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Phil Steele - do you believe in him or not

77buff

Well-Known Member
Has Texas #2, OU #4, Notre Dame #7, and Nebraska #22. Has CU his #8 most improved team, and says "Hawkins is on one of the hottest seats of all coaches this year but the Buffs make my list of the Most Improved Teams which has me calling for their 1st winning season since 2005". Lists Nate Solder as 6-9, that would make him taller than Curt Koch.
 
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If you want to sell your publications rand Notre Dame and Nebraska highly. Both teams have huge fan bases that are willing to pay big money to hear someone tell them how great they are, even if they aren't. OU and Texas also fall into that catagory but in their cases you can make an argument based on talent that they will be very good.

I don't know how tall Solder is but he has a huge frame that he is working on filling out. Miller is reportedly 6'8" and some including him coming out of high school said he was 6'9". Solder is right there with him when they stand side by side.

Barring another ridiculous string of injuries this team is ready for a major step up this year. Simply based on much better depth and another year of maturity this team should win at least 8 games and Hawk's 10 is not unreasonable.

If we do start to accumulate wins the recruiting will follow and we should see a continued trend upward.

Notre Dame has had top 10 recruiting classes for the past 6 years and still can't get out of their own way. I don't know how much of it is the players being overrated because they are committed or look like they will be committing to Notre Dame and how much of it is that the Notre Dame program is a place where talent goes to die.
 
Has Texas #2, OU #4, Notre Dame #7, and Nebraska #22. Has CU his #8 most improved team, and says "Hawkins is on one of the hottest seats of all coaches this year but the Buffs make my list of the Most Improved Teams which has me calling for their 1st winning season since 2005". Lists Nate Solder as 6-9, that would make him taller than Curt Koch.

NO..


And exactly what hot seat is Hawk on? He's already got an extension through 2012...
 
i have a buddy, who despite being a pretty solid guy, is a ND fan. his thinking is that ND should win 9 games since the schedule is pretty easy/sets up favorably.

and i think with 9 wins ND qualifies for the BCS championship game.
 
i have a buddy, who despite being a pretty solid guy, is a ND fan. his thinking is that ND should win 9 games since the schedule is pretty easy/sets up favorably.

and i think with 9 wins ND qualifies for the BCS championship game.

Yeah. They don't have to play syracuse this year.
 
i have a buddy, who despite being a pretty solid guy, is a ND fan. his thinking is that ND should win 9 games since the schedule is pretty easy/sets up favorably.

and i think with 9 wins ND qualifies for the BCS championship game.

Yeah, 9-3 will always get you into the ch game. :wow:
 
Phil has been the most accurate preseason mag for the last 20+ years. His predictions are uncanny because he does more research than anyone else and very, very rarely does he miss, esspecially on his most improved teams. As much as I hate to say it, ND is going to end up winning 9-10 games this season. One of the big factors is their experienced O Line. they have more than 100 starts between them. The team was young last season but is returning everyone and if you look at their schedule, there's a lot of easy wins:
Sept. 5 NEVADA
Sept. 12 at Michigan
Sept. 19 MICHIGAN STATE
Sept. 26 at Purdue
Oct. 3 WASHINGTON
Oct. 10 Open Date
Oct. 17 USC
Oct. 24 BOSTON COLLEGE
Oct. 31 vs. Washington State (at San Antonio, Texas)
Nov. 7 NAVY
Nov. 14 at Pittsburgh
Nov. 21 CONNECTICUT
Nov. 28 at Stanford

Most of these that were bowl teams last season lost really important players like MSU, Pitt, and UConn. As far as ranking NU, if they win the 8-9 that most expect they should probably be ranked in the back of the top 25.
 
If you want to sell your publications rand Notre Dame and Nebraska highly. Both teams have huge fan bases that are willing to pay big money to hear someone tell them how great they are, even if they aren't. OU and Texas also fall into that catagory but in their cases you can make an argument based on talent that they will be very good.

Steele is not putting in ND in his top 10 to sell magazines. He doesn't take the trendy route and pick who finished hot the previous season and stay away from teams who finished poorly down the stretch. He does it with looking at key factors such as how many close or tough losses a team had and takes into account, as well as how many marginal wins you had when considering over-rated teams from the previous season. And the schedule is a huge factor in his ratings. Remember, Steele's rankings aren't based on how good he thinks each team is, it's based on how he thinks teams will finish the season. And as Coloradosker noted, ND will be undoubtedly have a better team than last year, but combine that with the ridiculously easy schedule they have and they're going to win at least 9 games. Hell, Iowa State could win 8 games with that schedule. :huh:

For those who already have his magazine, I'd be curious to see where he has them in his power ratings?

