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CU has rejoined the Big 12 and broken college football - talking out asses continues
- Thread starter InTheBuff
- Start date
Top 48 still cuts off 21 p5 programs. Are we top 48? Hopefully. Even then, does it change it so much that it's not even really "college" football anymore?
if we do end up with regional, rational footprint conferences/divisions, i think it will be hard to exclude anyone who is currently in a p5 conference. this is one of many reasons so many g5 teams will do whatever it takes to be in a power conference for the next realignment.
it will be much easier to build a consensus if no one is getting hosed and it reduced the threat of antirust and similar litigation maybe.
pay to play is coming. the always fake concept of "amateurism" is dead and buried.
can the schools re-take the high ground from the networks?
maybe if they work together and that will take a lot of consensus building. if the sec and big deals are really the "last" of the major linear deals, then that creates an incentive for everyone including the sec and big to strengthen their position for the next round.
recruiting is definitely going to have have change and be regulated differently, too. a players union is probably coming too.
i don't think a draft is ever happening as long as there are academics involved in the sport. but, a pay scale and benefits and protections are probably going to happen.
this is just the next round in what will be a long series of moves.
i believe that the universities are going to want to collectively own and control the sport so something will replace the ncaa and such.
it will be much easier to build a consensus if no one is getting hosed and it reduced the threat of antirust and similar litigation maybe.
pay to play is coming. the always fake concept of "amateurism" is dead and buried.
can the schools re-take the high ground from the networks?
maybe if they work together and that will take a lot of consensus building. if the sec and big deals are really the "last" of the major linear deals, then that creates an incentive for everyone including the sec and big to strengthen their position for the next round.
recruiting is definitely going to have have change and be regulated differently, too. a players union is probably coming too.
i don't think a draft is ever happening as long as there are academics involved in the sport. but, a pay scale and benefits and protections are probably going to happen.
this is just the next round in what will be a long series of moves.
i believe that the universities are going to want to collectively own and control the sport so something will replace the ncaa and such.
Victory
Well-Known Member
The networks and schools have shown they have zero respect for tradition. It will be hard but it will happen. I think we end up with 40-48 school league that has a few B1G and SEC schools on the outside looking in.
Yes please make sure you get your left wing politics into the equation.
What would each pill represent in this case?
Victory
Well-Known Member
Blue pill - move to the B12. No longer have to worry about competing on the big stage. Steady money. Stability. No upside or grand aspirations but no drama either. Live the underdog, outsider life of the B12.
Red pill - stay with the P12. Compete against teams vying for a spot in the next round of realignment in the next few years. Risk getting burned by fellow P12 members. Reward is joining them on the big stage.
JayHawk
Well-Known Member
Fixed it for you Victory:
Blue pill - You stay where you are in the PAC. You continue to not compete on the big stage but are buried where no-one can see. Low money. Invisibility. Instability with teams like UW and UO looking to leave the first chance they get. No upside or grand aspirations but plenty of drama either. You can excuse bad years by saying you have no ins to recruiting Los Angeles or Texas. Live the underdog, ou of sight out of mind life of the PAC.
Red pill - You go to the B12. You compete against teams playing on both ESPN and Fox and making the CFP (last one for the PAC 2017 UW) You earn far more money and prepare to make a better case for yourself to move to a P2 conference. You make a case by being at the top academically and athletically instead of being average or worse on both. You don't Risk getting burned by fellow B12 members in a more stable conference and have a clear path out like OU and UT if/when the chance arrives. Reward is joining some old friends on the big stage instead of playing in the forest where no one hears the trees falling.
Blue pill - You stay where you are in the PAC. You continue to not compete on the big stage but are buried where no-one can see. Low money. Invisibility. Instability with teams like UW and UO looking to leave the first chance they get. No upside or grand aspirations but plenty of drama either. You can excuse bad years by saying you have no ins to recruiting Los Angeles or Texas. Live the underdog, ou of sight out of mind life of the PAC.
Red pill - You go to the B12. You compete against teams playing on both ESPN and Fox and making the CFP (last one for the PAC 2017 UW) You earn far more money and prepare to make a better case for yourself to move to a P2 conference. You make a case by being at the top academically and athletically instead of being average or worse on both. You don't Risk getting burned by fellow B12 members in a more stable conference and have a clear path out like OU and UT if/when the chance arrives. Reward is joining some old friends on the big stage instead of playing in the forest where no one hears the trees falling.
Pretty sure this was discussed about 450 pages ago.
Why don't you and Jim go find a room in the politics forum.
God you're a turd. I just tried to make a completely asinine statement, only to read a few posts further, and find out that you beat me to the punch. You ruined my joke, Fred!
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ahoelsken
Well-Known Member
This isn't as complicated as Victory's silly matrix analogy would lead one to believe. Speaking of which.......doesn't Qanon talk about red pill/blue pill?
Show us the money, George. If you can do it, we stay. If you can't, we're out. That simple.
