What if the ACC merged with the Big 12? Realignment Pron

[Buffnik]

First of all: here's why it might make sense:

1) Both conferences value unbalanced revenue sharing (very attractive to UT, OU & ND)
2) Neither conference has been able to put together a real tv network.

Biggest issue we'd be looking at is too many teams. They add up to 25. So we'd need some mix of schools getting dropped (new conference forming, so throw out the grant of rights deals & whatnot).

Introducing your new "Big ACC":

EAST	WEST
Florida State	Kansas
Miami	Kansas State
Clemson	Oklahoma
Georgia Tech	Oklahoma State
North Carolina	Texas
Duke	Texas Tech
Virginia	Louisville
Virginia Tech	Notre Dame

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Here's who got left out:

Baylor (homeless - goes to AAC)
Boston College (homeless - goes to AAC)
Iowa State (homeless - goes to AAC)
NC State (goes to SEC)
Pittsburgh (goes to Big Ten)
Syracuse (goes to Big Ten)
TCU (goes to PAC)
West Virginia (goes to SEC)
Wake Forest (homeless - probably to AAC)

Which, of course, leaves the Pac-12 scrambling to get to 16 teams. Conference may very well have to consider taking TCU + Houston to get a piece of the Texas markets (and two huge metro populations) along with 2 from UNLV, New Mexico, Boise State and BYU to get to 16.

The other 3 Power conferences would look like this (I'll make a big guess on Pac-16):

Big Ten

EAST	WEST
Syracuse	Purdue
Rutgers	Indiana
Pittsburgh	Minnesota
Penn State	Wisconsin
Maryland	Northwestern
Ohio State	Illinois
Michigan	Nebraska
Michigan State	Iowa

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

SEC

EAST	WEST
Florida	Alabama
Georgia	Auburn
South Carolina	Mississippi
NC State	Miss State
Tennessee	Missouri
Vanderbilt	Arkansas
Kentucky	LSU
West Virginia	Texas A&M

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

PAC

EAST	WEST
Colorado	Washington
Utah	Wash State
Arizona	Oregon
Arizona State	Oregon State
TCU	Cal
Houston	Stanford
UNLV	UCLA
Boise State	USC

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

For completion's sake, here's what we get for the MWC and AAC:

MWC (with further additions to go to 16 - stealing from Sun Belt & C-USA)

EAST	WEST
Wyoming	Fresno State
Colorado State	San Jose State
Air Force	San Diego State
New Mexico	Hawaii
Texas State	Idaho
UTEP	Utah State
UTSA	BYU
North Texas	Nevada

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

AAC (gets to 16 by stealing from Sun Belt + Missouri State comes up from FCS - previously invited by C-USA)

EAST	WEST
Boston College	Tulsa
Connecticut	Memphis
Wake Forest	Iowa State
East Carolina	Tulane
UCF	Baylor
USF	SMU
Temple	Arkansas State
Cincinnati	Missouri State

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

 

[hokiehead]

First of all: here's why it might make sense:

1) Both conferences value unbalanced revenue sharing (very attractive to UT, OU & ND)
2) Neither conference has been able to put together a real tv network.

Biggest issue we'd be looking at is too many teams. They add up to 25. So we'd need some mix of schools getting dropped (new conference forming, so throw out the grant of rights deals & whatnot).

Introducing your new "Big ACC":

EAST	WEST
Florida State	Kansas
Miami	Kansas State
Clemson	Oklahoma
Georgia Tech	Oklahoma State
North Carolina	Texas
Duke	Texas Tech
Virginia	Louisville
Virginia Tech	Notre Dame

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Here's who got left out:

Baylor (homeless - goes to AAC)
Boston College (homeless - goes to AAC)
Iowa State (homeless - goes to AAC)
NC State (goes to SEC)
Pittsburgh (goes to Big Ten)
Syracuse (goes to Big Ten)
TCU (goes to PAC)
West Virginia (goes to SEC)
Wake Forest (homeless - probably to AAC)

Which, of course, leaves the Pac-12 scrambling to get to 16 teams. Conference may very well have to consider taking TCU + Houston to get a piece of the Texas markets (and two huge metro populations) along with 2 from UNLV, New Mexico, Boise State and BYU to get to 16.

