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Pac 12 players threaten opt-out of 2020 CFB season unless health and safety and other demands are met

100% agree, although none of the democrats here will agree with you. They want 50%? Strip everything they get for free and give them 50% and you’re on your own. No free housing, food, tickets or other perks. But just like the employee you want to become, you can be fired at any time.

This would be awesome actually, no more useless players on scholarships anymore! Colleges can’t afford to pay their players gobs of money and coddle them. The idea that scholarships are valuable for playing football is always contentious around here and always shot down.

Well, if scholarships and what they get are useless, they don’t need them right?
Lol, why is this political for you? Okay, nevermind, I really want to respond to the bolded. Instead of a scholarship with a promise now of four years, they would sign contracts to get paid for four years. Just like the employee (NFL style) they want to become. So they can't just be fired without cause per however those contracts work out.
 
I'm not clear that adding more scholarship sports satisfies the demand for sharing 50% of a sports' revenue across athletes in that sport
Read the demand(s) carefully, they're not asking for any particular "sport's revenue" to be distributed evenly across that particular sport; they're asking for "conference revenue" to be distributed evenly across athletes "in their respective sports."

There's lots of room for compromise here, and importantly, those compromises don't necessarily include pay for play.
 
Read the demand(s) carefully, they're not asking for any particular "sport's revenue" to be distributed evenly across that particular sport; they're asking for "conference revenue" to be distributed evenly across athletes "in their respective sports."

There's lots of room for compromise here, and importantly, those compromises don't necessarily include pay for play.
Here's the exact quote. We may have fundamental differences in our understanding of English.

Distribute 50% of each sport’s total conference revenue evenly among athletes in their respective sports
 
And that reason is 100% obedience, because lives depend on following orders. While I get the athletic team concept has similarities, it is obviously not as extreme a situation and student athletes do not sign up for the same rigidity imo.
Student athletes didn’t sign up for rigidity?! Ha, I take it you didn’t play any sports.
 
I honestly have no idea, but it would be surprising if it was 50% (in a P5 conference at least).

It also depends on how much spending you classify into that number - I mean some facility spending could be put in there, but probably not all facility spending.

It's noteworthy that they're asking for all athletes to be covered equally - so no more disparate facilities for football vs say cross-country.

Anyway - if you look at this as a negotiation you can see that there is *a lot* of room for compromise here, and there are lots of possible compromises that don't include "pay for play."
- CU Boulder Out of State Tuition, which is what all scholarship athletes are classified as, costs right around $40k/year. If you average that across the conference of 7k athletes, that's $280m just for tuition.

- On campus housing is $16k/year (includes 19 meals per week) x 7000 = $112m

So tuition, room & board alone has already brought the total cost for all Pac 12 athletes to around $390m and 50% of the total conference rev share according to the numbers above is around $265m. Players are already getting well over a 50% revenue share, they just aren't getting it in the form of cash money.
 
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If you eliminate the student part, how does it maintain any affiliation with the university. Why would a University that has well in excess of a $1 billion per year in revenue care to burden itself with a sport that has massive liability? The whole premise from the start of college sports was the fulfillment of the well rounded education - mind/body thing. Once the affiliation with the University dies, it dissolves into basically nothing more than a minor league team and at that point I am not paying $3200+ per year for 4 season tickets. Maybe $300 tops. At that point, I will just watch NFL or a local small college team.
 
If you eliminate the student part, how does it maintain any affiliation with the university. Why would a University that has well in excess of a $1 billion per year in revenue care to burden itself with a sport that has massive liability? The whole premise from the start of college sports was the fulfillment of the well rounded education - mind/body thing. Once the affiliation with the University dies, it dissolves into basically nothing more than a minor league team and at that point I am not paying $3200+ per year for 4 season tickets. Maybe $300 tops. At that point, I will just watch NFL or a local small college team.

Athletics drives donations to the university. The universities will do what it takes to keep the athletic programs on site. Not sure how it would fit into their "mission" though.
 
If you eliminate the student part, how does it maintain any affiliation with the university. Why would a University that has well in excess of a $1 billion per year in revenue care to burden itself with a sport that has massive liability? The whole premise from the start of college sports was the fulfillment of the well rounded education - mind/body thing. Once the affiliation with the University dies, it dissolves into basically nothing more than a minor league team and at that point I am not paying $3200+ per year for 4 season tickets. Maybe $300 tops. At that point, I will just watch NFL or a local small college team.
Because they would still get $$$ from licensing deals, donations, more regular students wanting to attend, etc. Universities need athletics and the athletics also need the University branding and affiliation. If the Buffs broke away from the University, they wouldn't be able to carry the logo or naming anymore. They'd be called the Boulder Bison or some **** and nobody would care about them anymore. Someone said it earlier, but fans care about the name on the front a whole helluva lot more than the name on the back.
 
