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Can someone explain to me how Hawkins has "set the table"?

Discussion in 'Colorado Football Message Board' started by buffs04, Nov 7, 2010.

  1. buffs04

    buffs04 Well-Known Member

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    If he was fired when he should have been, like at the end of last year, a new, competent coach could have come in and won possibly eight games this year and got the ball rolling with some serious momentum. We were fairly talented this year, the Big 12 is WAY, WAY down, and we had a fairly reasonable schedule. The only really no-hope games on our plate this year were Cal and Oklahoma. Missouri and Nebraska are better than us even with a good coach, but we could have beaten one of them.

    As it stands, we lose significant talent this year and even more the following year. We are looking at huge holes at the RB, DB positions in the immediate future and I am confident that our OL is sure to be absolutely miserable by 2012, if not earlier; not that it is any good now, but it will get worse. Major will remain the only impact player in our front seven, if he can ever stay on the field. The only position on the roster for next year that can be said to be any kind of strength at all is WR.

    Hansen will be a senior but he is a known commodity at this point and he will be a below-average QB in our next conference.

    What "setting the table" has occurred? I look at the roster on this team and the absolutely terrible 2009, 2010 and surely 2011 recruiting classes and see that we will suck fiercely for at least three more years IF we hire a good coach.

    CU is an absolutely enormous rebuilding project at this point. We have a losing culture, a loser-team public perception, little talent, incompetent leadership from the AD and university admin., and have oscillated between mediocre and terrible for the last nine seasons.


    Bringing Hawkins back this year did irreparable damage. The ONLY way for CU to turn it around IMO is to make a huge splash with the next coaching hire. That isn't going to happen.
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2010
  2. White_Rabbit

    White_Rabbit Club Member Club Member

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    Well, the next coach will have more than 6 OL to work with. Other than that it seems like he is going to leave the table pretty much like he inherited it.

    Hansen probably better than Cox/White/Jackson
    Speedy better than Charles
    WR situation is better
    TE not really sure, Deehan is good and Thornton has some potential.
    OL better, by a lot
    DL I wouldn't call it better
    LB Not really much different, Dizon and Major are probably pretty comparable.
    DB worse considering who the **** is going to replace Smith and Brown after this season?
    K/P: lol! He inherited Mason Crosby, he's leaving us with a true sophomore (nice) that got his only kick blocked and can't beat out the career 60% starter. Grossnickle seems ok other than the punt unit can't block for him or the coaches tell him to rugby it inside our own 10. Return units have nothing on the horizon that leads me to believe we'll see Ben Kelly reincarnate out there.
     
  3. TheEvilBeak

    TheEvilBeak Member

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    This will be AT LEAST an 8 yr project. CUs talent level is about the equal of a team coming off of probation. Hawk has done that badly. Some 1st line players can be had with the lure of playing time but building that quality depth is gonna take a bit.

    If you think this is overly pessimistic, keep in mind the % of guys in a class that actually contribute. Also consider the guys here now may not fit the new schemes...ugh.

    The best/quickest fix will be to keep the home state guys as best as possible. There are plenty of good depth providers here.
     
  4. Darth Snow

    Darth Snow Hawaiian Buffalo Club Member Junta Member

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    4 year project, but ya, its gonna hurt for a while unless the next coach is harbaughesque.
     
  5. NW Buff

    NW Buff Club Member Club Member

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    8 year project? 8 year to what? A winning record? A MNC? Give me a break. There may be a talent deficit but with what is here, we have a right to expect improvement pretty quick. Regardless, 8 years is an eternity in college football. 3-4 years for a new coach to get players in who fit his system. Showing improvement year over year (what Dan didn't do) gets improved recruiting classes.
     
  6. White_Rabbit

    White_Rabbit Club Member Club Member

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    Things aren't great, but there is talent on this team. Not overwhelming amounts of it, but decent enough to where the new coach should be able to come in and put is in a bowl game at least. We will have a senior QB, senior RB, good WRs, OL has numerous seniors. Defense will be the real rebuilding issue next year imo. If the new coach can just fix the special teams, that should be worth a win or two per year.
     
  7. Unleash Hell

    Unleash Hell Well-Known Member

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    We should expect a 1st year coach to take us to a bowl IMO.

