LOL... Tad being Tad! He has a roster full of 6' 4" guys. He needs a legitimate big, that should be his number 1 and number 2 priority. Nope, why not sign another 6' 4" guy, who needs rebounds and an interior presence.
LOL... Tad being Tad! He has a roster full of 6' 4" guys. He needs a legitimate big, that should be his number 1 and number 2 priority. Nope, why not sign another 6' 4" guy, who needs rebounds and an interior presence.
Bigs are wildly overrated in college ball. Give me guards. Bigs are limited if they don't have anyone getting them the ball.
I'm much more worried about our guard play next season. We lost 2 starting guards (White & Fortune) and it looks like attrition will be coming from the guard position for another spot or 2.
We did sign 3 forwards and are looking at another PF/C type in Ondigo.
Bigs are wildly overrated in college ball. Give me guards. Bigs are limited if they don't have anyone getting them the ball.
On the "guard" thing, technically Andre Roberson was a guard and George King is a guard, based on the CU roster. I do expect Schwartz to be listed as a guard. I think it's up in the air whether he's a wing or one heck of a long off-guard. Depends on how his handle develops, I think.
Regarding the rest:
1. Agree we need Dom to be back as a senior guard. He can play lead and off, which means he can give a lot of productive minutes.
2. Agree that Namon is likely an upgrade from Fortune, especially in consideration of Fortune's year-long shooting slump as a senior.
3. I believe Copeland would be an upgrade from Tommy or Bryce. Could actually replace a lot of White's production.
4. I acknowledge what you're saying about bigs, but I'd be happy to become Butler and have to worry about getting over on the North Carolinas of the world. First thing's first, and that's building a Sweet 16 team. The best path to that is through excellent guard play.
Hope you are right, but upgrade from Tommy/Bryce to replacing White's production are not quite the same.
Is there a concern about rim protection? The bulk of shot blocks graduated.
When will all of this shake out?
| Points | Attempts/Gm | FG% | 3pt% | FT% | Reb | Assist | TO | Steal | Block |
Sophomore | 13.6 | 10.0 | 44.6 | 45.6 | 74.8 | 4.7 | 0.7 | 1.9 | 0.4 | 0.2 |
Junior | 11.1 | 8.9 | 46.0 | 37.6 | 67.1 | 6.8 | 0.7 | 1.7 | 0.5 | 0.2 |
That is what I heard a lot on here last off-season. However, during the season when rebounding was a problem, it was a major issue with the team and of conversation on this board. Every team needs rebounding along with a player who can box out bigs and prevent other teams from dominating the paint.
"wildly overrated"? Sure, it's a guard's game in college, but let's face it, we need some bigs. If Butler had bigs to compete with UNC, completely different ball game. Kevin McHale had a good statement in one of those Open Court sessions on NBA TV. He said something like, small skill beats bad big any day, but big skill beats small skill. Bigs are needed, bc guards can't control the paint. Guards can win games for you, but not consistently when there are no bigs. For example, Kemba may have been the star, but without Oriakhi, UConn doesn't win it all.
Dom and Lucas are not stiffs. Siewart showed solid potential.
Stop wasting time with ****ty bigs.
Alex Oriakhi was a 5*. Yeah, if we can get a 5*/4* big - sign me up. But in the meantime, the main way to win and win consistently is through guard play. Yeah, you may have a ceiling of Sweet 16 or so, but the same people who are bitching about how we need a big are the same ones who are putting the pressure on Tad for not making a S16. Stop wasting time with ****ty bigs.
Dom and Lucas are not stiffs. Siewart showed solid potential.
Come on, the example was that you need serviceable bigs; not talking about how great of HS prospects they were. The vast majority of solid teams aren't rolling out teams with no inside presence. I'm not saying you want to do this, but your fervor and language for guards over bigs would infer that you want to play small ball to the extreme, being fine with someone like Roberson manning the middle as our base group. People here may disparage him, but Gordon was a serviceable big. Miller is serviceable big (serviceable big to me - defend the other's big and grab rebounds, and set picks). We need a few of those. We have Seiwart and Tory as our bigs, and that may work. I like Seiwart, but there are questions/unknowns with his defense, so why not take another guy as insurance inside for the future? I'm assuming that Walton is still a year or two away, and Battey, despite people's love for him, is an unknown freshman. I don't get why you're so against taking another big. Yes, we need more impact players ALL AROUND, but there's nothing wrong if the staff adds another big. Even though I'm a critic of Tad's recruiting, especially with hindsight in play, I still trust him, and if he goes after Ondigo, great. If he goes after a perimeter guy, fine. I get why you're disappointed with Wes this past year, but he was still worth a roster spot. Outside of what is an obvious project in Walton, not sure what you mean by "stop wasting time with ****ty bigs." Would you rather we not had Miller and Gordon last year, but instead, their equivalent as perimeter players?
Then comes the worst part. Dom's inability to play good defense. Most of Dom's defensive liabilities come because he just isn't as quick as most of his competition (Including players on teams like Fort Hayes State). So he has to play off or get burned...but he also will be entirely too casual at times, which exacerbates his physical liabilities. Put Dom's offensive numbers with his defense and you have....a big stiff.