The other 3 Power conferences would look like this (I'll make a big guess on Pac-16):

Big Ten

EAST	WEST
Syracuse	Purdue
Rutgers	Indiana
Pittsburgh	Minnesota
Penn State	Wisconsin
Maryland	Northwestern
Ohio State	Illinois
Michigan	Nebraska
Michigan State	Iowa

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

SEC

EAST	WEST
Florida	Alabama
Georgia	Auburn
South Carolina	Mississippi
NC State	Miss State
Tennessee	Missouri
Vanderbilt	Arkansas
Kentucky	LSU
West Virginia	Texas A&M

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

PAC

EAST	WEST
Colorado	Washington
Utah	Wash State
Arizona	Oregon
Arizona State	Oregon State
TCU	Cal
Houston	Stanford
UNLV	UCLA
Boise State	USC

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

For completion's sake, here's what we get for the MWC and AAC:

MWC (with further additions to go to 16 - stealing from Sun Belt & C-USA)

EAST	WEST
Wyoming	Fresno State
Colorado State	San Jose State
Air Force	San Diego State
New Mexico	Hawaii
Texas State	Idaho
UTEP	Utah State
UTSA	BYU
North Texas	Nevada

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

AAC (gets to 16 by stealing from Sun Belt + Missouri State comes up from FCS - previously invited by C-USA)

EAST	WEST
Boston College	Tulsa
Connecticut	Memphis
Wake Forest	Iowa State
East Carolina	Tulane
UCF	Baylor
USF	SMU
Temple	Arkansas State
Cincinnati	Missouri State

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

1. uhhh, **** that!
2. where did you get the idea that the ACC "values" unbalanced revenue sharing? with the exception of newcomer Louisville, all full ACC members are on the same financial terms. payout per school is, in small part, dependent on revenue generated, but last year the average payout from the ACC was $26.4m per school; the lowest payout was Syracuse at $24m.

 

[GoBeers]

1) Both conferences value unbalanced revenue sharing (very attractive to UT, OU & ND)
2) Neither conference has been able to put together a real tv network.

http://www.espn.com/college-sports/...year-rights-deal-lead-2019-launch-acc-network

ACC has a network coming in 2019 and a grant of rights until 2035. Full members will get equal payments. Sure ND is a special case, and Texas is a special case.

BUT:

The Pac 12 -in some respects- still has unequal revenue sharing. Consider UCLA's new IMG deal... $150 million /10 years. That's about what Texas gets for the Longhorn Network from ESPN AND IMG. People forget that LHN deal includes the IMG rights that other schools like UCLA are selling separately for good money. I would venture to say Texas is vastly underpaid for the LHN rights (due to the high costs of running a network w/ 24/7 programming for one single school). If the P12Net made significant money, UCLA would make more than Texas for similar rights.

 

[Buffnik]

http://www.espn.com/college-sports/...year-rights-deal-lead-2019-launch-acc-network

ACC has a network coming in 2019 and a grant of rights until 2035. Full members will get equal payments. Sure ND is a special case, and Texas is a special case.

BUT:

The Pac 12 -in some respects- still has unequal revenue sharing. Consider UCLA's new IMG deal... $150 million /10 years. That's about what Texas gets for the Longhorn Network from ESPN AND IMG. People forget that LHN deal includes the IMG rights that other schools like UCLA are selling separately for good money. I would venture to say Texas is vastly underpaid for the LHN rights (due to the high costs of running a network w/ 24/7 programming for one single school). If the P12Net made significant money, UCLA would make more than Texas for similar rights.

And just 4 days after the ESPN announcement, Sports Business Daily countered with how the ACC Network may be in trouble. http://www.sportsbusinessdaily.com/Journal/Issues/2016/07/25/Media/ESPN-ACC-Network.aspx

That's the other reason I brought this thread up for mental masturbation -- ESPN has a troubled asset with LHN and a troubled commitment with the ACC Network. Their solution could very well be to force a merger of the ACC and Big 12 in order to bring it all together into one much stronger asset.

