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Reality Check

Discussion in 'Colorado Football Message Board' started by Hank, Oct 27, 2008.

  1. Hank

    Hank Well-Known Member

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    I moved to Colorado in 1985 when I was 9 years old. I was a freshmen at CU in 1995. So as long as I can remember, the Buffs have always been good.

    My view of what had happened to program since 1994 was this: Neuheisel threw the program in the garbage can. Barnett poured the gas over the trash and lit the match. Exaggeration, but you get the picture. Although the Buffs under Barnett would have some success here and there, it was abundantly clear that the talent had declined post-McCartney. This decline didn't happen overnight. It happened gradually over a 12 year period, with a few spikes here and there. Was it an inevitable correction of the market?

    When Hawkins was hired, I thought we got our guy (I still think this - but I do have a few reservations). Last year's recruiting class was a sign that we were back on our way to where we should be - where Mac left the program in 1994. We finally had a leader that would not damage the program.

    What I am starting to realize is this: Where we should be is probably closer to the 2004 version of the Buffs than the 1994 version. CU needs much more than just a competent leader.

    It will be very difficult to replicate what McCartney accomplished. Colorado simply does not have the resources to be self sustainable. If you look at our rise, USC and Texas were in a downturn. Mac seized that opportunity and Colorado became first in the pecking order in Southern California. We did well in Texas. Now, we are left fighting for the leftovers. USC, UCLA, Oregon, Cal and maybe even Stanford are all ahead of us in the pecking order for California recruits. We have 8-10 schools ahead of us in Texas, where we used to be the third or fourth most desirable team in that region. Missouri, Texas Tech, OSU and maybe even Baylor are going to hurt us in Texas.

    To compare the task that Hawkins had in front of him to Saban is ludicrous. Just look at Barnett's last class compared to Shula's.

    Another problem that we now face is the emergence of Missouri. I view Missouri as the sleeping giant that has awakened. They had abundant resources that were mismanaged for years. There is tons of talent in the region and good financial support. Missouri will hurt us in Texas, however, they hurt nebraska even more. nebraska also has a very tough road ahead of them. They don't have great home grown talent to feed the program (albeit better than Colorado) but they do have the fan support, something that Colorado does not have.

    Colorado desperately needs to find a way back into the living rooms of the top California recruits. What we have in our favor is an outstanding University. It is a wonderful place to spend 4-5 years of your life. We have to be able to sell that. Look at Washington. I think that their path is fairly similar to our own. A great university, but they need the California talent to thrive. Maybe a move to the Pac-10 is what CU needs.

    I used to think that Colorado's success, or lack thereof, was linked to avoiding incompetence at the head coaching position. I don't think this anymore. We need someone that is truly special among the coaching ranks. Hawk may be that guy. But it is silly to think that this will be an easy task. It is even more silly to call for his replacement. What McCartney accomplished at CU was nothing short of remarkable.
     
  2. Ray Ray

    Ray Ray New Member

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    Hello everyone, I have been following CU football and CU recruiting since the 80's. I along with many other CU fans am in shock at how far and fast this team has dropped in their play both offensively/defensively. I believe it isn't just one thing you can put your finger on. Do I think Hawk is over his head...yes. I think he and his coaching staff mis-calculated the depth of the hole the football program was/is in. Hawk needs alot more tools to climb out of this hole i.e WR's/QB's/DL/DE's etc. What bothers me most is many of the posters here saying the team quit playing. Anyone who has ever played sports will tell you that is a coaching problem, from not being prepared to not being motivated to just pure and simply I dont care anymore. Since I was at work Saturday I did not see the game, so I cant make a first-hand comment. But if there is a lack of competiveness on the team the head coach has to make changes... be it on his coaching staff and/or on the team. The team cannot stay status quo or they will lose the remaining recruits.

    Okay, do I have a solution, no I do not. I have one suggestion, change the offense. Run another attack because obviously this so-called no huddle spread is not working. Run the power I. The only thing I can draw from is when I played in High School my sophmore year we were 0-7 and scored 4 td's the whole year. The coach changed our offense to fit the ability of the players from the I to the wishbone. Same players but we responded with a 4-3 record and beat 2 top 10 teams at their place. Now this could be comparing apples to oranges but it is the only thing I can draw from. Besides at this given juncture what does Hawk stand to lose? Sorry if I rambled.
     
