amount of re-education and clarified expectations, all the records of which would never be publicly available to anyone outside of the school and would basically disappear on graduation as the records get purged.
 
Obviously a mistake, but he did apologize. MM should talk to him and see where his head is at and then take appropriate action. Suggesting that this is an unrecoverable comment is ridiculous, IMHO.
 
SINKRATZ said:
Lefty, if Mac wants to keep him I'm fine with that, but here's where I disagree with you:

1) I don't subscribe to the notion that well he's just a kid and kids make mistakes, live and learn. 18 year olds to me are not kids, and he's certainly old enough to know right from wrong at this point. I did plenty of stupid things at his age and even older, but there were consequences beyond just a stern talking to. Maybe this is one lesson he learn the hard way.

2) I've said it before, but being given a full-ride scholarship is a privilege that not many people are fortunate enough to get and I think there should be a level of responsibility that goes along with it. Like it or not, football players should be held to a higher standard than other students because they are on scholarship and because they are a more visible representative of the school. I'm sure there is code of conduct language in his scholarship agreement that he just violated.

This will be an important teaching moment in his life no matter what happens with football, but to me this is about learning accountability - the things you do and say in life often have consequences and now he's going to have to own whatever happens to him.
Click to expand...
Fair enough. I will say this. If my son said something like that, there would be hell to pay. You don't go out of your way to say things like that. Maybe in a moment of extreme provocation, but I really cannot think of a time where using the word would be helpful. I can see it being used between friends, been there done that, but it was clearly understood by my friend and I. Sort of like how some call each other asshole here on AB. There is even an emoticon for it. OTOH, if I don't know you and you call me an asshole while garing at me, we're very likely to have a problem.

What strikes me as foolish is that the word, apparently no matter the context, is grounds for severe consequences like jerkng a scholly. That seems as stupid to me as any zero tolerance policy. Turn off the reasoning skills and mechanically apply a rule. That is how 2d graders get sent home from school because they brought a plastic knife with their lunch and violated the "weapon free zone".

In the grand scheme of things, if Kronshage was trying to insult or belittle the other kid, which is about the only conclusion one can draw unless the two are tight, he was wrong and should get his consequnece. But in the grand scheme of things is it that big of a deal? Not to me. There are far bigger issues out there to worry about. You can likely work with him and cure the problem without throwing him to the wolves. JMO.
 
MtnBuff said:
I also hate to say this, but in this case tini' is a lot closer to the culture of the age group that spawned this than any of the rest of us. He shouldn't have the ultimate say on the outcome but his input is valuable in terms of putting things in context. Peer expectations are much different depending on your age group and who you associate with. If I had posted something like this on a twitter account I could at minimum expect to be called on the carpet and potentially lose my job. If one of my students posted the same thing he might be looking at a couple of days out of school (mostly to make the school feel like it did something) and a significant amount of re-education and clarified expectations, all the records of which would never be publicly available to anyone outside of the school and would basically disappear on graduation as the records get purged.
Click to expand...

Assume this portion of your post was a response to my previous post. To clarify my position, Tini's age group is not the demographic that I object to him speaking on behalf of.
 
leftybuff said:
Fair enough. I will say this. If my son said something like that, there would be hell to pay. You don't go out of your way to say things like that. Maybe in a moment of extreme provocation, but I really cannot think of a time where using the word would be helpful. I can see it being used between friends, been there done that, but it was clearly understood by my friend and I. Sort of like how some call each other asshole here on AB. There is even an emoticon for it. OTOH, if I don't know you and you call me an asshole while garing at me, we're very likely to have a problem.

What strikes me as foolish is that the word, apparently no matter the context, is grounds for severe consequences like jerkng a scholly. That seems as stupid to me as any zero tolerance policy. Turn off the reasoning skills and mechanically apply a rule. That is how 2d graders get sent home from school because they brought a plastic knife with their lunch and violated the "weapon free zone".

In the grand scheme of things, if Kronshage was trying to insult or belittle the other kid, which is about the only conclusion one can draw unless the two are tight, he was wrong and should get his consequnece. But in the grand scheme of things is it that big of a deal? Not to me. There are far bigger issues out there to worry about. You can likely work with him and cure the problem without throwing him to the wolves. JMO.
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Well said, :asshole:
 
I'm with Lefty. Punish the kid, but let's keep this in context.

We have a chancellor that was convicted of DUI. We have one player that was implicated in a theft in CA. We have another player that disrobed into the female showers. Now we want to effectively kick out a player for a twitter comment? It was a deplorable comment, but this seems like a good opportunity for a teaching moment. I am for 2nd chances. If more things happen, bye.
 
