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How important is it for Mac to get a win?

'Tini said:
How is the proof in the pudding when most are still really young or haven't even arrived on campus? There's a difference between taking a guy with the frame and athleticism but needs fundamental and weight room work versus a guy who is nearing his max frame wise and isn't all that athletic and doesn't have much room to grow.
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In the coming years the results will speak for themselves. It won't be speculation at that point.

Keep in mind that pretty much every player on every team hits the weights and is seeking to improve their game, get stronger, etc. Improvement is not good enough. You have to be better than the guy on the other side of the line of scrimmage. It's a zero sum game. It's an obvious statement, but people tend to see what they want to see.
 
:lol: ok bro. Let's just pack up shop and call it quits. Experience, development, and coaching mean nothing. The team is one of the youngest in the nation, but despite that it's not far fetched that we could be 5-3 at this point. Older teams in all likelihood know how to close out games, which has lost us the CSU, Cal, and OSU games this year. The team is just going to keep improving as the guys get older.
 
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'Tini said:
:lol: ok bro. Let's just pack up shop and call it quits. Experience, development, and coaching mean nothing. The team is one of the youngest in the nation, but despite that it's not far fetched that we could be 5-3 at this point. Older teams in all likelihood know how to close out games, which has lost us the CSU, Cal, and OSU games this year. The team is just going to keep improving as the guys get older.
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Look, every conference has a few teams that are typically at the bottom and remain at the bottom: Iowa State, Kansas, Indiana, Washington State, Wake Forest, etc. It's true that none of those teams have the history of CU, but CU is making history now. We're looking at a negative pattern that has endured for quite a while. Since the B12 championship in 2001--this is the 13th season--CU's winning % is 38%. Right now, CU is that team until proven otherwise. Sure, teams turn it around. It happens, look at a team like Baylor. But then you need to look at what Baylor actually did to turn it around in terms of talent, coaching, resources directed towards football, etc. Look at the Mississippi schools this year. We'll see if they can sustain or fall back to the bottom. It's not easy and once you are down it gets harder to turner it around with each passing year. It's a viscous cycle.
 
For the record, look at Ole Miss this year:

-Great QB who was a juco transfer
-Laquon Treadwell at WR, a 5-star recruit
-Robert Nkemdiche DT, #1 recruit in the freaking nation

Fire power
 
Are you really trying to argue that we're not directing enough resources to football currently? A lot of the issues we had prior were administration issues, which look to be fixed. And Ole Miss is a entirely different point than I am making, so it looks like it is entirely useless to continue this conversation. But give me a senior Sefo over a senior Wallace everyday of the week. Oh and Spruce has better stats.
 
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'Tini said:
Are you really trying to argue that we're not directing enough resources to football currently? A lot of the issues we had prior were administration issues, which look to be fixed. And Ole Miss is a entirely different point than I am making, so it looks like it is entirely useless to continue this conversation. But give me a senior Sefo over a senior Wallace everyday of the week. Oh and Spruce has better stats.
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What I'm trying to argue is that to get off the bottom, which is a hard thing to do, you typically need to do something special or your will remain on the bottom. CU's lightly recruited freshman putting on weight in the next couple of years is not the "something special" that will get it done. CU needs fire power, a few very special players at a few key positions, preferably QB, left tackle, defensive end and corner. I don't see anyone on CU's current roster or in the pipeline that fits the bill. PRich was that kind of guy, but he was all alone.
 
We've had at least two HC's praise Mac after we've played 'em. Mac has the respect of his peers. Even Mac the First has come out in support of him, I believe. If for no other reason, that fact, alone, is why Mac deserves and will get his full 5 years, minimum, to turn this thing around. Because if the perception in the coaching community is that he is doing a good job in a dire situation, and he gets let go before his contract, at least, expires, who the hell is going to want this job?
 
Colorado Track Fan said:
For the record, look at Ole Miss this year:

-Great QB who was a juco transfer
-Laquon Treadwell at WR, a 5-star recruit
-Robert Nkemdiche DT, #1 recruit in the freaking nation

Fire power
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The Mississippi schools have focused on locking down their boarders. There are a disproportionate number of big and fast kids in the SE corner of the country, so effectively recruiting in their own back yard makes a big difference.

Baylor has rich alums, the fortune of Hiesman winner RGIII, who was shunned by Mac Brown, a new stadium, access to the Texas recruiting hotbed, and a quasi-religious pedigree. Parents of recruits appreciate Waco as a place where their precious little snowflake will stay out of trouble (or at least have their off field issues covered up).

Colorado can't copy the formula of the Mississippi schools or **** Baylor because our in-state HS talent pool isn't as deep, and marijuana friendly CU Boulder is known as a party town for rich white kids with a law and media habit putting the off-field behavior of student athletes under a microscope and then putting any misstep on blast.

Basically CU's recruiting position is to grab kids from the left coast who didn't get an offer to play at other P12 schools.
 
Colorado Track Fan said:
What I'm trying to argue is that to get off the bottom, which is a hard thing to do, you typically need to do something special or your will remain on the bottom. CU's lightly recruited freshman putting on weight in the next couple of years is not the "something special" that will get it done. CU needs fire power, a few very special players at a few key positions, preferably QB, left tackle, defensive end and corner. I don't see anyone on CU's current roster or in the pipeline that fits the bill. PRich was that kind of guy, but he was all alone.
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So we need a special player at all of those positions just to make a bowl game?
 
