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What to expect from Davis Webb (NOTHING - Cal Bound)
- Thread starter Jens1893
- Start date
8Jah
Well-Known Member
look at most college QBs. Most don't have great footwork. Many have so so accuracy. Yet they can be effective at the college game. In 2014 Sefo stood in the pocket and threw. He got the ball out quick. It wasn't pretty, but it was effective. He is yards away from passing the most yards in CU history!
He works hard during the off season. What changed in 2015? It's pretty easy to see.
He works hard during the off season. What changed in 2015? It's pretty easy to see.
Sefo seemed to start the season off really bad with the Hawaii game. He seemed to start having his best game of the year against USC and then got hurt. Some of his issues in 2015 can definitely be blamed on the oline, but there was a definite decline this past season from 2014. Not sure where to pinpoint all of that, but I would guess it was a combination of everything. Coaching, bad oline play, regression, etc.
DeNiro
My Dixie Wrecked
Or Clark Evans.... Think about it.
8Jah
Well-Known Member
What! He passed for 3200 yards in 2014. He wasn't a top QB, but that's pretty good for a soph.
Because the only measurement of a quarterback is completion yards.
DeNiro
My Dixie Wrecked
How many wins ?
If you ignore the interceptions, low YPA, and winless conference record, the yardage IS quite impressive.
2014 Sefo played in 12 games, so 266.66yds/game 2.3TD's/game and 1.2int/game
2014 Webb only played 8 games, so 312.5yds/game 3TD's/game and 1.6int/game
You said Sefo was effective in 2014, I would like to understand what measurement you are using.
8Jah
Well-Known Member
Yards TDs making.an otherwise defective offense work
You need to pick a direction you're going with and stick to it. Are you going with the "Sefo was effective and here's why" argument, or are you going with the "Sefo is better than Davis Webb" argument? Because @Shldr2Shldr pretty much destroyed the latter using your stats.
pcbuff
Well-Known Member
To clarify, I am a Sefo fan. I am building excuses for his season last year. I want it to be line and blitz pick up, because those things can be corrected. He has shown a ton of heart and toughness, and those are things that a leader on this team needs to ingrain in his teammates. If he is healthy, I hope he starts this year. If not, I hope he is red shirted to give him the best opportunity in his senior season.
There are quarterbacks who improve their performance at the end of close games.
There are quarterbacks who perform the same regardless of the game situation.
There are quarterbacks who's performance declines at the end of close games.
The above three statements are provable facts - I know that at the NFL level people have calculated QBR for various quarterbacks in the last 5 minutes of close games, and compared it to the QBR of those same quarterbacks the rest of the time. Those numbers prove the three statements absolutely true. The same has been done, with the same result, for comparing QBs' red zone performance to their performance on the rest of the field.
And, get this, the same difference follows quarterbacks when they change teams, so it's not just a team thing.
At best Sefo belongs in the second group. At worst (and more likely IMO), he's in the third group.
I don't get why some people have such emotional resistance to the obvious fact that Sefo does not belong to the first group. Those folks are rare - it's not an insult to say he doesn't have it.
There are quarterbacks who perform the same regardless of the game situation.
There are quarterbacks who's performance declines at the end of close games.
The above three statements are provable facts - I know that at the NFL level people have calculated QBR for various quarterbacks in the last 5 minutes of close games, and compared it to the QBR of those same quarterbacks the rest of the time. Those numbers prove the three statements absolutely true. The same has been done, with the same result, for comparing QBs' red zone performance to their performance on the rest of the field.
And, get this, the same difference follows quarterbacks when they change teams, so it's not just a team thing.
At best Sefo belongs in the second group. At worst (and more likely IMO), he's in the third group.
I don't get why some people have such emotional resistance to the obvious fact that Sefo does not belong to the first group. Those folks are rare - it's not an insult to say he doesn't have it.
8Jah
Well-Known Member
If so, these aren't that different and Web had a superior supporting cast...and played against weaker Big12 secondaries.
I am not saying the Sefo was a dominant quarterback, just that he has showed more to me so far. Web seems like a great guy and I hope he proves me wrong.
I really hope Montez is the dominant QB we have been looking for...but he needs another year and our next Gen Oline.
8Jah
Well-Known Member
Destroyed?
scoob
Well-Known Member
I am a Sefo fan too. I find it very hard to root against the kid. If he starts next season under any circumstance, I will be completely disgusted and will have pretty much given up all hope for this team, however.
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Your whole argument has been poo-pooing the addition of Webb, while at the same time pumping Sefo by throwing his 2014 completion yardage at us. When put side-by-side, on a per game basis (really the only comparison you can reasonably draw), the stats that you are so adamantly pumping for Sefo, favor Webb by almost 50 more yards/game and almost one more TD/game.
Just to put this all into some sort of tangible perspective... in 2014, CU lost 4 games by less than a TD (Cal (3 in 2OT), UCLA (3), Oregon State (5) and Utah (4 on what I vividly remember being a pick 6 thrown by Sefo with about 4 minutes left)). If, on average, Webb was a TD per game better than Sefo, the Buffs could have conceivably won those 4 games and been 6-6 instead of 2-10, had Webb been the QB. Obviously not all things would have been equal between Webb's season at TTU and CU, but if all you're going to do is throw out Sefo's stats to support your position that he was and still is better than Webb, then your argument has no base.
Webb's numbers came in a completely different offensive scheme and situation. So not sure there's much to compare there.
We all saw Sefo take a step back in 2015, rather than the expected step forward. And I would agree with Duff that 2014 was not great, just a big improvement over what we had become used to.
Pass-Protection is a big deal. I mentioned earlier this year how bad Tom Brady looked against the Broncos (I'm a Pats fan, so I've seen a lot of Tom Brady). It looked like Sefo was playing against the Broncos defense all season, and that certainly is part of the story in 2015.
My guess is that Webb is being built up a little too much by some and that Sefo will look better than others think. I'd still expect Webb to win the job this fall.
We all saw Sefo take a step back in 2015, rather than the expected step forward. And I would agree with Duff that 2014 was not great, just a big improvement over what we had become used to.
Pass-Protection is a big deal. I mentioned earlier this year how bad Tom Brady looked against the Broncos (I'm a Pats fan, so I've seen a lot of Tom Brady). It looked like Sefo was playing against the Broncos defense all season, and that certainly is part of the story in 2015.
My guess is that Webb is being built up a little too much by some and that Sefo will look better than others think. I'd still expect Webb to win the job this fall.
**** you
After reading the thread, it is hard to understand how people would actually not want the staff to pull out all the stops to improve the QB position. I too root for Sefo, he seems a quality young man, but he just is not a P12 QB. Whether Webb is better or not, we don't know, but I am pleased to see the staff went out and got him.
That play still sticks in my craw and it was that play that kicked me off the Sefo bandwagon. FWIW...the Hawaii game kicked me off the MMac bandwagon.
8Jah
Well-Known Member
No one on this board is unhappy that the coaches went out and got Webb. Everyone is ecstatic even if it's just more depth.
The question is how much of an upgrade is Webb over Sefo.
Webb is expected by a lot of people in the industry to be a top draft pick next year. Should he live up to that potential, he will be a huge upgrade.
News flash - '68 doesn't like bands or their damned wagons!
Buffenuf
massive tool
Unless there's a fully stocked bar on board, you mean.....
