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Moore Out At Wazzu

Discussion in 'Colorado Basketball Message Board' started by Goose, Sep 25, 2012.

  1. Goose

    Goose Hoops Moderator Club Member Junta Member

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    A few weeks ago, I thought that Wazzu could be a darkhorse to make some noise in the Pac-12 this year. They have one of the best players in the conference in Brock Motum and a PG who's started for three seasons in Reggie Moore.

    Oops.

    Moore was dismissed from Wazzu for a violation of team rules yesterday. It hasn't come out yet with what he's done, but that's a huge hole in WSU's lineup. As that article points out, he wasn't an efficient player, but he was a good one. With this and Demarquise Johnson being ruled ineligible, unless Motum reaches a whole other level, we can start penciling WSU in with ASU & Utah at the bottom of the conference rather than keeping them in the 4-9 range.
     
  2. sackman

    sackman Club Member Club Member

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    I still can't believe USC is going to be as good as people seem to predict. I have never seen a worse basketball team than USC was last year. Absolutely atrocious. I have a difficult time believing they could improve that much in the span of one year.
     
  3. Darth Snow

    Darth Snow Hawaiian Buffalo Club Member Junta Member

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    Good news for us. They have a nice arena too. Too bad for them.
     
  4. tante

    tante Club Member Club Member

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    well we only play them once and it is there, so this can only help us.
     
  5. Darth Snow

    Darth Snow Hawaiian Buffalo Club Member Junta Member

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    dammit. of course we only play them once. Don't tell me we also only play ASU and UU once too? :lol:
     
  6. Goose

    Goose Hoops Moderator Club Member Junta Member

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    They are gaining Jio Fontan (who could be an All-Pac-12 player this season) and J.T. Terrell. I'm not saying they're going to win the conference, but they should be in the grouping between 4 and 7 where it's going to be a dogfight.
     
  7. tante

    tante Club Member Club Member

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    no we are playing them both twice, but if we are going to play WSU once anywhere, glad it is on the road.
     
  8. Goose

    Goose Hoops Moderator Club Member Junta Member

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    And with McLaughlin not going to UDub, the "road only" games just got easier. Might be the best pairing to have as road only games.
     
  9. BuffaloSoldier76

    BuffaloSoldier76 Unsound Meat Club Member

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    Weren't the Washington schools saying the same thing about making the Mountain swing prior to the start of last season? Just saying. Hopefully this equates to wins for us. Road wins are always big and tough to come by.
     
  10. sackman

    sackman Club Member Club Member

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    Help me out - how many "road onlys" do we play? Seems like last year we had UCLA and USC. So do they rotate based on groupings?
     
  11. BuffaloSoldier76

    BuffaloSoldier76 Unsound Meat Club Member

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    Pretty sure you have one road-only and one home-only pair each year. Last year we missed the SoCal teams in Boulder, and we didn't have to make a trip to Washington. This year, that is reversed (which sucks that we don't get the LA exposure this year).
     
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  12. Goose

    Goose Hoops Moderator Club Member Junta Member

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    Correct. Last year we got the Washingtons at home and LA on the road. This year we have the Washingtons on the road and LA at home.

    Edit - BuffaloSoldier beat me to it.
     
  13. sackman

    sackman Club Member Club Member

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    We got plenty of LA exposure at the Pac 12 tournament last year.
     
  14. BuffaloSoldier76

    BuffaloSoldier76 Unsound Meat Club Member

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    Truth! :thumbsup:
     
  15. tante

    tante Club Member Club Member

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    we are definitely on the radar in that area.
     
  16. jgisland

    jgisland Club Member Club Member

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    Stats! From a win share prospective this isn't a huge loss. He was the 6th most productive player on the team. His advanced stats numbers are great for him either. 40.6 efg% and TS% of 47.9.

    PlayerBrock MotumReggie Moore
    DaVonte LacyFaisal AdenMarcus CapersAbe LodwickD.J. SheltonMychal LaddCharlie EnquistDexter Kernich-DrewPatrick Simon
    Offensive Win Share4.750.561.450.891.561.561.220.351.080.160.21
    Defensive Win Share0.960.870.640.381.200.470.640.310.560.140.10
    Total Win Share5.701.432.091.272.772.031.850.661.640.300.31
     
  17. Goose

    Goose Hoops Moderator Club Member Junta Member

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    Surprised he's 6th on the team, but I will point out that Capers, Aden & Enquist are all seniors. So with the loss of Moore, they're down to only two of their top 6 players returning. Moore was 58th in the nation in assist rate and had a good rate of getting to the free throw line. If nothing else, he opened things up for Motum. Now, who's going to do that? Lacy?
     