Let me put it this way - if ND was playing in the SEC or Big 12, he'd have them ranked somewhere in the 20's.
 
If you want to sell your publications rand Notre Dame and Nebraska highly. Both teams have huge fan bases that are willing to pay big money to hear someone tell them how great they are, even if they aren't. OU and Texas also fall into that catagory but in their cases you can make an argument based on talent that they will be very good.

I don't know how tall Solder is but he has a huge frame that he is working on filling out. Miller is reportedly 6'8" and some including him coming out of high school said he was 6'9". Solder is right there with him when they stand side by side.

Barring another ridiculous string of injuries this team is ready for a major step up this year. Simply based on much better depth and another year of maturity this team should win at least 8 games and Hawk's 10 is not unreasonable.

If we do start to accumulate wins the recruiting will follow and we should see a continued trend upward.

Notre Dame has had top 10 recruiting classes for the past 6 years and still can't get out of their own way. I don't know how much of it is the players being overrated because they are committed or look like they will be committing to Notre Dame and how much of it is that the Notre Dame program is a place where talent goes to die.
I didn't know that college teams paid Phil to write about them, I guess big money to you is spending $5.99 on a magazine. I thought that magazines made their money on advertising.
 
I didn't know that college teams paid Phil to write about them. I guess big money to you is spending $5.99 on a magazine. I thought that magazines made their money on advertising.

First off I'm a big Phil Steele fan, and I think he makes a genuine effort to rank teams based on quality research.

However, I do believe some publications and online services do cater to particular fan bases. You see, bobigred, pre-season football magazines doesn't only sell one magazine to each fan base. In fact--and apparently this might surprise you based on your above post--the more people in each fan base the publisher can convince to purchase their product, the more money they make. I'm gonna give you a rough formula here: $5.99 multiplied by the number of magazines sold contributes to the gross profit.

Notre Dame and nebraska both field teams with notoriously large and loyal fanbases. It seems logical, if a publisher gives those fan bases a reason to be excited about their magazine or online service, the more money it could make.

I think that Mt.'s point to which you responded.

BRI might think I'm an asshole, but I'm wondering if he's gonna swoop in and defend your dumb ass on this one...

EDIT:

And another thing:

Advertisers pay more money if they anticipate higher circulation. If a particular pre-season mag routinely outsells the competition, then that magazine can reasonably charge its advertisers more for the service.

It all adds up to a tremendous incentive to sell a lot of magazines. It would therefore seem prudent, from a purely business perspective, to kiss the asses of those fan bases who have more people willing to spend their money on products relating to college football.
 
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First off I'm a big Phil Steele fan, and I think he makes a genuine effort to rank teams based on quality research.

However, I do believe some publications and online services do cater to particular fan bases. You see, bobigred, pre-season football magazines doesn't only sell one magazine to each fan base. In fact--and apparently this might surprise you based on your above post--the more people in each fan base the publisher can convince to purchase their product, the more money they make. I'm gonna give you a rough formula here: $5.99 multiplied by the number of magazines sold contributes to the gross profit.

Notre Dame and nebraska both field teams with notoriously large and loyal fanbases. It seems logical, if a publisher gives those fan bases a reason to be excited about their magazine or online service, the more money it could make.

I think that Mt.'s point to which you responded.

BRI might think I'm an asshole, but I'm wondering if he's gonna swoop in and defend your dumb ass on this one...

EDIT:

And another thing:

Advertisers pay more money if they anticipate higher circulation. If a particular pre-season mag routinely outsells the competition, then that magazine can reasonably charge its advertisers more for the service.

It all adds up to a tremendous incentive to sell a lot of magazines. It would therefore seem prudent, from a purely business perspective, to kiss the asses of those fan bases who have more people willing to spend their money on products relating to college football.
I guess that lofty ranking he gave NU last year was an advertising windfall. So I guess all of his rankings are BS since he only caters to fan bases to sell magazines. Since your a fan I guess your just one of the sheep.
 
I guess that lofty ranking he gave NU last year was an advertising windfall. So I guess all of his rankings are BS since he only caters to fan bases to sell magazines. Since your a fan I guess your just one of the sheep.

