1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

A look at Oline play (using stats from weekly release and general thoughts)

Discussion in 'Colorado Football Message Board' started by Darth Snow, Oct 16, 2008.

  1. Darth Snow

    Darth Snow Hawaiian Buffalo Club Member Junta Member

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2008
    Messages:
    54,952
    Likes Received:
    3,488
    Prior Note: I am NOT looking at the sack numbers. Our coaching staff is on crack if they think our guys have only given up 4 sacks all year combined. The stat basically means nothing. AT best it means that Cody has been bailing these guys out by getting rid of the ball quickly (except for KU:sad1:)

    The good Head: Head had his best game of the season against Kansas and got a respectable grade of 87%. He gets a knockdown 1 out of 15 plays, which is sadly average. Him playing improved ball is very very important. Continued improvement is really important as at least ONE side of our line needs to be decent...

    The bad Head: He just is not a run blocker. The stats list him as having 3 TDB's (touchdown blocks) for the season. I am very certain that all three came on Cody sneaks. The most pancakes for Head came in week 1 against CSU at 7. The only player with a worse number is Bahr (More on Bahr in a second) who somehow got 4 against FSU in only 30 snaps. Just from these stats alone you can tell that Head just doesn't move people very well. Watching the game is also more then enough to tell you that the guy is no road grader.

    Overall, he seems to be improving, but looks to be no more then a stopgap at best (which is why MTM took his job). The Kansas game was his first and only game above 80%...

    What about our other guard, Behrens? The #s: 1 pancake every 18 plays. yikes, but (sadly) not the worst. Highest grade of 89% against WVU. The problem? That was his ONLY game in which he graded above 80%. Ouch. He seems to be wearing down, not getting better. Is this why Goree switched? Things are NOT looking good at teh Guard position.

    Now, Millers replacement Bahr.

    Since that game against FSU in which I thought he played well, Bahr has been, welll... bad. He has 6.5 pancakse in 163 plays... That is 1 knock down in every 25 plays! In comparison, that is less than half the rate of Girthy and Solder, who get 1 every 11 plays. Yikes! In addition, his highest grade is only 76% (against UT). It seems our line took a huge hit when Miller went down. Miller isn't the greatest pass blocker, but damn he could run block (1 pancake per 8.4 plays!).

    The good here? He isn't that bad in pass blocking... But again, ouch.

    Ok, finally, the good guys:

    Solder: 2 games above 80%, highest of 88 against WVU. See above #s as well. Got 9 pancakes against FSU going against their lighter line. Solders run blocking is average at best, and his pass blocking has been awful at times (although you can't blame the safety on him). However, he has been serviceable in the run game, but is not a road grader. I am excited to see what he does with another year to bulk up and learn. Overall, thank god he switched (can you imagine where we would be without him this year:wow:).

    My worry: is he wearing down as well? It has been a brutal schedule.

    Now to Girthy: See #s above, but he has been very solid. The bad snaps have been eliminated, and he has graded out above 80% every game but 1(2 above 90!), with his best at WVU at 94%. hoooraaay girthy! We are gonna miss him next year.


    Overall: This line is playing together with the same 5 starters for the 3rd time this year (2nd time for this group). The young guys just don't seem to be strong enough to hold up against the defensive lines they have played thus far. Hopefully they can step it up and gel as they get more practice time. Not playing another team like Texas or FSU will help as well.

    However, the outlook for the rest of this year is GRIM. I remember doing this for Buffs.tv last year, and wow, we were LIGHT YEARS better at Oline last year. just wow. :sad1:
     
  2. buffs04

    buffs04 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2008
    Messages:
    2,410
    Likes Received:
    171
    Doesn't exactly inspire confidence...

    Do we know who is going to play center next year? What's the deal with the guards? MTM obviously we would expect to see starting but do we have anyone competent to play the other guard position?

    Is there hope for seeing improvement next year, substantially? Obviously having Miller and MTM back will be huge but that this seems to be a much bigger issue than just the two of them.
     
  3. Darth Snow

    Darth Snow Hawaiian Buffalo Club Member Junta Member

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2008
    Messages:
    54,952
    Likes Received:
    3,488
    the common problem seems to be youth. The young guys just don't have teh strength to block against good (or even decent) lines. Thats what made Miller so special, he was ready to go from day 1, strength wise. With Bahr playing so badly, there is really only one way to run (off tackle left) unless we start bringing our TE's in on nearly every play.
     
  4. Junction

    Junction Moderator Club Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2005
    Messages:
    47,534
    Likes Received:
    1,000,004
    Great post.

    Depressing as hell, but great work... :sad1:
     
  5. El Gringo

    El Gringo Pura Vida Club Member

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2005
    Messages:
    5,082
    Likes Received:
    480
    Evan Eastburn from Fairview transferred this year from Maryland and is sitting out his mandatory transfer year. Adam over at Rivals did an interview with him and he said he's been practicing at center.