Honestly, my technique to roster building in the current situation we have (bubble team most years, working on building a program up) is to take 1 big, 1 PG and fill the rest of every class with wings with talent. Great bigs are always in demand, and are a lot harder to project down the line. We're not at the point where quality bigs will search us out either unless we get lucky and they're in our back yard (Jelly, Wes) or something weird happens with their recruitment and they come free late (Siewart).
As for Wes, man, I'm not sure where you're getting that I was down on him. I think I was the only person on this board defending him for most of this season. He was the only reason our team wasn't a defensive disaster out there. I totally get the value of it. And I'm not against Ondigo in general - he seems fine. I just constantly see people bitching about how we need bigs and how bigs are the reason that games are won and it's just not true. Mark Titus has a theory that every national champion for the last 20+ years (I can't remember the exact number) has had a "Top 20 KenPom defense and an NBA guard".
2017 Final Four:
* Gonzaga - #1 KenPom D; Nigel Williams-Goss (DraftExpress - 2nd rd pick in 2018 mock)
* South Carolina - #2 KenPom D; Sindarius Thornwell (DraftExpress - 2nd rd pick in 2017 mock), PJ Dozier (DraftExpress - 2nd rd pick in 2018 mock)
* North Carolina - #17 KenPom D; Justin Jackson (DraftExpress - 1st rd pick in 2017 mock), Theo Pinson (DraftExpress - 2nd rd pick in 2018 mock)
* Oregon - #18 KenPom D; Dillon Brooks (DraftExpress - 2nd rd pick in 2017 mock)
All four of those teams get contributions from big men, but all of them are reliant upon guards. Not listed up there are guys like Joel Barry for UNC, Josh Perkins and Jordan Matthews for Gonzaga, Duane Notice of SC and Tyler Dorsey and Dylan Ennis of Oregon. Guards and defense drive college basketball. Hell, our best teams in the last few years have all been guard driven (Dinwiddie & Booker in '13, Burks & Higgins in '11).
Also, you talk about how you think Battey is an "unknown freshman" - so how does bringing in another unknown frosh solve the problem? Don't get me wrong, if we're talking transfers, hell yes, sign me up. But man, HS bigs are so damn hard to judge (and you can legitimately question this staff's ability to judge them going off of the performance of our big recruits so far) that why risk potentially striking out twice in the hope that just one lands? That's how you end up with Ben Mills on scholarship for 4 years (and I love Ben, but...). Go the Villanova route. Go 2005 Illinois. Go heavy on guards. Yeah, there's the potential that a team with giants up front may be able to cause chaos on our defense, but they have to then have one of the bigs guard someone quicker than them so it's a two way street. And honestly, how many teams in college hoops can throw legit quality bigs out there? UCLA is the only one that comes to mind immediately. There are other teams that have potential, but usually after the first two it gets a little sketchy.
(and God I hope you and @Buffnik are right about Miller and I'm wrong. I'm still not fully convinced he's a quality starting P12 big).
Your point isn't lost - teams that can throw out multiple bigs is rare. In addition to UCLA, there is Kentucky, UNC, etc. But I'm not saying we need to have a Welsh and Leaf or Meeks and Hicks. I wouldn't MIND it of course, but I'm scared about next year's inside. We have Tory...and that's it. I think he's decent, but you have your reservations for a reason. Seiwart showed us promise, and I'm hopeful for Battey but not as high as most on these boards are. If Tory gets in foul trouble or gets injured, and Seiwart doesn't progress as want, we're left with one freshman as an option. I'd just like it to be TWO freshmen to battle it out and win the playing time. I'd like to have four options that I can plug in as my big at any one time, even if only 2-3 get the majority of minutes. The rest, sure, fill in with all the guards and perimeter guys.
Your point isn't lost - teams that can throw out multiple bigs is rare. In addition to UCLA, there is Kentucky, UNC, etc. But I'm not saying we need to have a Welsh and Leaf or Meeks and Hicks. I wouldn't MIND it of course, but I'm scared about next year's inside. We have Tory...and that's it. I think he's decent, but you have your reservations for a reason. Seiwart showed us promise, and I'm hopeful for Battey but not as high as most on these boards are. If Tory gets in foul trouble or gets injured, and Seiwart doesn't progress as want, we're left with one freshman as an option. I'd just like it to be TWO freshmen to battle it out and win the playing time. I'd like to have four options that I can plug in as my big at any one time, even if only 2-3 get the majority of minutes. The rest, sure, fill in with all the guards and perimeter guys.
You ignore Walton in this paragraph. You even mentioned him earlier. He's no doubt an unknown quantity at this point, but we will have two freshman after Tory and Siewart, Battey and Walton.
Honest question - do you think Ondingo would be more ready to provide quality minutes this year than Walton who RS'd last year? I'll fully admit I'm not as up to date on Ondingo as I should be, but I would think the RS frosh who has been here working on his game and practicing against men would be more ready to step in in case Battey isn't ready.