    ---------- Post added at 12:16 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:09 PM ----------


    CU has better talent than you think. It's not top flight talent, but it's good enough to be a winning program with the talent we have.
    You guys were getting thumped on a regular basis not long ago and you turned out fine.
     
  8. BuffsNYC

    BuffsNYC Uptown Club Member

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    I don't think I've ever seen a team play a schedule like the one CU will play next season. Vince Lombardi's ghost wouldn't win 7 games with that schedule and these players. You are dreaming.
     
  9. White_Rabbit

    White_Rabbit Club Member Club Member

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    Really? I don't think it's all that absurd. CSU and Hawaii are games we should win. The Cal game is at home, they're CU under Hawk status on the road. Wazzu and UW aren't very good. UCLA and ASU aren't very good. Arizona, Utah, USC, and Stanford are going to be pretty difficult games to win. Oregon and Ohio State are pretty much no hope. I can see 6 or 7 wins out of that group.
     
  10. Creebuzz

    Creebuzz Club Member Club Member

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    I agree. However, we may catch a break in that Udub will be replacing Locker, Stanford needs to replace Luck and possibly CJH if he goes to Michigan, UCLA will continue to get worse under weasel, etc. With a little luck and a decent hire we could possibly get to .500.
     
  11. Unleash Hell

    Unleash Hell Well-Known Member

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    I disagree.

    With a halfway decent coach coaching a team full of upperclassmen this is what results you SHOULD expect, not what I think will happen, but what you should expect.

    @ Hawaii W. They are good at home, but still a WAC team
    TBA W if it's cal with how much Cal sucks on the road
    CSU W They are horrible
    Washington state W They are probably the worst BCS team in the country
    @ Stanford L, but that could change if they lose Harbaugh and Luck which is very likely
    @ Washington W, not much better than Wazzu and they wont have Locker
    Oregon L, Oregon is the only game I give us no chance
    @ Arizona st, W If Sun Devils play with their usual penalty filled game
    USC, L but could go either way. SC will be talented be VERY beatble.
    Arizona, L but could be a toss up with game in Boudler
    @ UCLA W, Ricky coaches this team, no good
    @ Utah, L, however that could change if Utah takes a toll of playing a BCS schedule for once.


    I see 7 games that we as fans should expect to win with a competent 1st year coach.
     
  12. SJBuff

    SJBuff Club Member Club Member

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    I think you are right. The table was set for the next guy if the next guy started this year. We are racing toward a huge cliff of talent drop off in 2012. Hawk's crappy recruiting the last two years has set the table for the next guy to enjoy a crappy box lunch in 2012.

    The new guy needs to be named right now. We need to crank up recruiting and land a great class this year so that the recruits will have a chance to get some experience before we ask them to carry the load in 2012.
     
  13. TheEvilBeak

    TheEvilBeak Member

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    8 years to where a program like CU should be...9 wins consistently and thinking you have a chance to win every game you play. There will be the occasional good year along the way but to get the consistency is gonna take a while.

    In 8 years, my boys will be pretty close to being able to go up there and making a difference:)
     
  14. dio

    dio Admin Club Member Junta Member

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    8 years? lol. Maybe, if the next coach is a dud. But a good coach can come in, get a couple nice recruiting classes, and be competitive within 2 -3.

    That is of course predicated on Bohn figuring how who that coach is.
     
  15. TheEvilBeak

    TheEvilBeak Member

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    Exactly. Oregon is the only scary P10 team and Stanford and AZ are on the rise. SC will start their steady descent and UCLA has Neuheisel. Not so sure about Utah yet.
     
  16. Unleash Hell

    Unleash Hell Well-Known Member

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    2018 Rose Bowl game

    Pac-12 Champion Colorado vs. Big 10/11/12 champ Nebraska
     
  17. TheEvilBeak

    TheEvilBeak Member

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    Recruiting may be tougher than you think. Utah offers all that CU does and is a full State closer to home for the Cali boys. New guy better seal the border.

    ---------- Post added at 07:44 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:44 PM ----------

    Would be epic if we could play in the Rose Bowl, Title or not.
     
  18. SJBuff

    SJBuff Club Member Club Member

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    Have you ever been to the university of Utah?
    Boulder/Denver > Salt Lake City by a huge margin.
    Boulder campus > Utah campus by a huge margin.
    Boulder academics > Utah by a large margin.
    About the only thing we have that is the same is proximity to great skiing destinations.
    I'm not worried about Utah stealing to many recruits from us. If Cali recruits want to go out of state I think we will be at the top of the list.
     