Please read my post again, particularly the first part.

And then consider how robustly nebraska's Scout site is staffed compared to CU's.

EDIT: My point is, I believe that Phil Steele is one of the guys that uses his reputation of reliability to sell magazines. However, if you use nebraska's win/loss record last season as evidence of Phil Steele's reliability, Notre Dame's lack of success would then raise some questions.
 
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Eh, the Notre Dame schedule isn't that easy, I see what could easily amount to 6 losses none of which would be upsets making that a terrible ranking. Nebraska is par for the course comparing them to other preseason rankings, but of course Phil Steele isn't supposed to be just another set of rankings.
 
Steele is not putting in ND in his top 10 to sell magazines. He doesn't take the trendy route and pick who finished hot the previous season and stay away from teams who finished poorly down the stretch. He does it with looking at key factors such as how many close or tough losses a team had and takes into account, as well as how many marginal wins you had when considering over-rated teams from the previous season. And the schedule is a huge factor in his ratings. Remember, Steele's rankings aren't based on how good he thinks each team is, it's based on how he thinks teams will finish the season. And as Coloradosker noted, ND will be undoubtedly have a better team than last year, but combine that with the ridiculously easy schedule they have and they're going to win at least 9 games. Hell, Iowa State could win 8 games with that schedule. :huh:

For those who already have his magazine, I'd be curious to see where he has them in his power ratings?

Let me put it this way - if ND was playing in the SEC or Big 12, he'd have them ranked somewhere in the 20's.

Top 10 Power Poll - Steele
1 Florida
2 Texas
3 Oklahoma
4 USC
5 Mississippi
6 Penn State
7 Alabama
8 LSU
9 Notre Dame
10 California

4 teams from the SEC, 2 from the PAC 10 and the Big 12
If they were playing in the SEC, they would be unranked.
 
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Eh, the Notre Dame schedule isn't that easy, I see what could easily amount to 6 losses none of which would be upsets making that a terrible ranking. Nebraska is par for the course comparing them to other preseason rankings, but of course Phil Steele isn't supposed to be just another set of rankings.

There's exactly 1 game on that schedule that they won't be favored to win. And the tougher games which could be considered toss-ups are all at home (UConn, BC, MSU). I hate to say it, but they're gonna win at least 9 games. :sad1:
 
Top 10 Power Poll - Steele
1 Florida
2 Texas
3 Oklahoma
4 USC
5 Mississippi
6 Penn State
7 Alabama
8 LSU
9 Notre Dame
10 California

4 teams from the SEC, 2 from the PAC 10 and the Big 12

Thanks. I'm really surprised he has ND that high because I figured the majority of the reason he had them at #7 was due to their joke of a schedule.

Mississippi #5? :wtf:
 
Thanks. I'm really surprised he has ND that high because I figured the majority of the reason he had them at #7 was due to their joke of a schedule.

Mississippi #5? :wtf:

Mississippi was the real deal last season.
 
Thanks. I'm really surprised he has ND that high because I figured the majority of the reason he had them at #7 was due to their joke of a schedule.

Mississippi #5? :wtf:

They are for real brother. Ed Orgeron did a great job recruting before he got fired. Houston Nutt is one of the best coaches in college football. Arkansas was nutts to let him get away. They don't have the biggest fan base but they are very suppportive of their program, and it doesn't hurt to have guys like Archie Manning doing PR work for free.
 
Mississippi was the real deal last season.

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They are for real brother. Ed Orgeron did a great job recruting before he got fired. Houston Nutt is one of the best coaches in college football. Arkansas was nutts to let him get away. They don't have the biggest fan base but they are very suppportive of their program, and it doesn't hurt to have guys like Archie Manning doing PR work for free.

How quickly I forget! :smile2: I forgot that they won at both the Swamp and at LSU, plus the impressive Cotton Bowl win over TT. And looking at this year's schedule, it's extremely manageable as far as SEC schedules go. Their 2 toughest games (Bama and LSU) are both at home.
 
No way in hell do I agree that ND will be ranked that high. They will be better, but not that much better. Oh wait, they're Notre Dame and they automatically get ranked in the top 10 just because they are Notre Dame. I ****ing hate Notre Dame just because of this and their lucrative television deal. :sad2:

As far as CU being a much improved team I think that's obviously a no brainer. With all the injuries to CU last season they can only be better with the guys they have returning. Hawk is a good coach and I've said that before, but he needs to have a little luck with him on his side to get over this injury bug he's been cursed with.

