Discussion in 'Colorado Basketball Message Board' started by SDB, Mar 17, 2016.
Moved to island. Already have a post game thread.
@SDB Are you running off the marketwatch coaches salary analysis which would have Boyle tied for 30 with Andy Enfield and Steve Prohm?
that was the most recent data set i could find, and Tad slots in at roughly 30.
I moved this quickly because i have a question about the data set and want it answered so i can look at it.
Is the messaging system broken? anyways, I bet he's gone. Doesn't come here to talk, just wants to splooge and run
Which is a good way to get moderated.
I usually do that in the other order.
That actually applied to many parts of my life well into my 30's.
Apparently for some people around here CU Basketball didn't start until 2012.
Well now we know who was that kid in the back seat asking "Are we there yet?" every five minutes.
Seems like some people think a coach should win a NC within 4 or 5 years or the program is going nowhere. If you can't see the improvements the team made this year then there is no helping you. Are the things to be unhappy about with Tad and the team? Absolutely. But for a few years now we've been an elite home team. We still struggle on the road, but there were far less blowouts than in the past. And we finally seem to be getting to the point where we don't have duds of games and lose to teams we have no business losing to. Changing coaches doesn't always mean an improvement. Look at Ucla. The tournament is such a crapshoot anyway and very dependent on matchups. Making the tourney should be the goal every year. With a few years sprinkled in there where we make a run or 2. Many people were hoping for an NIT bid this year and even though we well exceeded those expectations still seem disappointed. We are never going to be Kansas or Kentucky or Ucla. No matter who the coach is. So just enjoy the success we are having.
You had me until this last bit, which appears a little defeatist for my liking.
Yes, it's true that the Buffs are never going to have the history of any other program.
But the future of CU basketball completely depends upon where the CU ecosystem of fans, coaches, administrators, and athletes want to go. What we are willing to sacrifice to create and sustain a tradition of greatness?
Rick George, Tad Boyle, Josh Scott, and maybe one or two others would be disappointed if CU's expectation stopped at one-and-done in the tournament and second tier team status in the conference.
In the past, CU leadership has pointed to the Wisconsin athletic department as an example of where the Buffs would like to be. When the Buffs reach the final four (and the football team goes to the Rose Bowl), like the Badgers have recently done, then expectations can ratchet up.
Grow or die!
We have 6 power conferences in basketball.
ACC - 15 teams
Big 12 - 10 teams
Big East - 10 teams
Big Ten - 14 teams
Pac-12 - 12 teams
SEC - 14 teams
That's 75 programs at CU's level. Figure there are also some mid-major elites where a HC can get paid like the majors do.
So Tad is somewhere among the bottom of the top third/ top of the middle third in pay among his peers in the industry.
This seems about right to me when I look at his season records, his frequency of making the post-season (4 NCAAT, 1 NIT, 1 CBI in 6 years), and the fact that he's done it while running the program within the academics, compliance & player behavior standards CU expects of its basketball program.
Tournament record sucks. That needs to change in the future. Eventually he'll probably break through, though.
I guess what I'm saying is that nothing is out of line here. I understand why people are frustrated at not reaching that next level. I'm frustrated. I'm pretty damn happy with being a CU basketball fan since Tad took over, though. So I'm preaching patience and support.
Izzo is one of the highest paid coaches in the US. Dude needs to be ****canned after today's loss.
Beat me to it. The whole discussion of Tad being worthy is just plain stupid. Not saying he does not deserve criticism at times but anyone suggesting anything but CU being thankful we have him needs to have his or her head examined. I was at CU for many of the lowly records during the mid 80's and into the 90's. I love the program and believe they will break thru in the tourney at some point but take what we have had and enjoy it. Not saying it does not hurt to lose like we did this year but this program (outside of the run in the 30/40's) had very little tradition before Tad got here. It is a great ride and I have a crazy feeling we will be very, very good next year.
I love this program and where we are. We will continue to grow but this is a damn good place to be.
