Discussion in 'Colorado Football Message Board' started by SoCal Bob, Jul 1, 2011.
Yep. chippy chip chip cherrooo is all over the radio today gloating over his rivals award he received, as well as talking about this article.
Hopefully they promote Helfrich for the season.
im not sure helfrich is a bad coach...every coach sucked under hawkins...
I think Chippy would sum it up as follows: If you ain't cheating you ain't trying.
If you get caught you ain't trying hard enough.
somewhere Barry Switzer is thinking "i had a dadgum good run....amateurs today".
If it is this bad already wait until the rest of things come out. Chip Kelly does believe in the "If you're not cheating you're not trying philosophy." I very much doubt that this is the only thing he did that is in violation of NCAA rules.
With their basketball program under investigation and university money going out it will also be very hard to avoid the "Lack of intitutional control" ticket. Oregon is not one of the entrenched priveledged schools that gets extra leeway from the NCAA.
Now the question is how long does the university try to keep up the front of "nothing really happened but some minor mistakes and missunderstandings, we are really innocent" and switch to the "It's all Chip Kelly's fault, blame him, not us." mode. Eventually they will have to admit that they are screwed but they have already waited to long.
again, i wonder out loud how Belotti is going to fit into all this. seems hard to imagine that UO went "insta-cheat" once Mike B. stepped down...Kelly coached 2 years?
That's the big question. Oregon really misshandled this one. Had they fessed up right at the start, thrown Kelly under the bus, taken a big slap on the wrist, they could have gotten away fairly unscathed. Yes they would have had some sanctions and looked bad but the core of the program would still be in place.
Now it looks like the investigation is going to go very deep. This is going to not only stain Kelly but Beloti and the the entire AD and go even deeper into the school itself.
What started out as something that could be pegged to an out of control coach is now going into an out of control program from the top down. The more they try to ignore the more they get on themselves. This thing isn't going to just go away.
More media getting in on it.
With the sudden of appearance of Oregon as a power in football, with the amounts of money funneled in to their AD from Nike among other donors, and the type of talent they have been able to steal from around the country, this seems like it is going to be a very big mess in eugene. I have always been skeptical about the Phil Knight stuff, I have a feeling that this scouting service thing is only the tip of the ice berg. LSU and Cal paid this guy bout 6k for a package that is supposed to be similar to the one UO paid 25k for. I would hate to be a duck fan about now. This will not end well.
From the Oregonian.....
"This is the way recruiting goes,” Lyles said of Seastrunk’s recruitment. “I knew personal things about the kid. Those small things turn out to be big things in recruiting. It helps coaches form their approach.”
What kind of food does a recruit like? Who are the influential decision-makers in the recruit’s household? What kinds of perks does the recruit respond to?
Lyles said he advised Kelly that Seastrunk’s mother did not want her son to attend Oregon, and would have to be worked around. “His mother was crazy with them. Just crazy talk to the (Ducks) coaches. It was unbelievable.”
Also, Lyles told Kelly, Seastrunk loves Air Jordan sneakers.
“He’s a complete Jordan-head,” Lyles said. “That’s one of the big things he liked. So Oregon had a pair of Jordans for him --- only one of two pairs ever made.”
Looks like Lyles is throwing the Ducks under the bus...not pretty if you are a Duck fan.
People are talking like this is going to blow up UO's program. I just don't see it. It's not like the kid got a free house for his parents to live in. The kind of stuff we're seeing coming out of Eugene is pretty minor, IMO. True, there seems to be more and more of it coming out every day, so that's a problem for them. But when I look at this stuff in comparison to what USC did, it's not even close.
If you're referring to post 13, there isn't anything in there that I find troubling. Don't get me wrong, I'm beginning to suspect that my second-favorite team is running a dirty, dirty program, but the evidence isn't post 13.
Did I say second-favorite team? I'm actually starting to find the Ducks generally unlikable. I'm gonna say that Weber State has moved up a position...
One of the available sanctions that the NCAA has authority to use is to require a school to cut all ties to a particular booster. This means that the booster is not allowed to to attend any functions of the university that are not open to the general public, may not associate with university staff including coaches and administrators, and most significantly the university may not accept donations or other financial benefits from the booster.
If the NCAA can tie any of this to Phil Knight and Nike would they have to courage to take this step and what would happen to the Ducks program facing severe scholarship limits, a bowl ban, and the loss of the Phil Knight money.