NU will get back in the Top 25 if they beat VT, but not before. If they lose to VT they will most likely have to claw their way into the Top 25 by beating other teams on their schedule fairly badly. Obviously I don't think we'll beat OU, but neither does anyone else in the nation that isn't a NU fan. If we some how shock the world and beat OU, probably won't happen, then we'll definately make up for a loss to VT. If we can win 9 games this season then of course that is a success based on all the new guys we have in key positions.

Do I think that magazines are sometimes sold based on fan bases and predictions by writers? Absolutely and if you don't think that's true then you need take some classes in business. I do think that Steele is fairly close on the NU assessment as we are on the cusp of being a fairly decent team again.
 
No way in hell do I agree that ND will be ranked that high. They will be better, but not that much better. Oh wait, they're Notre Dame and they automatically get ranked in the top 10 just because they are Notre Dame. I ****ing hate Notre Dame just because of this and their lucrative television deal. :sad2:

As far as CU being a much improved team I think that's obviously a no brainer. With all the injuries to CU last season they can only be better with the guys they have returning. Hawk is a good coach and I've said that before, but he needs to have a little luck with him on his side to get over this injury bug he's been cursed with.

NU will get back in the Top 25 if they beat VT, but not before. If they lose to VT they will most likely have to claw their way into the Top 25 by beating other teams on their schedule fairly badly. Obviously I don't think we'll beat OU, but neither does anyone else in the nation that isn't a NU fan. If we some how shock the world and beat OU, probably won't happen, then we'll definately make up for a loss to VT. If we can win 9 games this season then of course that is a success based on all the new guys we have in key positions.

Do I think that magazines are sometimes sold based on fan bases and predictions by writers? Absolutely and if you don't think that's true then you need take some classes in business. I do think that Steele is fairly close on the NU assessment as we are on the cusp of being a fairly decent team again.
If you look at ND's schedule, it's not tough except for USC. ND is a tiny school with a very small alumni base, the reason they have so many fans is because of their winning tradition and the Catholic church - which owns the world. Everybody wants to be associated with a winner. $hit, 95% of Notre Dame fans couldn't qualify for admission to the university. I can absolutely guarantee that over 99% have never taken a class at ND.
They aren't real fans, after a few losing seasons they will become USC, or Florida, or Oklahoma, or LSU fans, or whoever is on top.
 
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If you look at ND's schedule, it's not tough except for USC. ND is a tiny school with a very small alumni base, the reason they have so many fans is because of their winning tradition and the Catholic church - which owns the world. Everybody wants to be associated with a winner. $hit, 95% of Notre Dame fans couldn't qualify for admission to the university. I can absolutely guarantee that over 99% have never taken a class at ND.
They aren't real fans, after a few losing seasons they will become USC, or Florida, or Oklahoma, or LSU fans, or whoever is on top.

Agreed.
 
The reason nebraska has so many fans is because of their winning tradition and agrarian sodbusters - who feed the world. Everybody wants to be associated with a winner. $hit, 95% of the entire planet could qualify for admission to the university of nebraska. Though I can almost guarantee that over 99% of nebraska fans have never taken a class past the 10th grade.
They are real fans, however and after a few losing seasons they will talk up how great they used to be, while demanding the same respect for their mediocre program.

I took the liberty of adding a few minor changes. Maybe BRI will do the same, I'd be curious to see his view of CU fans.
 
If you look at ND's schedule, it's not tough except for USC. ND is a tiny school with a very small alumni base, the reason they have so many fans is because of their winning tradition and the Catholic church - which owns the world. Everybody wants to be associated with a winner. $hit, 95% of Notre Dame fans couldn't qualify for admission to the university. I can absolutely guarantee that over 99% have never taken a class at ND.
They aren't real fans, after a few losing seasons they will become USC, or Florida, or Oklahoma, or LSU fans, or whoever is on top.

Yeah, I realized this a long time ago when an Irish (heritage) guy I worked with was talking up ND and I asked him when he went there.

I took the liberty of adding a few minor changes. Maybe BRI will do the same, I'd be curious to see his view of CU fans.

:rofl2:
 
Do any of you remember that ND was a preseason #1 in Quinn's senior year.

We all know what happened that year?

ND hasn't really been a factor since the Holz years.
 
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