  19. buffs04

    buffs04 Well-Known Member

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    You are giving us every push or slightly-evenly-matched game, even the ones where the other team out-talents us on the road.
     
  20. White_Rabbit

    White_Rabbit Club Member Club Member

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    Good recruiting can be done at CU. As long as the new coach wins, he will be able to recruit. Hell, Hawk wasn't able to win and still brought in one top 25 class. The facilities aren't great, but everything else is good to go.
     
  21. BuffsNYC

    BuffsNYC Uptown Club Member

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    Next year's schedule is a killer not only because of the strength of the teams. We also have to travel to Hawai'i. We also don't have any breaks during the season-13 weeks straight without an off week. Also, except for Washington State, we play the lesser Pac 12 teams on the road . . . where we haven't won a game in 3 seasons.

    I think a lot of you, even as pissed off as you are, think things are better than they are in reality.
     
  22. White_Rabbit

    White_Rabbit Club Member Club Member

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    I think a new coach, especially one that is not a pansy bitch, will do a lot to help our road woes. No way does a coach that preaches winning and accountability go years without a road win like Hawk did.
     
  23. Unleash Hell

    Unleash Hell Well-Known Member

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    The schedule isn't that bad, we've had worse. And a lot of our road woes has to do with coaching. Special teams is another big reason for our losses this year and the last five. If we can get someone in here and straighten out these kids, we will be fine real fast. The talent is there. Not what I want, but it's not as bad as some would think. We should expect to win 7-8 games next year with a good coach. If Hawkins or someone equal to him is coaching, then expect 2-3 wins. I'm a lot more worried about 2012 than 2011 season.
     
  24. Razorbuff

    Razorbuff Member

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    I think you are overestimating the talent on this team quite a bit.
     
  25. White_Rabbit

    White_Rabbit Club Member Club Member

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    Anywhere in particular?

    I'm not saying the talent across the board is great, I'm saying it's similar to the mess we had when Hawk first appeared.
     
  26. Unleash Hell

    Unleash Hell Well-Known Member

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    I think it's pretty accurate. Again, not great or where I would want it to be, but not bad. It is talent that should have a winning season whether we are in the Big 12 or Pac-12.

    ---------- Post added at 01:42 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:41 PM ----------


    Yep, about equal talent that we won 4 big 12 norths with

    ---------- Post added at 01:46 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:42 PM ----------

    No, I have some push games with us losing. Again, this is not predictions, it's what we SHOULD expect.
     
  27. The Guest

    The Guest Guest

    The last five years have taught me to expect to get crushed in every game. I will hold on to that until shown otherwise.

    I should have appreciated the winning years more than I did.
     
  28. Razorbuff

    Razorbuff Member

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    If you think CU is going to win 7 games next year you are delusional. CU has two huge issues... low talent level and poor coaching. Great talent overcomes poor coaching and vice versa, unfortunately CU has neither. Alot of that falls on coaches for failing to recruit and develop top level talent, but sometimes the players recruited just aren't that good. If you take off the rose colored glasses, you could see that alot of the guys who are starting and in the two deep aren't quality BCS conference level players (as I stated earlier, that is a function of poor coaching and poor recruiting)... and whoever comes in here next is going to have a three year rebuilding job at minimum.
     
  29. Unleash Hell

    Unleash Hell Well-Known Member

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    If we had a halfway decent coach, we would be 6-3 right now

    ---------- Post added at 01:58 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:56 PM ----------


    Nope, we do have talent that we can play with a lot of teams. We have played with a lot of teams like Georgia twice, Oklahoma, Texas, Okie st, etc. If we didn't have talent that we shouldn't win 7 games, then we would have been blown out in ALL those games.

    The talent is there, I promise you that. Talent that should be able to win 7 games with next years schedule. The Pac will also take a step down next year. Several teams like Stanford, SC, UDub and Arizona wont be as good as they are this season.
     
  30. Razorbuff

    Razorbuff Member

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    The fact that you don't get blown out all the time doesn't imply BCS level talent. 19-39 in fact implies a lack thereof
     

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