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How much of this is Hawk's doing, and how much bad assistants?

Discussion in 'Colorado Football Message Board' started by sackman, Nov 7, 2010.

  1. sackman

    sackman Club Member Club Member

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    Preface: it all rolls to the top guy. He's not getting it done. I won't dispute that. However, how much of this is due to crappy assistants? Kiesau isn't getting it done. Collins isn't getting it done. Riddle sure as HELL isn't getting it done. Johnson isn't getting it done. Hagan isn't getting it done. Brandison isn't getting it done. I'm not even convinced Cabral is getting it done. Ambrose? the jury is out. The only guy on this entire staff that seems to actually be getting some reasonable production out of his players is Prince.
     
  2. buffsyko

    buffsyko Club Member Club Member

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    85% Hawk
    10% assistant coaches
    5% Players
     
  3. Duff Man

    Duff Man Moderator Club Member Junta Member

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    It is everything. You do not go 19-39 with a good shot at finishing 19-42 over five years without everything in the program being an issue. Hawkins, the assistant coaches, the players, the strength and conditioning program, all of it is an issue.
     
  4. Dunken

    Dunken Member

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    right now it is a whole....from the head coach right down to the practice team.
     
  5. Darth Snow

    Darth Snow Hawaiian Buffalo Club Member Junta Member

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    Equipment manager. He keeps forgetting the ****ing juice boxes and lunch pails.
     
  6. Buffalo Brad

    Buffalo Brad Club Member Club Member

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    Does not matter in the least. It is all on Hawk at this point as he is in charge.
     
  7. The Guest

    The Guest Guest

    Good question, Sacky.

    Over the years I've wondered (often right here on Allbuffs) what is different at CU than at Boise State. I know the WAC schedule is a big difference, but Hawk still pulled together teams at Boise State that were far superior to the teams he's coaching now. In fact, each of his teams at Boise State would kick the dog**** out of this one, I think.

    Something is different. Coah Peterson is the most obvious answer, and I suspect the right one. So to answer your question, the assistant(s), I think play a role. But it also begs the question of how influential Coach Hawkins actually was at BSU.
     
  8. Buffnik

    Buffnik Real name isn't Nik Club Member Junta Member

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    I'm sure some of the assistants are good coaches. But how would you tell? Besides, when the team is this bad it's not like someone can claim he's doing a good job.
     
  9. rscmac

    rscmac Club Member Club Member

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    I would say hawkins when you are up 28 and you do not make sure your OC
    knows to run the ball to run the clock out and win it all goes to him.
     
  10. CenturyBuff

    CenturyBuff Member

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    I think Hawk is responsible for it all, but he'll damn sure never say so. He's responsible for holding the assistants accountable, but never has (read: Riddle). His excessive loyalty to the assistants has caused much more harm than good.
     
  11. The Guest

    The Guest Guest

    Something else to consider is the relative success (Helfrich, Grimes, Brown) have after they leave this program. Perhaps that is telling as well.
     
  12. Buffnik

    Buffnik Real name isn't Nik Club Member Junta Member

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    It's more than that. What was the difference between Tulsa and Louisville? Kragthorpe went from a C-USA champion to destroying a top 10 program that was returning everything. And he was definitely the offensive brains there.

    The difference between a small conference program and a BCS program is night and day. Some can make the jump, some can't. Kind of like the college-to-NFL thing for coaches. And it works the other way, too. Mike Price sucks at a small conference program.

    So no matter what decision Bohn makes on our next coach, one of the most important things is that we get someone who has been part of championship level success at a BCS program.
     
  13. Mick Ronson

    Mick Ronson Well-Known Member

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    and further with the Louisville comparison, John L. Smith had some very good Cardinals teams and stunk at Mich St. while Petrino appears to have the Hogs on the verge of being contenders in the SEC.
     
  14. BlackNGold

    BlackNGold Club Member Club Member

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    It is Hawkins. It is the culture he has chosen to create. At Boise the culture was already in place so he was not able to do 180 degree change...but I remember a Boise fan telling me they would not miss him. They thought that he was a lot of talk. At CU he picked all of his people and fired the people at CU he wanted to change.
     
  15. MtnBuff

    MtnBuff Not allowed in Barzil 2 Club Member

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    I look at it from a standpoint of if we were starting over, here or at another school, with reasonable but not unlimited funds, which of the assistants would you say yes you have a job to? Which would you say no way, I would rather hire someones GA? and which ones would you say meh, maybe?

    In the order they show up on CUBuffs.com

    Cabral - yes, he has a history of recruiting and developing quality players. May be the assistant most hurt by Hawk's presence.

    Ambrose - yes, hand picked by Greg Brown who was smart enough to get out when the getting was good. Has done well with the DBs even with a lot of injuries and very little help from the front seven. Seems to be a good recruiter but time will tell.