Creebuzz said:
I'm with Lefty. Punish the kid, but let's keep this in context.

We have a chancellor that was convicted of DUI. We have one player that was implicated in a theft in CA. We have another player that disrobed into the female showers. Now we want to effectively kick out a player for a twitter comment? It was a deplorable comment, but this seems like a good opportunity for a teaching moment. I am for 2nd chances. If more things happen, bye.
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We also have a cross country runner who was expelled for sending a racist E-mail. I don't think he should be admitted.
 
Why am I completely unsurprised that a large portion of this community is more-or-less OK with a white guy calling someone a "n*" (in print and in public, no less)?
 
Ya he is gone. No way this flies. And I have to laugh at this board full of middle-aged white men downplaying this. In no way is that tweet acceptable
 
He's probably not a bad kid, and may go on to be a very upstanding adult. But I also have no problem if Mac's attitude is, look I've got a disaster of a program to rebuild here and don't have time for this kind of bulls**t taking my energies away from recruiting, scheming, building relationships across campus and the state, and kissing booster ass, so while it may be a little quick handed, this takes my energies away from the things that matter to this program so I need to get rid of this problem now.
 
buffs04 said:
Why am I completely unsurprised that a large portion of this community is more-or-less OK with a white guy calling someone a "n*" (in print and in public, no less)?
Click to expand...
So who is saying it's more-or-less ok?
 
I can't believe how many people on here are actually defending the tweet. The argument between an "er" and "a" ending is completely irrelevant here. The tweet says "your a n*****". Aside from the grammatical error, that's clearly meant as a racist insult. It's not ambiguous.

Now, if you want to say it's a mistake, but he shouldn't lose a scholarship, fine. But please don't downplay it and accuse others of being PC. The tweet was clearly racist. Period.
 
I don't see anyone saying it's okay or defending the tweet. I see everyone acknowledging it was a mistake but differing about the sanction. Ultimately of course it's up to MM and I'm okay with his decision.
 
I'm oddly torn on this.

On one hand, I'm the first to denounce witch hunts and faux offense over words used to achieve the defendable moral high ground.

Also, I'm a big fan of redemption. I'd be a lot more concerned of this kid was using that word leaving CU than I was with him using it coming in. A University is a place to (hopefully) be enlightened, though I'm not sure what the **** happened to 'Tini (seriously 'Tini, what the ****?).

On the other hand, it's pretty broadly understood (even in Texas where I lived for a while, though not as a 18-year-old kid in 2013) that you just don't say that word. Regardless of how you end it.

Furthermore, we're essentially reaching out to this kid as a representative--an ambassador if you will--of this university. And expecting him to function on a team which features a number of African American student athletes.

Really, I think we should pull the offer. Even if he had benign intentions. I don't think this is a case of a PC witch hunt. I think it was a kid that broke a widely understood rule, and that we don't need him representing our institution.

Having said that, I'm delighted that PRich is here, so maybe I'm a bit of a hypocrite.
 
Orr said:
I'm oddly torn on this.

On one hand, I'm the first to denounce witch hunts and faux offense over words used to achieve the defendable moral high ground.

Also, I'm a big fan of redemption. I'd be a lot more concerned of this kid was using that word leaving CU than I was with him using it coming in. A University is a place to (hopefully) be enlightened, though I'm not sure what the **** happened to 'Tini (seriously 'Tini, what the ****?).

On the other hand, it's pretty broadly understood (even in Texas where I lived for a while, though not as a 18-year-old kid in 2013) that you just don't say that word. Regardless of how you end it.

Furthermore, we're essentially reaching out to this kid as a representative--an ambassador if you will--of this university. And expecting him to function on a team which features a number of African American student athletes.

Really, I think we should pull the offer. Even if he had benign intentions. I don't think this is a case of a PC witch hunt. I think it was a kid that broke a widely understood rule, and that we don't need him representing our institution.

Having said that, I'm delighted that PRich is here, so maybe I'm a bit of a hypocrite.
Click to expand...

Don't neccessarily agree with your conclusion but a well written, well reasoned response.

In the end M2 is going to have to make a decision on this thing. Frankly a decision either way could be supported.
 
MtnBuff said:
Don't neccessarily agree with your conclusion but a well written, well reasoned response.

In the end M2 is going to have to make a decision on this thing. Frankly a decision either way could be supported.
Click to expand...

If you met me, you'd agree with my conclusion. I really am a total hypocrite.
 
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