If Apple comes up with let's say 32 million per school and it's 100% streaming, I find it hard to imagine all 10 signing.
It must be hard for you to imagine that CU might have been working with UA to use the threat of relocation to the B12 as leverage for a better P12 media rights deal. CU isn't the first nor will be the last school to be used as leverage in media rights deals negotiations. CU can do this because they have multiple conference options in that case.
With streaming platforms, content is very important and Coach Prime is a type of content people will watch. The B12 is still going to be heavy on streaming anyway and not every CU game would be on linear TV since every B12 school would have to be on a minimum number of linear TV slots.
If we go 100% streaming, the schools would have more of the power to determine game start times with better attendance which leads to better ticket revenue which leads to more overall money earned for the AD. It's time to take the power back from the television partners. If we get $32M for streaming only and can determine our game times, there should be good gains in gameday revenue if the host schools do it right. Maybe we will see less empty seats at some notable P12 stadiums as a result.
How many times do I have to mention that the Big12 deal has 70% linear?
One thing it looks like is happening is that PACN will have its operating costs transferred to a 3rd party media company, increasing the profitability from that investment. Even if the overall deal was the same as our current deal, that would increase revenues per school. Changes to streamline the bloated Pac-12 corporate offices and staffing will also increase revenues through increased operating efficiency. While these things aren't the most important things going on, they will lead to increased payouts per school.
How is it his fault if no one is offering money? USC and UCLA left with the biggest brand in the conference and the largest TV market in the USA. How is that his fault?
We need to know a lot more details before pronouncing that he should fired.
That would be a good start.
The defacto outcome you describe is ultimately bad for the NFL. If only 40 programs control the A level game there will not be enough talent to support 32 NFL teams. Certainly at the QB position where 100 college teams Today cant produce enough elite QBs.
A quick look at the Big 12 membership and the conference culture:
Baylor- the home of Art Briles, a basketball murder coverup, Kim Mulkey and her public support of Briles & lack of it for Griner - basically all built on the Ken Starr blueprint for a university
BYU- they are what they are, a place that donated and drove the challenge in California against marriage equality (working with Ken Starr while he was at Pepperdine), has codified restrictions on professorial academic freedom and has a student code of conduct so draconian that they suspended a hoops player from the Dance for having sex with his girlfriend
Cincinnati- the first home of Bob Huggins where he had a 0.0% graduation rate and then the place that hired Tommy Tuberville
Houston- Art Briles cut his teeth here and now have Dana Holgerson who even West Virginia thought drank too much, and also hired Kelvin Sampson for MBB who had previously been nailed for recruiting violations at Oklahoma, was run out of the basketball coaches association for rules violations and was so dirty that Indiana officials had to apologize for hiring at the time they canned him
Iowa State-
Kansas- stuck by a coach implicated as a cheater by the FBI because they'll do anything for their MBB program (and they got their first natty since Larry Brown was there breaking rules), but otherwise they're fine
Kansas State- home of the largest inferiority complex in college athletics, desperately hired Huggins from Cincy and looked the other way because beating KU would be all that mattered, in football was willing to become a JUCO finishing school to no longer suck
Oklahoma State- home of all time greats like Dexter Manley who was able to pass his classes despite being illiterate, a FB coach in Mike Gundy who is a known racist, and a hoops program that hasn't done much before or since Eddie Sutton fled the scandal he created at Kentucky to go there and become the model for its peers by getting nailed for a DUI at 70 years old
TCU-
Texas Tech- couldn't win even when they had Mahomes at QB, has a culture defined by hiring Bobby Knight and Tommy Tuberville, even going so far as to consider Art Briles
UCF- happy to hire O'Leary after Notre Dame canceled him for falsifying his resume, one of the worst academic cheating scandals (punishment was that hundreds of students had to take an ethics class, not suspension or expulsion), now a cheating controversy over loaded bats in baseball, love them some Scott Frost
West Virginia- when they're not burning couches and abusing Oxy, they are committed to providing a safe place for drunk coaches like Huggins and Holgerson to be themselves as long as they win enough
It's basically a conference with the same m.o. as the old SWAC with some old time religion thrown into the mix which has seen every university with the chops to leave rushing out the door.