    As for guard, we get Itils back next year. Bahr will likely move back to guard if Sau gets eligible and with Danawitz off of his redshirt year both at tackle. If Givens can pack on the weight, he can play both guard and tackle.

    Assuming no injuries or academic casualties next year, the O-Line should be light-years ahead of where we are today.
     
    Last edited: Oct 16, 2008
  6. buffs04

    buffs04 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2008
    Messages:
    2,410
    Likes Received:
    171
    Sounds good. Hopefully we can get the majority of these guys on the field with no injuries or academic issues.

    Personally I don't understand all the academic issues on this team. It's not that hard to get C's at CU... particularly in some of the majors a lot of these guys have.
     
  7. buffsyko

    buffsyko Club Member Club Member

    Joined:
    Nov 27, 2007
    Messages:
    10,658
    Likes Received:
    303
    Next year we will have that depth and i'm sure will be much more solid on the 0-line for 2009.

    I would like to see these same starting 5 improve from here on out. It's tough having freshman who just aren't strong enough yet.

    If they want, I'll go play at OG. I'll picture the DL as kiszla, kreiger, clough and reilly and I guarantee you I'll have 15 pancakes a game, and i'm not talking mangino at I-hop pancakes either:smile2:
     
  8. Darth Snow

    Darth Snow Hawaiian Buffalo Club Member Junta Member

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2008
    Messages:
    54,952
    Likes Received:
    3,488
    True, very true. This year we were deep on paper, but really, that depth was WEAK depth. Too young, too weak. Next year the depth will be experienced AND stronger to boot. If the injuries had happened next year, I firmly believe that we would have been in much better shape. Our young guys looked OK in practice (the ones that are red shirting), but after watching how the who RS'ed last year are doing now, I can see why we are keeping those RS's on!

    Frankly, IF this happens, I think Grimes gets a raise. He has been dealt an awful hand this year. I mean, we are at the backups BACKUPS who started against UT and KU.

    I am hoping like HELL that this comes to pass...

    The one good thing from doing this analysis? I am now OK with our offense sucking this bad. I had NO idea how bad the Oline really was. Anything positive this offense does from here on out must be considered a real testament to the coaches (both via recruiting and coaching). I am pretty sure Bahr and behrens were not expected to contribute at ALL this year, and they are starting. Head is and was expected to be a backup, NOT a starter against the best part of our schedule :sad1::cry:
     
  9. buffsyko

    buffsyko Club Member Club Member

    Joined:
    Nov 27, 2007
    Messages:
    10,658
    Likes Received:
    303
    It was an awesome read,good stuff FS:thumbsup:
     
  10. Sexton Hardcastle

    Sexton Hardcastle Club Member Club Member

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2005
    Messages:
    17,472
    Likes Received:
    367
    Outstanding post Skye.
     
  11. 87toInfinity

    87toInfinity Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2008
    Messages:
    5,080
    Likes Received:
    276
    I'll take your words for it, because that post is long and I just can't read it.
     
  12. buffaholic

    buffaholic Club Member Club Member

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2008
    Messages:
    9,624
    Likes Received:
    1,174
    "The one good thing from doing this analysis? I am now OK with our offense sucking this bad. I had NO idea how bad the Oline really was."

    Really - you had to look at the grades to know the O-Line play was horrible? Seeing our guys getting knocked around and seeing NO HOLES OPEN for the running game wasn't obvious enough? It starts and ends there on the OL. BTW, the grading is generous. Head and Solder have had the crap kicked out of them at times this year. I've reviewed the Texas game on DVR and Head is in our backfield half the game as his man runs over his chest.

    Yes, our QB lacks some skills and our WR's are not huge threats. But the OL play either makes it or breaks it. They have a way of making everyone look good, especialy the OC.

    one guard, maybe two and one tackle weren't on our two deep 12 weeks ago. Faatagi, MTM, Miller, Tau, Iltis?
     
  13. Duff Man

    Duff Man Moderator Club Member Junta Member

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2006
    Messages:
    38,731
    Likes Received:
    3,444
    Good post Skye. It really reinforces what we have all been seeing, but it is good to see it all spelled out. Thanks for compiling the info.

    But I do agree with you guys that the o-line next year should be solid. We will actually have experienced depth at most of the positions. Unfortunately, this year is just going to have be a lot of growing pains though.
     
  14. Darth Snow

    Darth Snow Hawaiian Buffalo Club Member Junta Member

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2008
    Messages:
    54,952
    Likes Received:
    3,488
    hmmm. let me restate it. Our Oline was average to decent last year. In comparison to that level of performance, this year is not even close. Its just ridiculous. And yes, simply watching the games will tell you that as well. Note that I have NOT been one of the FIRE EVERYONE AND KILL CODY HE IS MOST AWFUL PLAYER EVA types around here because I know how i mportant the Oline is.