When has the relative significance of violations every bothered the NCAA, CU got hammered for training table stuff that was legal by the time the punishment came down. Other "name" schools have gotten a slap on the wrist for giving guys cars.
I don't see the Ducks in a protected position. With the punishments given to USC and likely to hit OSU, I don't see the NCAA letting Oregon slide on anything.
I could be absolutely wrong because we don't know the details and this is the NCAA we are talking about which is about as predictable as a blind umpire calling strikes in the rain.
In the article, Lyles pretty much went on record saying the info package he gave was after the fact, and a slapdash effort. He said he beleived UO was paying for access and his assistance in getting the kids to sign with UO. There is more in the article and Lyles isn't pulling any punches....it is almost like he is now out of the recruiting game, and he's gonna take UO with him.
When you get down to it, USC was hammered without the NCAA being able to prove much direct involvement by coaches. In the case of Oregon, you have a "scout" essentially saying the head coach personally was involved pretty much every step of the way.
You have to look beyond the dollar amounts. Also, keep in mind that this opens up Oregon to more investigations. People have thought they have been shady in Texas for years and who knows what may turn up.
I have a feeling that Kelly will probably lose his job, but UO won't get hammered for this. Instead, the NCAA will add more legislation to the books to directly address this situation moving forward.
But, I think this is a good point. The NCAA will start digging and might find other violations that are already specifically addressed in the rules.
I didn't read the rest of the article. Look, there's little doubt in my mind that Oregon paid for more than just access for an athlete--I believe that they paid for influence. And there's little doubt that the recruiting package that Lyles put together was a decoy.
But the stuff in the article? The shoes? The food? Influences? That seems like pretty fair game--that's just solid intel.
Lyles also helped the kids allegedly skirt some of the Texas standardized testing so they could get their diplomas....whether that is how it really went down, I don't know but it looks pretty bad. But I'm not going to recap the whole article, it's a pretty interesting piece...
The shoes thing is potentially the biggest thing. Obviously, you can't give a recruit shoes. In this case, it does beg the question of how the Oregon program was able to get 1 of the 2 pairs ever made of a certain Air Jordan shoe. This could potentially blow the lid off the Phil Knight connection and Oregon turning into Nike U. The more they dig on that angle, the more stuff they're going to find.
I know! Right?
When all is said and done I think Oregon will be the hardest hit team with sanctions since SMU...
Assuming half of the allegations are true, and head coaches and other coaches knowingly and willingly paid money to turn PSAs into commits, this is the most blatant and serious offense that I have seen in college football in decades. Much worse than anything USC or OSU or Auburn has done... those programs at least tried to be discreet. Oregon's is in your face blatant.
Their actions truly deserve the death penalty. But, in Oregon's case I think a "slap on the wrist" will probably mean at least LOIC along with schollie reductions equivalent or worse than the ones recently handed down to USC. I would consider Oregon getting off lightly if that occurs. As for any situation with them getting away Scott-free? Only if the NCAA wants to assure the demise of the NCAA.
And again my big question. Does the NCAA make them cut ties with Phil Knight money? If so they are on a collision course with mediocricy again since much of what they have built has been his money.
I would assume that they would separate the "NIKE" items like uniforms and etc. from Phil's financial donations and allow them to continue recieving NIKE benefits similar to other schools but Phil's millions may be cut off.
USC set up Reggie Bush's parents in a house. For Free. The sanctions that came down on USC were pretty harsh, IMO. They lost a bunch of players, a ton of scholarships, and a two year ban on bowl games. If the NCAA comes down harder on UO than that, it'll be damn close to the death penalty.
Nik brings up a good point, and something that flew right over my head about the shoes. Only one company makes Air Jordans. I might suspect that up until the time that the kid said he wanted them, there was only ONE pair ever made. Now there are two. I can definitely see the NCAA taking a critical look at the relationship between Nike and UO and deciding they need to level the playing field.
Each of these things, when viewed individually - the shoes, the $25K (really a drop in the proverbial bucket), the speeding ticket in a rental car provided by and AD employee, etc. - are all pretty minor by themselves. But what they could indicate is that there are a lot of these things going on.
I'm beginning to come around to the idea that UO will (and should) get in trouble, but I'm still not of the opinion that they'll get what USC got UNLESS there's a lot more that comes to light.
i thought an agent set Bush up in a house and USC after knowing about it just ignored it.
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