UCF going all in on national champions claim, planning parade to celebrate

[Buffnik]

This is just not possible to resolve and argue about because of the core schedule and the league they play in! If all 66 Power 5 teams were to play the exact same schedule that UCF played, there would likely have been at least 6-8 undefeated teams or maybe more. You cannot compare them, and you cannot even really allow the G5 teams a spot into the CFP because there is no way to balance the starting points. It would be like having a Canadian Football Team sliding into the NFL Playoffs. I like G5 football, and they are in a tough spot. I really think they should immediately create a G5 Playoff next year for 8 teams, as well as tightening up the actual G5 conferences into 7 or 8, so that it works slick. I have got to think that based on the locations for the playoffs, and a nice TV Package, they could make this work. Take 7 lower bowl games out of normal rotation and put them to work in the G5 Playoff.

I liked the UCF Story, until they did this, and now I look forward to Heupel taking the team into the ground. Good riddance.

We've got 65 P5 programs out of 129 FBS programs. That's half. Even if this expanded to 72 to bring in the best of the G5, there's still enough G5 left over to create its own division.

With what's left of the AAC, the MWC, the MAC, the Sun Belt, C-USA and Independents, they'd have enough teams.

Frankly, what should happen is that we end up with 5 Divisions for NCAA football.

Division I = current P5 FBS
Division II = current G5 FBS + invites of best FCS programs
Division III = current FCS
Division IV = what we currently call Division II
Division V = what we currently call Division III

It's very close to what we have right now except that for some reason the NCAA breaks out D1 into 2 sub-divisions with different rules and then the structure for the top sub-division is completely unbalanced.

 

[jizzrag85]

This is just not possible to resolve and argue about because of the core schedule and the league they play in! If all 66 Power 5 teams were to play the exact same schedule that UCF played, there would likely have been at least 6-8 undefeated teams or maybe more. You cannot compare them, and you cannot even really allow the G5 teams a spot into the CFP because there is no way to balance the starting points. It would be like having a Canadian Football Team sliding into the NFL Playoffs. I like G5 football, and they are in a tough spot. I really think they should immediately create a G5 Playoff next year for 8 teams, as well as tightening up the actual G5 conferences into 7 or 8, so that it works slick. I have got to think that based on the locations for the playoffs, and a nice TV Package, they could make this work. Take 7 lower bowl games out of normal rotation and put them to work in the G5 Playoff.

I liked the UCF Story, until they did this, and now I look forward to Heupel taking the team into the ground. Good riddance.

Bingo.

 

[SINKRATZ]

G5 National Champs - congratulations.

 

[4BienemyTDs]

We've got 65 P5 programs out of 129 FBS programs. That's half. Even if this expanded to 72 to bring in the best of the G5, there's still enough G5 left over to create its own division.

With what's left of the AAC, the MWC, the MAC, the Sun Belt, C-USA and Independents, they'd have enough teams.

Frankly, what should happen is that we end up with 5 Divisions for NCAA football.

Division I = current P5 FBS
Division II = current G5 FBS + invites of best FCS programs
Division III = current FCS
Division IV = what we currently call Division II
Division V = what we currently call Division III

It's very close to what we have right now except that for some reason the NCAA breaks out D1 into 2 sub-divisions with different rules and then the structure for the top sub-division is completely unbalanced.

I just googled this article and learned a lot about what I thought I was talking about! Some of my facts are not solid, and my ideas may not be realistic based on the information in this Forbes article. The G5 Schools are happy just sitting back and getting a CFP Check. I would just be so frustrated sitting back and accepting at most a league title. No good answer I guess?

https://www.forbes.com/sites/kristi...playoff-coming-dont-count-on-it/#4067a48213c5

 

[AeroBuff99]

1. There is no national champion. The CFP winner is awarded the coaches trophy. The AP still awards its own trophy, so theoretically they could award it to UCF.
2. The committee is complete crap and they know it. They might as well say their charter is to make ESPN happy. They have no set criteria to go off of.
3. People worried about the regular season not mattering if they expand the playoffs, well they don't matter now.

 

[somebody]

UCF was 10th in the last AP poll and won their bowl game, so they will rise. They will not be #1.

 

[DBT]

At least they can console themselves with a cheap trip to Disney World.

 

[hokiehead]

Does everyone view the relegation of G5 schools to another league/division/whatever as a good thing? To me, that just creates a situation where nobody except the existing P5 members will have a shot at the big money.

 

[somebody]

Does everyone view the relegation of G5 schools to another league/division/whatever as a good thing? To me, that just creates a situation where nobody except the existing P5 members will have a shot at the big money.

That would be a primary motivation - why would P5 schools want to share if they can avoid it?

 

[J.R. Ewing]

I still like the idea of a 6 team playoff. The 5 P5 champions and the top G5 school.

oh, and **** Notre Dame.