    Collins - no thanks, in sync with Hawk, in other words in over his head. Has failed to make the adjustments needed to win games, doesn't inspire greatness (or even mediocrity,) won't adjust scheme to personel. In a word he has sucked.

    Johnson - no, see Collins above but substitute O-line for defense. Has an NFL first round draft choice and another probable high pick on his line along with a lot of other talented players yet can't seem to run block or pass block. Players don't get better under his coaching.

    Riddle - No, watch any Buff game on special teams and you don't need to ask any more questions. May be the worst assistant on the staff based on the performance of his position.

    Kiesau - maybe - seems to be a pretty bright guy who has been held down by Hawk's meddling. Good recruiter, might be better as a position coach instead of a coordinator.

    Bandison - no - not as bad as some others but talented players seem to disappear under his watch. What has he done to deserve another chance? I don't see much.

    Hagan - no - Buff legacy and bright guy who can recruit but seems to lack the skills to work with and get the best out of a lot of players. Again, who has gotten better under his coaching vs. how much talent has been run off or wasted.

    Prince - maybe - Has shown some ability to get his players ready and develop. Motivator who cares, this year must be killing him. Not a big track record to go on but I wouldn't have a problem with him coming back.

    The GAs and Interns we don't know enough about to make a judgement on. I wouldn't mind finding a place for Sykes on the staff if a good fit can be found.
     
  16. CarolinaBuff

    CarolinaBuff Weekend Poster Club Member

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    It's all on Hawk. I don't doubt that assistant coaches might not be getting the job done, but if they're not then it's Hawk's job to get on their ass or show them the door. It's his staff and therefore it all comes back to him.
     
  17. CenturyBuff

    CenturyBuff Member

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    Good post. I don't disagree at all.

    The finger points at Hawkins. He's the alleged "leader" and his "leadership" has been a sh!tslide that's rolled right through the staff and players.
     
  18. Buffellow85

    Buffellow85 Well-Known Member

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    I'm wondering why if Bohn wasn't allowed to fire Hawkins last year, that he would have at least demanded ( or asked very nicely ) that Hawkins get rid of some of the dead weight in return for a 5th year.
     
  19. CenturyBuff

    CenturyBuff Member

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    Well, my 14+ years in Colorado state government has taught me that admins and politicians rarely act based on what is the right thing to do. They generally act in ways designed to protect themselves and blame others. When GB offended those in power, he was fired. I don't think Hawk has really offended those in real power at CU (obviously Bohn is not in a position of power, he's totally hamstrung by those above him).
     
  20. BehindEnemyLines

    BehindEnemyLines beware the habu Club Member

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    The onus of responsibility cannot be delegated. This is on the leader, who has not taught the assistants and the players how to win.
     
  21. lvbuff

    lvbuff Well-Known Member

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    A couple of weeks ago Mack Brown said...If a player or two make mistakes my assistants can replace them. If my assistants make mistakes I will replace them. Seems to sum up sacky's argument in one sentence.
     
  22. Buffellow85

    Buffellow85 Well-Known Member

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    Yup :nod:
     
  23. The Guest

    The Guest Guest

    So he fired Greg Davis? I hadn't heard...
     
  24. White_Rabbit

    White_Rabbit Club Member Club Member

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    It's hard to tell based just on position by position, but the 3 coordinators definitely do not get the job done.

    OC has been a mess the last 5 years. Have we ever been in the top 100 of total yards any year under Hawk?

    DC has been a little better, although I'm not a fan of Collins' bend but don't break style.

    Riddle is the worst coach I've ever seen. The Dolphins ex ST coach was 50x better.

    I'm not really sure on position coaches, but what alarms me is you really have to think about it to find players that improved a lot from when they first got on the field to when they finished. There have been so many players that seemed promising as redshirt freshman or sophomores, and by the time they were seniors they weren't any better, or in some cases they were worse. I think that points to strength and conditioning more than anything.
     
  25. kalbuff

    kalbuff New Member

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    The guys I usually tailgate with and who played for Eddie Crowder talk about the head coach being the basic inspiration. The players have to buy into what he tells them. It appears that McCartney was good at delivering effective messages before, during and after the game. The assistants are responsible as I understand it for strategy and calling the plays. And, of course, the head guy is also mainly responsible for recruiting. This is a job Hawkins has been reasonably good at. I think he has good players although who knows about the basic character of these guys.

    Most college players these days could care less about the team's effectiveness (in stark contrast to those that comment here), but only about their individual shot at the NFL. So they are motivated to perform on the field. Coaches bring this individual ambition together to an extent.

    This team seems to not be buying into Hawkins' message, and the assistants generally lack effectiveness in strategy. Bad mix here.
     
  26. Darian3Hagan

    Darian3Hagan '89 Player of the Year Club Member

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    I would stay away from former and current players with this one.

    ---------- Post added at 06:28 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:26 PM ----------

    [video=youtube;HQqIQyT-RuM]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HQqIQyT-RuM[/video]
     

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