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  3. Rraalph 3000

    Rraalph 3000 Well-Known Member

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    I think that's been one of the biggest grumbles around here both now and at the beginning of the season as it seems we had the personnel for something different in the beginning of the season (i.e. smash mouth run the ball up the gut with D-Scott)....BUT, I think that Hawk has seen that the teams that are having national success are running something very similar to this and although we don't have the personnel now, with the experience we have from this year coupled with some more talent infusion and healthy bodies next year we can make it work and succeed
     
  4. Denver_sc

    Denver_sc Club Member Club Member

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    Yes, BUT I think that if you look across college football and the different programs that rotate in and out of the top 25 you might have to admit that there are a greater quantity of capable recruits coming out of HS now. That, plus roster limits mean that there are more recruits to go around. I don't buy for one second that any particular program has to be down for CU to go up.

    Look, CU's not in a bad situation recruiting-wise. We are getting looks from a LOT more kids than we used to. Go compare how many 4-5 stars are mentioning us alongside USC, Texas, OSU, ND, etc. with how many were doing so just 3 years ago. It's night and day. BUT, we HAVE to get bowl eligible this season for that to continue.
     
  5. Darth Snow

    Darth Snow Hawaiian Buffalo Club Member Junta Member

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    Bowl eligibility is important, but more for player development then recruiting. See: Pitt for an example of a coach that can recruit even when his team is down in the dumps.

    Bowl eligibility will just help Hawk, but I hardly think its a requirement for recruiting success. Just listen to the announcers before every game, they blather on about injuries. Recruits aren't stupid, they know.
     
  6. calibuff81

    calibuff81 New Member

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    I agree with you completely. We haven't had top notch talent here since Bill left. I myself have been following the buffaloes since the late 80's all the way up until today. I have seen a major decline in they type of talent that we have been able to bring in the past 15 or so years. When he retired, He left Rick with a cupboard full of talent, we were what a few loses away from the years of 94-96 from playing for two national championships in those seasons. Who knows what would have happened if Bill would have stuck around for another few years or so. I'm sure we all miss those days when we had the likes of Rashan and Lamont as running backs where we had depth and if someone went down we had just as talanted as a running back to come in and we wouldn't lose a step. We haven't had a quality QB here since Detmer graduated. What happened to those days where we were in the runnings for the likes of a Carson Palmer, and how we went up to Washington and snatched up Adam Bledsoe. Or having the the depth at WR that Bill had with Westbrook, Johnson, Carruth and so on. The Colorado football program has been on a decline ever since Rick started recruiting for us. True Barnett was able to take us to close a National Championship game but that team was no where as talented as the teams we fielsed in the early 90's. Honest I don't think anyone would have been able to beat that Miami team anyways. We are far away from being the Colorado Team that we were all so use to seeing in the 90's. I wouldn't be surprise to see Bienemy here as the coach in the next 3 years if this continues to happen. Our RB's haven't been the same since he left; he got the most out of Brown, Purify and Cortlen, he helped Maurice Jones Drew at UCLA and look at what he's doing with Adrian Peterson in MN.
     
  7. calibuff81

    calibuff81 New Member

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    I agree with you completely. We haven't had top notch talent here since Bill left. I myself have been following the buffaloes since the late 80's all the way up until today. I have seen a major decline in they type of talent that we have been able to bring in the past 15 or so years. When he retired, He left Rick with a cupboard full of talent, we were what a few loses away from the years of 94-96 from playing for two national championships in those seasons. Who knows what would have happened if Bill would have stuck around for another few years or so. I'm sure we all miss those days when we had the likes of Rashan and Lamont as running backs where we had depth and if someone went down we had just as talanted as a running back to come in and we wouldn't lose a step. We haven't had a quality QB here since Detmer graduated. What happened to those days where we were in the runnings for the likes of a Carson Palmer, and how we went up to Washington and snatched up Adam Bledsoe. Or having the the depth at WR that Bill had with Westbrook, Johnson, Carruth and so on. The Colorado football program has been on a decline ever since Rick started recruiting for us. True Barnett was able to take us to close a National Championship game but that team was no where as talented as the teams we fielsed in the early 90's. Honest I don't think anyone would have been able to beat that Miami team anyways. We are far away from being the Colorado Team that we were all so use to seeing in the 90's. I wouldn't be surprise to see Bienemy here as the coach in the next 3 years if this continues to happen. Our RB's haven't been the same since he left; he got the most out of Brown, Purify and Cortlen, he helped Maurice Jones Drew at UCLA and look at what he's doing with Adrian Peterson in MN.
     