 

[hokiehead]

That would be a primary motivation - why would P5 schools want to share if they can avoid it?

may not be technically correct legally when applying to universities, but it seems like collusion to create a trust (i.e. creating a system where only the current P5 conferences can fully participate guarantees that). I think we should have a system where schools have a chance to move up.

of course, we've already seen changes since the playoffs started that moved the trend in this direction: (1) all P5 schools adopting scheduling rules requiring scheduling of at least one P5 school OOC, as well as (2) three of the P5 conferences going to 9 game conference schedules have combined to deprive G5 schools already (a) from opportunities to earn regular season revenue and build their brand by playing bigger schools (b) increase likelihood G5 schools can't achieve the SoS necessary to qualify for the CFP.

 

[Buffnik]

Does everyone view the relegation of G5 schools to another league/division/whatever as a good thing? To me, that just creates a situation where nobody except the existing P5 members will have a shot at the big money.

How is that any different other than being honest about things?

 

[Buffnik]

may not be technically correct legally when applying to universities, but it seems like collusion to create a trust (i.e. creating a system where only the current P5 conferences can fully participate guarantees that). I think we should have a system where schools have a chance to move up.

of course, we've already seen changes since the playoffs started that moved the trend in this direction: (1) all P5 schools adopting scheduling rules requiring scheduling of at least one P5 school OOC, as well as (2) three of the P5 conferences going to 9 game conference schedules have combined to deprive G5 schools already (a) from opportunities to earn regular season revenue and build their brand by playing bigger schools (b) increase likelihood G5 schools can't achieve the SoS necessary to qualify for the CFP.

Driven mostly by the media deals and pressure to provide content. Also conferences owning their own networks. Also, challenges with attendance.

The viewing public would rather see VA Tech playing South Carolina or North Carolina than East Carolina.

 

[BehindEnemyLines]

At least they can console themselves with a cheap trip to Disney World.

I heard they have parades every day in Orlando.

 

[Shldr2Shldr]

Can't blame them for trying. Under the current system they will NEVER have a chance to play for, let alone win, the CFP National Championship.

 

[leftybuff]

Some aren't going to be happy until everybody gets an orange slice....

 

[somebody]

Driven mostly by the media deals and pressure to provide content. Also conferences owning their own networks. Also, challenges with attendance.

The viewing public would rather see VA Tech playing South Carolina or North Carolina than East Carolina.

As you said in another post, it's just more honest. It's going to be nearly impossible for a G5 to show enough schedule to warrant inclusion in the current playoff system.

 

[Shldr2Shldr]

Some aren't going to be happy until everybody gets an orange slice....

Don't think that is what this is about. I think this is more of a protest of the current system than an actual belief that they won a title. UCF wants the opportunity to play for the real national championship. With the current format, they don't even get that.

They don't necessarily want the orange slice, but they want to be able to go to the store and buy some oranges.

 

[Alfred91]

Sports are supposed to be fun.

Let them have their fun.

I hear all the "they'd never beat Bama", "they'd never have gone undefeated in a P5 conference", "tons of P5 schools would have gone undefeated with UCF's schedule", etc arguments. Probably true, but why do we care? They're not in the playoff, they didn't play in a P5 conference, no P5 schools played UCF's schedule. So really we're just talking hypotheticals here.

UCF played the teams on their schedule, beat them all, and are now having fun with it. Let's all relax and let them.

 

[Highlander]

Sports are supposed to be fun.

Let them have their fun.

I hear all the "they'd never beat Bama", "they'd never have gone undefeated in a P5 conference", "tons of P5 schools would have gone undefeated with UCF's schedule", etc arguments. Probably true, but why do we care? They're not in the playoff, they didn't play in P5 conference, no P5 schools played UCF's schedule. So really we're just talking hypotheticals here.

UCF played the teams on their schedule, beat them all, and are now having fun with it. Let's all relax and let them.

Nobody thought Boise St would beat OU in the first ever invitation of a G5 school to the old BCS format of games, either. It ended up being one of the most talked about football games of the BCS era.


And of course, the debate raged afterwards, "Yeah, but they never would have stood up to a 12 game schedule against better opponents!". I agree, but it sure was fun.

All that said, I'm still all in on expanding the playoffs.

 

[Shldr2Shldr]

Nobody thought Boise St would beat OU in the first ever invitation of a G5 school to the old BCS format of games, either. It ended up being one of the most talked about football games of the BCS era.


And of course, the debate raged afterwards, "Yeah, but they never would have stood up to a 12 game schedule against better opponents!". I agree, but it sure was fun.

All that said, I'm still all in on expanding the playoffs.

Here is a video that isn't potato quality

 

[Shldr2Shldr]

Nobody thought Boise St would beat OU in the first ever invitation of a G5 school to the old BCS format of games, either. It ended up being one of the most talked about football games of the BCS era.


And of course, the debate raged afterwards, "Yeah, but they never would have stood up to a 12 game schedule against better opponents!". I agree, but it sure was fun.

All that said, I'm still all in on expanding the playoffs.

You could add 2005 Fiesta Bowl Utah vs Pitt or 2009 Sugar Bowl Utah vs Alabama to your argument as well.

 

[Alfred91]

You could add 2005 Fiesta Bowl Utah vs Pitt or 2009 Sugar Bowl Utah vs Alabama to your argument as well.

The thing about Utah-Pitt is that, at that point, the MWC was basically as good of a conference as the Big East. Utah beating Pitt wasn't that big of a surprise.

