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Colorado's Offensive Line
- Thread starter Sexton Hardcastle
- Start date
I thought they had Behrens practicing there last fall, I guess the coaches didn't like what they saw.
Unleash Hell
Well-Known Member
Last year it was youth, this year upperclassmen. That can make a huge diff, especially on the line.
Behrens had some type of shoulder surgery after the NU game in 08, and he missed most of spring ball, and couldn't really lift until camp at which point he was befind in the running for both LG and C. He will now have had a full season to rebuild his strength and compete. We will see what happens.
Itilis was injured in the second series of the CSU game last year. I can't remember what the injury was, or if it caused him to play tender due to his ACL the prior year. In the last game of the season he, Miller, and Stevens did a good job against Suh and Click. I don't think we will play a pair of DT's better than those two for the entire 10 schedule.
I thought Hawk and Johnson always preached utility among the O-lineman. They like to teach every guy every position. Therefore, we should be able to mix and match for the best line right?
While this sounds good on paper, meaning maybe we can get the best five athletes on the field, it could be having the opposite effect. Too much information and not enough narrow focus for these kids. Let them get good a certain positions and not have to constantly worry about the "little things".
I have strong hopes for this line! It better be pretty darn good or we are wasting a lot of talent.
While this sounds good on paper, meaning maybe we can get the best five athletes on the field, it could be having the opposite effect. Too much information and not enough narrow focus for these kids. Let them get good a certain positions and not have to constantly worry about the "little things".
I have strong hopes for this line! It better be pretty darn good or we are wasting a lot of talent.
Interesting that you have Dannewitz listed at RT. I have heard from a couple of places that the kid is a true, natural LT and is developing very well. One person close to the program speculated that if Solder were not there Dannewitz would actually be one of the better LTs in the league this year.
Like so much of the rest of what goes on with the program when you look at the roster of OL players we have talent and depth that should make us highly competitive. The problem is that they just never seem to get it together and make it work and that to me all goes back to coaching.
If this team turns it around this year and starts to win, a lot of that is going to start with OL play. If they don't turn it around then Hawk and Co. will be gone and the new staff will definately have the raw material to do something with early.
Like so much of the rest of what goes on with the program when you look at the roster of OL players we have talent and depth that should make us highly competitive. The problem is that they just never seem to get it together and make it work and that to me all goes back to coaching.
If this team turns it around this year and starts to win, a lot of that is going to start with OL play. If they don't turn it around then Hawk and Co. will be gone and the new staff will definately have the raw material to do something with early.
SuperiorBuff
Well-Known Member
Utility is great, for backups. All non-starting linemen should know as many positions as possible to enable the best possible substitution when a starter goes down. Utility among starters does nothing but muddle the outcome. Once a lineman is named the starter he needs to focus on that position to optimize his growth and the stability of the line. Granted he should know the assignments of the other linemen on PAPER to insure that all blocking assignments and contingencies are covered, but he should always practice his position. Mixing starters around when one goes down creates several less than optimal positions rather than the one.
Chefselite
New Member
Are you for real? You're worried about the center spot. How about the sieve that was LG or the penalties of a talented but hot headed RT. Those penalties killed so many drives. I hope Givens has matured but if not, I would love to see somebody like Dannewitz or Tau challenge Givens and provide some more consistency at RT.
Our starting center played in 11 games and graded out 80% or higher in all 11 games and had 4 games 90 or higher, that is second best only to our all-conference LT. Stevens only had two penalties all year compared to 13 by our RT and 10 by our RG. A center shouldn't have many penalties anyway because he is snapping the ball, I'm just trying to say that there are other areas for improvement. Besides of those 23 penalties on the right side of our line, quite a few were of the 15 yard variety. Having the refs at the spring practices was a nice touch this year, I hope it pays off and cuts down on the penalties.
Stevens also only gave up 2 QB pressures compared to 19 by Miller and 19 by Adkins and 16 by Givens. As far as sacks, they all gave up 3 to 4 with the exception of Adkins who gave up 6. That just has to improve across the board. I know you guys don't like to admit it because he didn't come out of high school with any "stars" but I think Stevens could be our second or third best lineman.
As for LG, I would like to see Iltis there. With Iltis at LG, that was the best our line played all year. I think Richter is going to redshirt, and I'm pretty sure he has been quoted as saying that he wants to redshirt this year. Playing Iltis at guard gives him more experience this year and then he can slide into the center spot next year. Then next year you could have a line of:
LT: Dannewitz
LG: Richter
C: Iltis
RG: Miller
RT: Givens
Plus we have Simon (JC Recruit) who could contribute. He will be a 3 to play 3 guy. He is listed as the top JC center in the country so you could also put him at Center and keep Iltis at guard.
Sets us up with a talented and experienced oline for our move into the PAC-12.
https://www.nmnathletics.com//pdf8/706100.pdf
Last edited:
AlferdJasper
Well-Known Member
I was just going to mention Simon.
I look forward to seeing him on the field.
I look forward to seeing him on the field.