  18. Goose

    Goose Hoops Moderator Club Member Junta Member

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    Hat tip to Pachoops for finding this one, but I wonder if this is behind Moore's dismissal. And more importantly, do we know what Snow, Rugged & Teets were up to Saturday night?

     
  19. tante

    tante Club Member Club Member

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    I am shocked that things like underage drinking happen at a school like WSU.
     
  20. Darth Snow

    Darth Snow Hawaiian Buffalo Club Member Junta Member

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    We were in the area. I can neither confirm nor deny any allegedly wrong legal advice that may or may not have been given to any current, future, or former WSU students.
     
  21. CVilleBuff

    CVilleBuff Club Member Club Member

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    Not buying it either. They'll be improved, but I have never seen a team that bad. They went ****ing 1-17 in the Pac last year and couldn't even beat Utah. They could be VASTLY improved and only make it to 10th. 4th or 5th just isn't happening for them. O'Neill isn't a good head coach..

    Before Wazzu's current situation, I didn't see them making it above 7th. Now they're ****ed.
     
  22. jgisland

    jgisland Club Member Club Member

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    Agreed, while he isn't a great player he is certainly better than anything else they have and this will really hurt Motum's production.
     
  23. jgisland

    jgisland Club Member Club Member

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    This is college basketball, this isn't college football. It is very easy to be dramatically improved year over year. Bring in 1 or 2 new players and you can go from the cellar to competing for conference titles. USC had a lot of bad luck last year with injuries, bring those guys back and the incoming frosh and they "should" be a lot better.
     
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  24. BuffaloSoldier76

    BuffaloSoldier76 Unsound Meat Club Member

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    This man speaks much truth.
     
  25. sackman

    sackman Club Member Club Member

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    That all assumes that the rest of the conference either stayed the same or got worse. I don't believe that, either. Remember, last year was probably the worst year in the history of the conference in terms of Basketball. USC was the worst team in the conference during it's all time worst season. Pretty much every other team has to have improved since then (except for maybe UW, who seems snakebit right now), so just getting better doesn't say much to me.

    Put me in the "I'll believe it when I see it" camp.
     
  26. jgisland

    jgisland Club Member Club Member

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    I am not a believer that the Pac-12 is going to be better. CAL, UW, WSU and UTAH may not be worse than last year, but they certainly aren't better. Only Arizona and UCLA can you definitively say are going to be better, there may be better top end talent but the middle and bottom could be worse.
     
  27. CVilleBuff

    CVilleBuff Club Member Club Member

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    USC isn't going to be very good, even with improvement. I'm hardly claiming they're going 6-26 (1-17) again. I'm claiming they aren't going to be a good basketball team. Coaching matters in college basketball, even if it can't always be clear cut in statistical form. You can put them 4th. I'll put them 10th. We'll see who comes out closer in March. I expect maybe 15 wins for them total. Renaldo Woolridge simply isn't very good, and their "depth" is overblown

    I'm not even sure where I was so drastically wrong in my last remarks. I said they could be vastly improved. The point is they were so atrocious that vast improvement could still result in 10th.

    There's a parallel between college football and basketball, and that's knowing how to win. We were fortunate enough to figure it out relatively quickly as '09/'10 progressed after years in the doldrums. Other teams don't figure it out so quickly. When you're down 3 with a minute left after a 1-17 season, are you able to gut it out and pull out the W, or does uncertainly creep into your head? We'll see.
     
    Last edited: Sep 25, 2012
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  28. jgisland

    jgisland Club Member Club Member

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    USC could be atrocious, Jio could not be fully recovered, they could have injuries or they could just play terrible and revolt against O'neill. Lots could happen, notice I put "should" be better, in parenthesis, you never know what can happen.

    My point was, that it is very easy to make a dramatic turnaround in college basketball. Look at somebody like Missouri a few years ago, in 07/08 they went 16-16 and then graduated a bunch of guys. In 08/09 they brought in 5 frosh and 2 transfers and went 31-7, went to the elite 8 all with the same coach.
     
    Last edited: Sep 25, 2012
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  29. CVilleBuff

    CVilleBuff Club Member Club Member

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    You won't find an argument from me there. Much easier. All it takes is one or two guys (and it's much easier to have a major influence as freshmen) and you can fix a basketball team. We obviously witnessed that firsthand with Burks and Dre. Although coaching certainly helped our '10/'11 breakout as well. I think USC will be better. If they hit 15 wins, that would certainly be a significant improvement and should buy O'Neill a final decisive season. That said, it's a much longer road upwards for them than most.

    USC has so much potential, especially with the Galen Center these days.
     
  30. tante

    tante Club Member Club Member

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    a serious basketball discussion about another school in the middle of football season

    #basketballschool
     

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