  8. calibuff81

    calibuff81 New Member

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    I agree with you completely. We haven't had top notch talent here since Bill left. I myself have been following the buffaloes since the late 80's all the way up until today. I have seen a major decline in they type of talent that we have been able to bring in the past 15 or so years. When he retired, He left Rick with a cupboard full of talent, we were what a few loses away from the years of 94-96 from playing for two national championships in those seasons. Who knows what would have happened if Bill would have stuck around for another few years or so. I'm sure we all miss those days when we had the likes of Rashan and Lamont as running backs where we had depth and if someone went down we had just as talanted as a running back to come in and we wouldn't lose a step. We haven't had a quality QB here since Detmer graduated. What happened to those days where we were in the runnings for the likes of a Carson Palmer, and how we went up to Washington and snatched up Adam Bledsoe. Or having the the depth at WR that Bill had with Westbrook, Johnson, Carruth and so on. The Colorado football program has been on a decline ever since Rick started recruiting for us. True Barnett was able to take us to close a National Championship game but that team was no where as talented as the teams we fielsed in the early 90's. Honest I don't think anyone would have been able to beat that Miami team anyways. We are far away from being the Colorado Team that we were all so use to seeing in the 90's. I wouldn't be surprise to see Bienemy here as the coach in the next 3 years if this continues to happen. Our RB's haven't been the same since he left; he got the most out of Brown, Purify and Cortlen, he helped Maurice Jones Drew at UCLA and look at what he's doing with Adrian Peterson in MN.
     
  9. Darth Snow

    Darth Snow Hawaiian Buffalo Club Member Junta Member

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    triple post... :thumbsup:
     
  10. 87toInfinity

    87toInfinity Well-Known Member

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    I'm going to blame RSSBot for that.
     
  11. Kameltosis

    Kameltosis Well-Known Member

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    Honestly...I think your spread has depth and can put up 6's on the board.

    A major problem is your coniditioning. You can't run no huddle spread all night long and expect to be effective unless you have god like 5star athletes.
     
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  12. Darth Snow

    Darth Snow Hawaiian Buffalo Club Member Junta Member

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    wtf? this is just an inane argument.
     
  13. Junction

    Junction Moderator Club Member

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    That was some truly first class post whoring... :thumbsup:

    I was so mesmerized by it I almost missed this...

    I think there is less than zero chance of that happening. Not only do I think Bieniemy is tempermentally unsuited for being a HC, unless he has changed quite a bit from the last time he was here, but I really don't think a lot of his methods and actions would fly as the HC at CU.... :huh:
     
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  14. SkiTownUSA

    SkiTownUSA Administrator Club Member Junta Member

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    I ****ing would!
     
  15. Denver_sc

    Denver_sc Club Member Club Member

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    Yeah, I agree that the fact that they don't run the no huddle smoothly has anything to do with conditioning. I think it has far more to do with the fact that it's not second nature. They just sort of clunk down the field and the opposing defense has all the time in the world to make substitutions, get their playcall in, get lined up, etc. This is the major problem.

    The entire point of implementing the no huddle (IMO) in Colorado is to turn the game into a track meet and take advantage of the built-in conditioning advantage that training at altitude provides (one small digression: I don't believe that the advantage of training at altitude is as big as most people believe, but that's sort of the point: if people believe it, it might as well be true).

    Once they run it for a full year I think that we'll see a much more smooth running no-huddle spread offense, but right now it has nothing to do with conditioning.
     
  16. Pale Ale

    Pale Ale Well-Known Member

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    You guys are all idiots and you are all wrong. There is no talent shortage, there is no going backwards, there is not going to be any replacing of the Hawk. 58-0 is classic rope-a-doping by Master Hawk. He knows he is a year away from beating MU, so instead of coming out and playing hard and tipping his han(sen)d he rolled over and played possum. pure and simple. Its so obvious I can't believe more people haven't caught on. The next phase will be to go down and beat the Ags with 174 total yards of offense then roll up 14 on the clowns, against their 3, with a 250 yards performance. Then, the day after Thanksgiving while all the bugeating, red-clad, mensa members (seriously, if you add up the cumulative IQ of memorial stadium on a Saturday, they just barely qualify for mensa) are patting their bellies, choking down left over rhubarb pie, the Buffs are gonna be having their come out party to the tune of 1000 yards of offense. TH will throw for 350 and run for another 100 before being pulled at halftime. DS and speedy will each get their 200 and all you non-believers will mark my words and rue the day you failed to heed the message of your new prophet, obalijah.
     

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