As for Utah beating Alabama, that was as big of a case of the big time team not giving a **** about playing the little guy that I ever saw. I was rooting for Utah and I still turned it off. I suppose it was because they had shown such dramatic improvement since he had arrived in Alabama that Saban survived that embarrassment, because I bet there were more than a few boosters willing to buy out Nick's contract that night.

 

[SuperiorBuff]

The thing about Utah-Pitt is that, at that point, the MWC was basically as good of a conference as the Big East. Utah beating Pitt wasn't that big of a surprise.

As for Utah beating Alabama, that was as big of a case of the big time team not giving a **** about playing the little guy that I ever saw. I was rooting for Utah and I still turned it off. I suppose it was because they had shown such dramatic improvement since he had arrived in Alabama that Saban survived that embarrassment, because I bet there were more than a few boosters willing to buy out Nick's contract that night.

This is exactly what is wrong with the bowl system; way to many G5s playing their Superbowl against P5 teams that don't five a ****. BORING.

 

[Kameltosis]

Of course I'm fine with it, not like it matters but people saying Bama this and Bama that....#1 in the SEC is playing #3 in the SEC for the Natty. Tell me that makes sense? The SEC is TERRIBLE this year.

 

[Johnny Juzang]

It's a ****ing beauty contest controlled by the people who hold the purse strings.

Of course, when TCU went undefeated in Andy Dalton's Sr year they got shafted, too.

 

[The Alabaster Yak]

UCF playing CU's schedule this year probably goes 9-3 or 10-2. I love the people talking like playing a P5 schedule week in, week out is some daunting task. Oregon State, Cal, Arizona and Arizona State are such juggernauts, how could poor little G5 UCF ever expect to handle them?? The only teams that they might actually have struggled with on our schedule would have been SC and UW, and had UCF played them in Florida, is anybody seriously going to guarantee that SC or UW beat them?

 

[SINKRATZ]

You could add 2005 Fiesta Bowl Utah vs Pitt or 2009 Sugar Bowl Utah vs Alabama to your argument as well.

Meh, you also have the 2008 Sugar Bowl where an undefeated Hawaii got boat raced by Georgia, or last year's Cotton Bowl where undefeated Western Michigan never really challenged a 3-loss Wisconsin.

Rightly or wrongly the G5s get penalized because with Boise as the notable exception, most of them are flashes in the pan. Combine a really good coach with a relatively soft schedule and a few good breaks and every year there could be some G5 that rises up, catapulting their coach to a P5 job then falling back to the pack. There's less program building going on at those schools because the money isn't there to maintain good coaches. I know the championship is about one season not sustained success, but I think it impacts how these one-season wonders are perceived by the committee.

 

[MiamiBuffs]

We've got 65 P5 programs out of 129 FBS programs. That's half. Even if this expanded to 72 to bring in the best of the G5, there's still enough G5 left over to create its own division.

With what's left of the AAC, the MWC, the MAC, the Sun Belt, C-USA and Independents, they'd have enough teams.

Frankly, what should happen is that we end up with 5 Divisions for NCAA football.

Division I = current P5 FBS
Division II = current G5 FBS + invites of best FCS programs
Division III = current FCS
Division IV = what we currently call Division II
Division V = what we currently call Division III

It's very close to what we have right now except that for some reason the NCAA breaks out D1 into 2 sub-divisions with different rules and then the structure for the top sub-division is completely unbalanced.

You make this way too complicated and you are intentionally trying to further seperate the haves from the have nots.

The reality is that the NCAA makes it work with basketball and the lower divisions in all sports including football. Im not saying give them control. But by the way, this cluster f*ck weve been stuck with for forever is exactly because the NCAA doesnt have control.

Anyway, you simply seat 8 at least or 12 to 16 teams to a bracket and have them playoff. With a smaller bracket Conf Championship game would seed the P5 team to final 8 and then three at larges get in (no rematches allowed like 2 SEC teams). With a larger bracket you really no longer need a conference championship game because two teams from each P5 would probably get in. All games are played on someone's home field up until the final 4.

I think the big big problem, the big challenge, is schedules that are now longer than 11 games and or the CCG making the schedules too long for a playoff.

 

[Buffnik]

You make this way too complicated and you are intentionally trying to further seperate the haves from the have nots.

The reality is that the NCAA makes it work with basketball and the lower divisions in all sports including football. Im not saying give them control. But by the way, this cluster f*ck weve been stuck with for forever is exactly because the NCAA doesnt have control.

Anyway, you simply seat 8 at least or 12 to 16 teams to a bracket and have them playoff. With a smaller bracket Conf Championship game would seed the P5 team to final 8 and then three at larges get in (no rematches allowed like 2 SEC teams). With a larger bracket you really no longer need a conference championship game because two teams from each P5 would probably get in. All games are played on someone's home field up until the final 4.

I think the big big problem, the big challenge, is schedules that are now longer than 11 games and or the CCG making the schedules too long for a playoff.

fwiw, I also think we've got about twice as many D1 basketball programs as we should. It's a huge factor in making the early season and the attendance sketchy -- too many games against teams no one cares about.