If and its a big if right now, you do this you flip sides on your tackles. Givens has nothing resembling the discipline needed to play the left side and Dannewitz is a natural LT. Givens aggressiveness and physical technique would make highly effective as a RT in the run game, potentially you even move him inside to RG where he would be a more natural fit.
Chefselite
New Member
Dannewitz at LT would be a good fit too, it just comes down to experience. Givens could be a good bridge at LT, but I definitely see your point. I would also like to see Bakhtiari at LT but he is still pretty raw. Who knows, he may surprise next spring.
Mick Ronson
Well-Known Member
i thought Simon had "reopened" his recruiting?
BehindEnemyLines
beware the habu
I believe he said it depends on what happens to the coaching staff. If the current staff survives this year, Simon will be a Buff.
AlferdJasper
Well-Known Member
According to Rivals story on BuffStampede, he is committed, although a coaching change would make him think twice:
buffalo30
Well-Known Member
Yes, Givens needs to cut the penalties, but he is one guy that doesn't buy into the "play on an even keel" BS. I sure hope he gets things squared away and gets on the right side of the fine line between playing with ruthless abandon and losing complete control. I don't mean to stir up trouble, but anyone remember what Chris Naeole did... ?
:lol::lol::lol:
:lol::lol::lol:
Mick Ronson
Well-Known Member
that's good to hear, thanks.
ScottyBuff
Well-Known Member
Yeah Dannewitz at LT when Solder leaves, but also Jack Harris should be ready to compete for starting time next year too.
Even without Miller last year these guys mostly were under achievers. Is MTM in the mix this year?
AlferdJasper
Well-Known Member
Definitely watching Jack Harris.
The Guest
Guest
Good thread.
Last year, about this time, I started a thread titled something along the lines of "sell me on this O-Line". I'd heard so much about how it would be our strength, but when I examined the inexperience, I wasn't seeing it.
I'm far more optimistic this season for the line.
Go Buffs!!
Last year, about this time, I started a thread titled something along the lines of "sell me on this O-Line". I'd heard so much about how it would be our strength, but when I examined the inexperience, I wasn't seeing it.
I'm far more optimistic this season for the line.
Go Buffs!!
Where could we put him?
Fullback, lol.
I'm not really optimistic, I'm just trying to look for any positives heading into the season. Our OL has been pretty embarrassing imo. Everyone is saying the same thing as last year (including myself). Experience, Experience, Experience.
Looking at guys like Solder, Miller and some of the others who are really talented individuals this could end up being one of those situations where some NFL commentator remarks about the ex-Buffs playing in the NFL and ask "How could they have all that talent and not win more games."
We will know the answer but I won't post it so I don't get called out for being negative and taking shots.
By the way rhymes with fan and with Bawkins. . .
We will know the answer but I won't post it so I don't get called out for being negative and taking shots.
By the way rhymes with fan and with Bawkins. . .
ScottyBuff
Well-Known Member
I'm pretty sold on a starting unit of Solder-Iltis-Stevens-Miller-Givens starting the season as our "best" option. I'd like Richter to redshirt so we can retain some talent through the "junior-heavy" class. Personally I'd like to have Ryan Miller play RT and find someone else to play RG (Tau, Behrens, or MTM) . I think Givens needs to mature and develop a little more but it might be too late for that since he was thrown into the fire immediately (maybe they were worried he would leave if he didn't get PT).
Next season a lineup of Dannewitz-Iltis-Simon-Miller-Givens with Jack Harris pushing for Tackle time and Richter and Max pushing for interior time.
Next season a lineup of Dannewitz-Iltis-Simon-Miller-Givens with Jack Harris pushing for Tackle time and Richter and Max pushing for interior time.
I'm trying not to bash anyone over the internet, I just think Iltis needs to show a hell of a lot more before we can start saying hes our best option at any position.
ScottyBuff
Well-Known Member
Sure, not saying he's a slam dunk but Behrens and Adkins haven't been that either.
IMO I would rank our LG's as: Iltis, Behrens, Richter, then Adkins as of right now. Richter's strength is a huge boost for him, just think he needs a little more time.
As was stated earlier, the Fusker game proved that an interior O-line of Iltis-Stevens-Miller could lock down two of the best DT's in the game.
Fact is, Max versus West Virginia in 2008 is the best play I've seen from a CU guard in at least the past 4 years. If he can get back to the physicality he had 2 years ago with increased strength, maturity and football IQ (from being 2 years older)... then the LG spot is his without question.
If he can't get there, I'm for Iltis or Behrens. I wasn't impressed with Adkins last season. Richter should only play if he's clearly the best man for the job. If it's close, he should redshirt.
If he can't get there, I'm for Iltis or Behrens. I wasn't impressed with Adkins last season. Richter should only play if he's clearly the best man for the job. If it's close, he should redshirt.
agreed on every point above. In fact, I rewatched the CSU game from 2008 recently and Max got put out there in the 2nd half and we started to really blow thru their Defensive Front when he came in. He was a true freshmen and he was a man. He was also coming off of an ACL tear from High School only 15 months earlier. It's been 18 months since he tore the other one. I really see no reason why he won't be full go.
How many acl surgeries has he had now though? Im hoping he will be full go but the health of his knees even when he is 100% worries me.