- CU Boulder Out of State Tuition, which is what all scholarship athletes are classified as, costs right around $20k/year. If you average that across the conference of 7k athletes, that's $140m just for tuition.

- On campus housing is $16k/year (includes 19 meals per week) x 7000 = $112m

So tuition, room & board alone has already brought the total cost for all Pac 12 athletes to around $250m and 50% of the total conference rev share according to the numbers above is around $265m. Players are already getting a 50% revenue share, they just aren't getting it in the form of cash money.
Not to argue but where did you get 20K a year. I found closer to 35K year.
 
- CU Boulder Out of State Tuition, which is what all scholarship athletes are classified as, costs right around $20k/year. If you average that across the conference of 7k athletes, that's $140m just for tuition.

- On campus housing is $16k/year (includes 19 meals per week) x 7000 = $112m

So tuition, room & board alone has already brought the total cost for all Pac 12 athletes to around $250m and 50% of the total conference rev share according to the numbers above is around $265m. Players are already getting a 50% revenue share, they just aren't getting it in the form of cash money.
Where did you get that OOS tuition number? I looked it up and the CU site says $41k/year.
 
Here's the exact quote. We may have fundamental differences in our understanding of English.
What's the "their" refer to? The athletes or the the sport?

There is a much easier and more clear wording if you want to keep the money a sport generates within that sport:

Distribute 50% of each sport’s total conference revenue evenly among athletes in that sport

or you could go with

Distribute 50% of each sport’s total conference revenue evenly among athletes in the respective sports

Instead we have a sort of odd "their" that could just as easily be interpreted that athletes within sports have to be treated equally, but don't need to be treated that way across sports.

It's a negotiation.

Treat it as such, and you can get somewhere.

Ridiculing the effort will do nothing but hasten the collapse of the entire system.
 
Because they would still get $$$ from licensing deals, donations, more regular students wanting to attend, etc. Universities need athletics and the athletics also need the University branding and affiliation. If the Buffs broke away from the University, they wouldn't be able to carry the logo or naming anymore. They'd be called the Boulder Bison or some **** and nobody would care about them anymore. Someone said it earlier, but fans care about the name on the front a whole helluva lot more than the name on the back.
See my post above. Also if they cease to become students, the tax deductability of donations to athletics, which helps fund them, becomes questionable, heck congress already eliminated deductability of mandatory donations (seat licenses). It is my opinion that once athlete cease being students and become mere employees the value proposition, emotional attachment, and relationship to the University will cease. The money is there because people went to school with the players, they sent their kids to go to school there, some played there, etc.. Nobody feels that way about the time they spent at AA or AAA. Can you command premium pricing for professional football when the NFL is already there? Is the TV interest going to be there?
 
Not to argue but where did you get 20K a year. I found closer to 35K year.
Where did you get that OOS tuition number? I looked it up and the CU site says $41k/year.
Whoops, I missed the whole "per semester" thing. Thanks, so basically, scholarships cover the entirety of the 50% revenue share from the Pac 12 model.

Edit: Was the 7k athlete number how many are on scholarship or how many there are period?
 
Lol, why is this political for you? Okay, nevermind, I really want to respond to the bolded. Instead of a scholarship with a promise now of four years, they would sign contracts to get paid for four years. Just like the employee (NFL style) they want to become. So they can't just be fired without cause per however those contracts work out.

Why would they sign a 4 year contract if some want them to not be students at all? It’s not political, I just knew which posters would throw a fit.
 
Whoops, I missed the whole "per semester" thing. Thanks, so basically, scholarships cover the entirety of the 50% revenue share from the Pac 12 model.

Edit: Was the 7k athlete number how many are on scholarship or how many there are period?


That’s all I could find was 7K, I’d imagine the majority are scholarship. You have 1,020 football players from 12 schools.
 
What's the "their" refer to? The athletes or the the sport?

There is a much easier and more clear wording if you want to keep the money a sport generates within that sport:

Distribute 50% of each sport’s total conference revenue evenly among athletes in that sport

or you could go with

Distribute 50% of each sport’s total conference revenue evenly among athletes in the respective sports

Instead we have a sort of odd "their" that could just as easily be interpreted that athletes within sports have to be treated equally, but don't need to be treated that way across sports.

It's a negotiation.

Treat it as such, and you can get somewhere.

Ridiculing the effort will do nothing but hasten the collapse of the entire system.
you lost me. I'm positive 'their' refers to athletes playing whatever sports' revenue we're discussing. "Their" cannot refer to the sports, it must, by definition, refer to the people playing the sports.

ACK this is a negotiation.