Skidmark said:
The Mississippi schools have focused on locking down their boarders. There are a disproportionate number of big and fast kids in the SE corner of the country, so effectively recruiting in their own back yard makes a big difference.

Baylor has rich alums, the fortune of Hiesman winner RGIII, who was shunned by Mac Brown, a new stadium, access to the Texas recruiting hotbed, and a quasi-religious pedigree. Parents of recruits appreciate Waco as a place where their precious little snowflake will stay out of trouble (or at least have their off field issues covered up).

Colorado can't copy the formula of the Mississippi schools or **** Baylor because our in-state HS talent pool isn't as deep, and marijuana friendly CU Boulder is known as a party town for rich white kids with a law and media habit putting the off-field behavior of student athletes under a microscope and then putting any misstep on blast.

Basically CU's recruiting position is to grab kids from the left coast who didn't get an offer to play at other P12 schools.
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I agree, the population density of the Mountain West mandates out of state recruiting in order to fill the roster. But if I could point to one single thing that would have the greatest impact on turning the program around it would be to land the top few guys in CO for a few consecutive years at least. I would devote whatever resources necessary to do that. Every high school coach, especially along the front range, needs to be made a friend of the school. Solid relationships need to be formed. Lots of time and money spent. The dividends will come. If CU is going to land four star guys and an occasional five star guy, their best shot is in state. Land a few of those top in-state guys, win a few more games, the positive buzz starts, and suddenly you have reached a tipping point. That's how I see it.
 
DBT said:
We've had at least two HC's praise Mac after we've played 'em. Mac has the respect of his peers. Even Mac the First has come out in support of him, I believe. If for no other reason, that fact, alone, is why Mac deserves and will get his full 5 years, minimum, to turn this thing around. Because if the perception in the coaching community is that he is doing a good job in a dire situation, and he gets let go before his contract, at least, expires, who the hell is going to want this job?
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No wonder you were such a big Hawk supporter
 
Just looking at Rivals: Eric Lee (Valor) and Avery Anderson (Colorado Springs)--two four star defensive backs going to freaking Nebraska. Damn! How great would it be to land those two guys and have them work out? If things fell right, CU could get three or four years out of those guys as high quality starters, which is even more important in the p12.

Obviously, star ranking is inexact with lot of exceptions, but over thousands of players star rankings are certainly meaningful. Look at teh national championship teams every year and the average star rating of their starting 22 is high. Look at the bottom feeders. The average star rating of their starting 22 is low. The correlation is very high.
 
Colorado Track Fan said:
Just looking at Rivals: Eric Lee (Valor) and Avery Anderson (Colorado Springs)--two four star defensive backs going to freaking Nebraska. Damn! How great would it be to land those two guys and have them work out? If things fell right, CU could get three or four years out of those guys as high quality starters, which is even more important in the p12.

Obviously, star ranking is inexact with lot of exceptions, but over thousands of players star rankings are certainly meaningful. Look at teh national championship teams every year and the average star rating of their starting 22 is high. Look at the bottom feeders. The average star rating of their starting 22 is low. The correlation is very high.
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We basically never had a shot at Eric. Avery got swooed though, so it was a losing battle.
 
Colorado Track Fan said:
How's it working out so far without the special players?
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You can be a bottom feeder with a losing record in-conference and still get to a crap bowl, like Iowa State at the AutoZone Liberty Bowl. Getting to a crap bowl has not helped Iowa State get off the bottom of the conference. They remain at the bottom, entrenched.
 
Colorado Track Fan said:
You can be a bottom feeder with a losing record in-conference and still get to a crap bowl, like Iowa State at the AutoZone Liberty Bowl. Getting to a crap bowl has not helped Iowa State get off the bottom of the conference. They remain at the bottom, entrenched.
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Iowa state has a ceiling.

We do not.
 
FLounder said:
We basically never had a shot at Eric. Avery got swooed though, so it was a losing battle.
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I used those guys as examples, but I'm talking more in generalities. Full court press like CU has never done before on in-state. I believe that's the best place to put time and money in the long run. Colorado is not deep in talent, but that's were CU has the greatest advantage. Generally speaking, people want to play close to home.
 
Colorado Track Fan said:
I used those guys as examples, but I'm talking more in generalities. Full court press like CU has never done before on in-state. I believe that's the best place to put time and money in the long run. Colorado is not deep in talent, but that's were CU has the greatest advantage. Generally speaking, people want to play close to home.
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While we would like to think they want to stay home and play for the buffs, the fact of the matter is some kids just want to get away and go play out of state. (John Scott)
 
Colorado Track Fan said:
troll troll bla bla bla...lazy
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If you knew anything about my posting history me being lazy in proving a point would not even be a consideration for a response. It's clear that you have no intention of understanding my argument so why would I take the time to lay out a detailed post?
 
FLounder said:
Not really,
Historically we are the second best team in our conference. A top 20 program nationally.
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Living in the past man. Embrace reality. We are in a different era. CU's winning % since the B12 Championship is 38%. That's the last 13 seasons. That's the history that matters. Outside of alums, nobody cares about ancient history. Yale, Army and Navy used to kick ass. Few outside of CU alums consider CU a top program, despite the all-time historical record. Don't take my word for it. Ask around.
It's all about bucks now, which is a shame.
 
Can we dump this troll?

1. Not contributing anything of value
2. Not entertaining
3. It's in-season
 
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