Baylor- the home of Art Briles, a basketball murder coverup, Kim Mulkey and her public support of Briles & lack of it for Griner - basically all built on the Ken Starr blueprint for a university
BYU- they are what they are, a place that donated and drove the challenge in California against marriage equality (working with Ken Starr while he was at Pepperdine), has codified restrictions on professorial academic freedom and has a student code of conduct so draconian that they suspended a hoops player from the Dance for having sex with his girlfriend
Cincinnati- the first home of Bob Huggins where he had a 0.0% graduation rate and then the place that hired Tommy Tuberville
Houston- Art Briles cut his teeth here and now have Dana Holgerson who even West Virginia thought drank too much, and also hired Kelvin Sampson for MBB who had previously been nailed for recruiting violations at Oklahoma, was run out of the basketball coaches association for rules violations and was so dirty that Indiana officials had to apologize for hiring at the time they canned him
Iowa State-
Kansas- stuck by a coach implicated as a cheater by the FBI because they'll do anything for their MBB program (and they got their first natty since Larry Brown was there breaking rules), but otherwise they're fine
Kansas State- home of the largest inferiority complex in college athletics, desperately hired Huggins from Cincy and looked the other way because beating KU would be all that mattered, in football was willing to become a JUCO finishing school to no longer suck
Oklahoma State- home of all time greats like Dexter Manley who was able to pass his classes despite being illiterate, a FB coach in Mike Gundy who is a known racist, and a hoops program that hasn't done much before or since Eddie Sutton fled the scandal he created at Kentucky to go there and become the model for its peers by getting nailed for a DUI at 70 years old
TCU-
Texas Tech- couldn't win even when they had Mahomes at QB, has a culture defined by hiring Bobby Knight and Tommy Tuberville, even going so far as to consider Art Briles
UCF- happy to hire O'Leary after Notre Dame canceled him for falsifying his resume, one of the worst academic cheating scandals (punishment was that hundreds of students had to take an ethics class, not suspension or expulsion), now a cheating controversy over loaded bats in baseball, love them some Scott Frost
West Virginia- when they're not burning couches and abusing Oxy, they are committed to providing a safe place for drunk coaches like Huggins and Holgerson to be themselves as long as they win enough
It's basically a conference with the same m.o. as the old SWAC with some old time religion thrown into the mix which has seen every university with the chops to leave rushing out the door.
Its not NCAA sanctioned where as all other College Football games are.
The TV people dont want it sanctioned because they want to control it with the freedom to manipulate the formula for their benefit. The NCAA controlling it risks being too egalitarian and thus too risky that their star pony (SEC B1G) might not make it to the championship.
The CFP people will never close the door on a dark horse team. But they will seat someting like 7 SEC and B1G teams and 1 dark horse.
The ****tiest not ****ty preview everA quick look at the Big 12 membership and the conference culture:
Baylor- the home of Art Briles, a basketball murder coverup, Kim Mulkey and her public support of Briles & lack of it for Griner - basically all built on the Ken Starr blueprint for a university
BYU- they are what they are, a place that donated and drove the challenge in California against marriage equality working with Ken Starr while he was at Pepperdine), has codified restrictions on professorial academic freedom and has a student code of conduct so draconian that they suspended a hoops player from the Dance for having sex with his girlfriend
Cincinnati- the first home of Bob Huggins where he had a 0.0% graduation rate and then the place that hired Tommy Tuberville
Houston- Art Briles cut his teeth here and now have Dana Holgerson who even West Virginia thought drank too much, and also hired Kelvin Sampson for MBB who had previously been nailed for recruiting violations at Oklahoma, was run out of the basketball coaches association for rules violations and was so dirty that Indiana officials had to apologize for hiring at the time they canned him
Iowa State-
Kansas- stuck by a coach implicated as a cheater by the FBI because they'll do anything for their MBB program (and they got their first natty since Larry Brown was there breaking rules), but otherwise they're fine
Kansas State- home of the largest inferiority complex in college athletics, desperately hired Huggins from Cincy and looked the other way because beating KU would be all that mattered, in football was willing to become a JUCO finishing school to no longer suck
Oklahoma State- home of all time greats like Dexter Manley who was able to pass his classes despite being illiterate, a FB coach in Mike Gundy who is a known racist, and a hoops program that hasn't done much before or since Eddie Sutton fled the scandal he created at Kentucky to go there and become the model for its peers by getting nailed for a DUI at 70 years old
TCU-
Texas Tech- couldn't win even when they had Mahomes at QB, has a culture defined by hiring Bobby Knight and Tommy Tuberville, even going so far as to consider Art Briles
UCF- happy to hire O'Leary after Notre Dame canceled him for falsifying his resume, one of the worst academic cheating scandals (punishment was that hundreds of students had to take an ethics class, not suspension or expulsion), now a cheating controversy over loaded bats in baseball, love them some Scott Frost
West Virginia- when they're not burning couches and abusing Oxy, they are committed to providing a safe place for drunk coaches like Huggins and Holgerson to be themselves as long as they win enough
It's basically a conference with the same m.o. as the old SWAC with some old time religion thrown into the mix which has seen every university with the chops to leave rushing out the door.
Victory
Well-Known Member
It’s his job to produce the returns and results. It’s not personal I just believe at the c-level there has to be timely results and if it’s not met in time then that’s a wrap given the compensation. I think >1 year is fair.
i hope it works out and am sure it will but can’t turn the marquee player event into a media circus of bad press and expect to keep your job afterwards.
I'm confused. Why would CU and UA threatening to leave the Pac 12 have any leverage to get a better P12 media rights deal?