I don't feel I'm ridiculing this in any way.
 
TV revenue is proportional with viewership. There is a point where people say, “this is too expensive.”

Or did you miss everyone cutting cable?
And it still doesn’t matter. Sports is still a “must have” for people that they’ll seek out and pay significant premiums to watch. College football is still big business.
 
This isn't necessarily specific to the ADs, but the players need to be careful what they wish for as there are going to be some serious unintended consequences. I hope the players don't believe that 50% revenue sharing simply means they keep getting everything they have right now, plus an extra $100k/year or something. Guaranteed scholarships WILL go away, players will be on their own for food, housing, tuition (another can of worms with in-state/out of state tuition/public/private), books, medical, etc.




I didn't realize that their scholarships will go away but makes sense and I'm sure the players don't realize that. But the 50% revenue is the most ludicrous and unrealistic of the demands. As noted not only would it kill all non-revenue sports but it wouldn't even be legal under Title IX. And no way are schools going to tap into their endowment to reinstate discontinued sports unless they have a separate piece of the endowment set aside for athletics.
 

That’s all I could find was 7K, I’d imagine the majority are scholarship. You have 1,020 football players from 12 schools.
That number includes all full scholarship, partials, and walk-ons. 7k/12 is 583 per school and you don't have that many scholarships available. I may be off a little but by adding up all the limits in the NCAA manual there are 237.5 scholarships for women and 221.3 for men, which is 458.8 total for every NCAA sponsored sport.
 
That number includes all full scholarship, partials, and walk-ons. 7k/12 is 583 per school and you don't have that many scholarships available. I may be off a little but by adding up all the limits in the NCAA manual there are 237.5 scholarships for women and 221.3 for men, which is 458.8 total for every NCAA sponsored sport.

Okay, yeah I was not sure, I looked but couldn’t find it. The next question is who would pay for free? Can’t imagine anyone would unless they’re getting all the perks and the scholarship. A way to entice guys who just want to get an education and know they’re not NFL bound.

458.8X12 = 5,505.
265M/5,505= 48,138

Better than minimum wage I guess.
 
And it still doesn’t matter. Sports is still a “must have” for people that they’ll seek out and pay significant premiums to watch. College football is still big business.

You say this in a world in which college players are students and athletes and play for the schools. In a world where they are no more than a paid employee not affiliated with the university in any way, that won’t be the same. Especially when they send out season tickets asking for triple the price and 3X the donation amount to make up the 15 million dollars they now lose every year. You mentioned TV rights, 50% is 50% and that 50% comes out of my pocket? No thanks. I’m supporting CU when I go, not paying minor league players.

They don’t double over night. You need 550 million to pay the P12 schools 100k for each player. They didn’t even earn that as a whole in 2019.

The B10 lead the way at 759 million and 50% would still only net 68K.

Your dream isn’t even CLOSE to a reality.
 
We’re all assuming that players would want revenues split evenly amongst all players, but how long do you think star QBs are going to be ok taking the same as a freshman 3rd stringer?

Whatever this results in, I don’t see it being anything but bad for non-revenue sports. To be very clear, this is NOT a list of demands aimed at improving life for student-athletes, it a list of demands aimed at improving life for Football players.
 
We’re all assuming that players would want revenues split evenly amongst all players, but how long do you think star QBs are going to be ok taking the same as a freshman 3rd stringer?

Whatever this results in, I don’t see it being anything but bad for non-revenue sports.

I’d love to see that lawsuit from other D1 players. Gotta pay em all if you’re going to pay any of them.
 
This is why the players are in fantastic bargaining position. The schools need the sports more than the players need the scholarships.
I don't know, the players aren't going to get paid like they want to without the big money that comes with CFB, but ONLY if "college football" is still actually associated with the Universities. Everyone needs each other pretty equally, tbh.
 
I didn't realize that their scholarships will go away but makes sense and I'm sure the players don't realize that. But the 50% revenue is the most ludicrous and unrealistic of the demands. As noted not only would it kill all non-revenue sports but it wouldn't even be legal under Title IX. And no way are schools going to tap into their endowment to reinstate discontinued sports unless they have a separate piece of the endowment set aside for athletics.
it didn't jump out until I read your post, but yes, 50% of [top line] revenue is a lot (vs 50% of profits). like @skibum said though, this is a negotiation and that's their opening position.
 
I don't know, the players aren't going to get paid like they want to without the big money that comes with CFB, but ONLY if "college football" is still actually associated with the Universities. Everyone needs each other pretty equally, tbh.
College football can’t make big money without really good players. If the best players aren’t involved, the revenue isn’t there. That’s why so few non P5 schools make big money. The players are the thing. The only reason why the schools matter today is because of tradition. The money comes from the quality of play.
 
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