Slightly off topic...but this is kinda where I'm at with Mac2 as well right now. Carry on.
edit: replace "very good" with "much improved"
1-4 isn't horrendous, but our tournament magic has long since dried up. It is becoming a concern. After 2012, we've done very little in the P12T as well. We're masters of winning on Wednesday, but we have made the semis just once since 2012. Much of it comes down to seeding in both tournaments. Win an extra 2 regular season games and it will take care of the tournament woes.
When Duke hadn't won a championship in awhile, had some early tournament struggles, weren't winning some key recruiting battles (particularly bigs), some fans were expressing displeasure with the legend K himself. Then, 2010 happened, and then some big signees occurred, and 2015 happened, and people have shut up after some eating crow.
When UK was not getting some recruits, and were struggling at times under Tubby Smith, UK complained...and they replaced Tubby with an alcoholic that had put the program back a bit while Tubby led Minnesota to a great season.
We have a coach that's relatively young in his career. We can, and should, be patient. More support would also help. Basically, I think it'd be nice if the bitterness in the critiques of our program is scaled down...sorry for beating a point to death.
Does the AD even care much about bball at this point? Tad could use this year and what he has done here as a stepping stone to somewhere else. The AD has given me no indication outside of Arizona that they really pushed for students to be at he games.
That helps games like Utah and helps recruiting. The AD seemed to have used all funds to hel Folsom Frenzy and not nearly as much as should have been done for Cunit.
That doesn't absolve some of the issues we've had under Tad, but it colors me concerned if Tad wasn't as good as he's been for the longevity of the program. Better showings on the road next year is a step in he right direction we need to look at to make the next leap forward.
I'm pretty sure the AD would prefer to go back to losing. A winning program is just too much work and we have to pay the coach too much.
Watch how Tad instantly becomes a vastly improved game day coach as soon as we get consistently decent point guard play.
Yes. Those big runs that happen within a minute or two are a direct result of poor/inconsistant play at the point.
Bad coaching or bad Recruiting or both? Are we better next year? All but 2- 3 teams are out recruiting Tad... my point in this thread was that Tad is paid in the upper echelon...he's got good facilities thx to Bz and RG...gotta get I out of the first round...and start winning big games on road and/or neutral site ... and coach to win vice holding on...
I don't think Tad has any more eligibility.
answer the damn question posed!
@SDB - which data set are you working from? or do you just plan to ignore my question?
Hey...sorry...was away for the weekend and did not see your question...YES...that is the data I used. Verified with a few other sources. Has Tad done a very good job righting the ship at CU? Yes. Is he now paid to do more? Yes. If a corporation hired a guy in an industry and paid him top 5 money...then the corporation would most certainly expect that corporation to perform as a top 5 corporation. Tad has not developed consistent guard play since the Mayor...and lets face it...Dinwiddie was special and did not require much coaching.
College sports is a lot different than general business.
Agreed fully on the guard play point, I wonder how much of that is on Pri and his responsibility with guards. I am also uncomfortable with what seemed like a lack of focus on the point after Spencer - even if he didn't go down with the injury we still have that huge gap last year where ostensibly you are relying on Ski and Talton to run the point which is is a bad plan. I know we missed on Casey Benson and a couple of others but - that gap in leadership on the floor is akin to not having a QB on the roster.
That data set you are looking at by the way is constrained only to coaches who made the tournament. Both Larry Brown and Rick Pitino are excluded from that list and make more than Tad. So are roughly 7 other SEC coaches, and 3-4 a piece in the: ACC, Big1G, Big12, Big east. Tad is probably between 55-60 as far as highest paid coaches in the country of which nearly half missed the tournament all together.
That data was really enlightening though, I know @Goose thinks they'll **** it up but the SEC is throwing money at coaches something like 11 of the 14 in that league make more than 1.5 million and a plurality make more than 2mm. Wonder if we'll see real progress from them in basketball in the near future.
The real list of guys that are steals it the coaches who got at large bids or who won 24+ in small conferences, of the 64 in the tourney that make 1mm or under. Ans holy **** at Hawaii's Eran Ganot and Bakersfields only making 225k & 140k respectively.
Separate names with a comma.