    However, doing the research and seeing the #s really brought home to me how awful they really are, and especially how badly we miss Miller. Him and Girthy were our two best performers, and Miller was getting better and better. But ya, I agree with ya hah.

    Our two deep 12 weeks ago sure looked a lot better :(
     
  15. Bone Buff

    Bone Buff Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 16, 2005
    Messages:
    2,373
    Likes Received:
    92
    Yikes, I knew things are bad, but daymn.
     
  16. BroncoBuff

    BroncoBuff New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2007
    Messages:
    520
    Likes Received:
    3
    Thanks for that Fallen ... very informative. The weird part of this insane depleted O-line ... is that we might have a glut next year.


    Since you're on top of all this Fallen, how about a quick nutshell on all the O-lineman. Did Faatagi blow his last year of eligibility with the grades thing, or will he have another?

    Is Bryce Givens putting on weight ... I see him on the sidelines, he looks thin.

    Who's looking like the up and coming studs ... Iltis, Behrens, Daniels, Adkins, Dannewitz, Palazzi?

    The Goree thing at OG was a joke, right?

    Is Miller ever moving to the left side? And if not, who's the long-term LT ... Tau, Givens, Dannewitz? Or, based on your info that he's playing so well, might Nate Solder be slotted in there?
     
    Last edited: Oct 17, 2008
  17. Darth Snow

    Darth Snow Hawaiian Buffalo Club Member Junta Member

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2008
    Messages:
    54,952
    Likes Received:
    3,488
    I aint no expert. Trust your eyeballs, but he won't be seen this year unless disaster strikes and Solder goes down. knock on wood.
    I liked Givens actually. Nobody else stood out to me in the fall practices, which is really the only time I have seen any of them play that I can remember. Behrens, obviously, is doing OK at best.
    no, its not. Or if it is, its an ongoing one. The guys we have at OG right now are just not strong enough and its killing us, especially in the run game. Goree will NOT stay at OG unless he lights it up sometime, but come on, that is not likely to happen. My best guess is that the dude is an emergency backup in order to keep us from burning a RS.

    [/quote]
    That is Solders spot to lose unless one of 2 things happens: 1. Givens or Dannewitz comes out like gangbusters in spring and fall practice; or 2. Miller becomes a better pass blocker.
     
  18. Darth Snow

    Darth Snow Hawaiian Buffalo Club Member Junta Member

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2008
    Messages:
    54,952
    Likes Received:
    3,488
    KSU game update:

    Bahr: got his best grade EVA!! 77%... 82 plays, NO KNOCKDOWNS as far as I know... YIKES thats a weakness. No wonder the only time we run to the right is on misdirection. I also noticed him letting guys through quite a lot. Looks like this guy needs some help.... Wonder if he will last the season without someone pressing him for PT?

    Behrens Split time with Goree... didn't get a high score (doesn't say what his grade was), and did not grade out above 80% again (only game he did that was WVU)... so again, YIKES. But Goree is back to all time D, so I guess the coaches are happy with Behrens improvement (whatever there is of it).

    Sanders 96%. kick ass. woot.

    Solder 99% :wow:. high of knockdowns etc. already discussed. looks like he is developing nicely after going through the furnace of our early season sched.

    Head Hey now, looks like he listened. I definitely saw him get toasted a few times (seemingly every time Scott was in), but look at these grades! 88%, 8.5pancakes, even splitting time with Goree!

    Outlook, Head is getting better, but it looks like Bahr and Behrens will continue to suck. Lets hope Head has seen the light! As far as Solder goes, :woot: let him keep on rocking
     
  19. MontanaBuff

    MontanaBuff Club Member Club Member

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2008
    Messages:
    814
    Likes Received:
    187
    Great post, Skye! :thumbsup:

    I would have liked it even more if there were better numbers to report, but they are what they are.:sad1:

    All of the focus on the quarterbacks this week in the media may be a blessing in disguise for the OL. Yes, there are new communication issues for the line, with each QB having their own cadence. Overall, though, having some of the limelight taken off of the group may give them some time to generate some confidence.

    It's no real secret as to why the CU offense is stuck in neutral. All we can do is hope the Buffs can get enough out of this line to get us to a bowl this year. Then we can start focusing on 2009, when the stable should be full of talented O-linemen (and plenty of backups with playing experience!).

    Go Buffs!
     
  20. 14ers4me

    14ers4me Member

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2008
    Messages:
    391
    Likes Received:
    15
    Oh, never mind.
     
  21. The Guest

    The Guest Guest

    :lol::lol:

    The difference tends to be teeth.
     
  22. Darth Snow

    Darth Snow Hawaiian Buffalo Club Member Junta Member

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2008
    Messages:
    54,952
    Likes Received:
    3,488
    I was wondering if anyone would catch that. hehe.
     

Share This Page