 

[96 Buff]

****ing hell, Nik. What the **** is wrong with you?

 

[White_Rabbit]

some fans rosterbate in the offseason, nik realignmentbates

 

[sackman]

Nik, you need to seek professional help.

I'm saying this as a friend.

 

[DeNiro]

Plus how the PAC was split is just terrible

 

[CB17Cubed]

I don't want Boise in the Pac. They don't add any TVs, joke of an academic institution, and are only known for football. I do think that the Pac could steal the KU and KSU. So I would rather add them with Houston and TCU.

Also, you got to remember that the super conferences will have pods, instead of 8 team divisions. With pods, you can play everyone in your pod, plus you can do 2 games in every other pod on a two-year cycle to give you a 9 game schedule.

But I would prefer to have 5 super conferences instead of 4. I do think the Big 12 will die and that is when the 16 team conferences will happen. With the remnants of the better group of 5 teams and Big 12 teams not picked up maybe you can form a conference out of that. If it stays at 4 conferences, would like to see the group of 5 add their own playoff.

 

[Alfred91]

Oof.

Kinda feel like we'd be getting the short end of the stick there.

But putting OSU and the Michigan schools in with schools from PA and the Northeast is pretty crappy too.

 

[Buffnik]

Our best hope for the Pac-12, honestly, is that Big Ten decides to strongly focus on academics and its AAU thing, decides that it has enough football cache, and goes to 16 by adding 2 programs that won't move the needle much: Iowa State and Kansas. The SEC, I've heard, may look to market expansion in the next round while trying not to make its football even harder than it currently, which would happen if it brought in superpowers like Oklahoma and Texas. West Virginia, Baylor, TCU and OSU would all be very real possibilities for them. WVU would also make a ton of sense for the ACC if Notre Dame decided it wanted to come on board for football.

At the end of the day, as much as I've been looking into it and trying to find a path for a Pac-14 or Pac-16, I think I'm back to square one. If it's going to happen, it needs to happen through UT and, to a lesser extent, OU. If we got them, with the other additions it's pretty much "any 2 will do" outside of Baylor and BYU, who are auto-blackballs from the Pac-12 presidents.

 

[DeNiro]

Best case for $ and pod set up:

Pod 1
CU
Utah
Cal
Stanford

Pod 2
Washington
OSU
Oregon
WSU

Pod 3
U$S
UCLA
Arizona
Arizona St.

Pod 4
Kansas
Oklahoma
Texas
Houston

Best Pods to Spread large cities and traditional powers:

Pod 1A
Colorado
Oregon State
Cal
Houston

Pod 1B
Utah
Oregon
Standford
Texas

Pod 2A
Washington
Oklahoma
U$C
Arizona State

Pod 2B
Washington State
Kansas
UCLA
Arizona

Your rival/travel partners are in separate pods (if used for non-football) and your tied to that team in the other pod and 1 more each season and then rotate 2 from the others. CU would always face Utah from 1B and the other team would rotate.

Every pod has a Cali school and at least a larger conference market in it.

 

[Buffnik]

I think that "pods" is a scheduling model only, but wouldn't determine conference championship seeds.

For that, I think we have 2 divisions and the 2 division winners would go to the game. Pods could play into that with the semi-final for the division title being the pod champs playing at the higher-ranked team's home stadium.

That would seem to be a fair model for a 16-team conference.

 

[CB17Cubed]

As I watch the Big 12 Championship, one reason I hope these super conferences don't come or that the Big 12 is somehow able to become one is Iowa State. I always liked their fans and their dedication to the school. I know with the four super conferences they will be on the outside looking in. Maybe the for some weird reason, the B1G could pick them up, but that's highly doubtful. It would be the same reasons why the Pac wouldn't take CSU. It's an agriculture school, nothing wrong with that, but doesn't add to the prestige of conferences known for their research.

As far as Pac, I do think that KU, Houston, and TCU make the most sense. Get the basketball following of KU plus the KC market. TCU and Houston give you inroads to the state of Texas. Outside of those three, maybe UNLV, KSU, or Tech? KSU again is a ag school, but might be how we get KU. Vegas offers a lot to the Pac 12 and it will just get bigger. Tech has some decent programs like engineering and Lubbock is bigger than Pullman and Corvallis. I see OU and Texas going to either the B1G or SEC. Doubt that those two would go together. I think OU is tired of Texas. So lets say we get KU, KSU, Houston, and TCU.

Pods:
NW Pod: UO, OSU, UW, and WSU.
Cali Pod: Cal, Stanford, UCLA, and USC.
Rocky Mountain: UofA, ASU, CU, and UU.
Great Plains: UH, KU, KSU, and TCU.

Each team plays everyone in their pod so that is 3 games, plus they play 2 teams in the other three pods to make it a 9 game conference schedule.You make. So lets make it CU plays UofA, ASU, and UU in the pod. They get UH and KU from the Great Plains, UCLA and Stanford in the Cali Pod, and OSU and UW in the NW. Make it a two-year cycle like how it was in the Big 12 before we left. The two teams with the best conference records play for the CCG. For basketball, you play your pod teams twice and everyone else once to make an 18 game conference schedule.

 

[Highlander]

I think that "pods" is a scheduling model only, but wouldn't determine conference championship seeds.

For that, I think we have 2 divisions and the 2 division winners would go to the game. Pods could play into that with the semi-final for the division title being the pod champs playing at the higher-ranked team's home stadium.

That would seem to be a fair model for a 16-team conference.

I would love for this to be the future.

• 4 major conferences with 4 pods each
• each conference has 4 pod winners play each other in a semifinal
• winners play in a conference championship
• 4 conference champions play each other in a 4 team playoff just as today

Of course, to make this happen, the Big 12 needs to dissolve politely into the other 4 conferences, and I am not sure that is going to happen.

What I believe will happen, that is less appetizing to me, is the following:

• 5 conferences continue and pick up scraps from the non-P5 schools
• We start with an expansion to an 8 team playoff, with the 5 conference winners and the top non-P5 school as guaranteed picks, and 2 wild cards
• It then expands about 10 years later to a 16 team playoff with 5 conference winners, 1 guaranteed non-P5 school, and 10 wild cards

I hate what I believe will happen, but, I just don't see the conferences finding a way to work together to make my ideal scenario a reality.

 

[DeNiro]

Pods:
NW Pod: UO, OSU, UW, and WSU.
Cali Pod: Cal, Stanford, UCLA, and USC.
Rocky Mountain: UofA, ASU, CU, and UU.
Great Plains: UH, KU, KSU, and TCU.

Why do pods need to be lumped by geography? This is 2017 and travel isn't a big deal. Don't use the non revanue sports argument, they don't use the current north/south split football does anyway.

 

[Buffnik]

Why do pods need to be lumped by geography? This is 2017 and travel isn't a big deal. Don't use the non revanue sports argument, they don't use the current north/south split football does anyway.

Because the geography is why the pods make sense.

For example, a California Pod for the Pac means that every other program in the conference makes one trip to CA every year and gets one trip from CA every year. For 2 years, it's with northern California and the other 2 years it's with southern California.

Similarly with traveling to and from the Pacific Northwest with those 4 teams, the Mountain Zone with those 4 teams, and likely the Central Zone with those 4 teams to be named later.

Geographic groupings are pretty essential for creating/maintaining local rivalries (since you play all of those teams every year) while getting equal access to every other region for recruiting purposes.

Without pod scheduling, I'm less of a fan of 16-team conferences. Without it being by geographic grouping, I don't see the purpose for it.

 

[Buffnik]

2025 is the key year in all this.

College Football Playoff runs through 2025
Notre Dame deal with NBC runs through 2025
ESPN deal with the Big 12 runs through 2025
The one outlier here is the Longhorn Network deal, which runs through 2030. But something tells me that ESPN will be more than willing to negotiate.

 

[sackman]

Stars are meaningless in recruiting...

Oh, wait, I thought this was about another subject that has been beaten to death.

 

[Dark Bohner]

some fans rosterbate in the offseason, nik realignmentbates

It still involves a lot of sob, sob, sob, yank, yank, yank.

 

[MiamiBuffs]

****ing hell, Nik. What the **** is wrong with you?

Seriously. Get a ****ing job at the NCAA or a conference.