Didn't love it, didn't hate it. I just find the rationalization for that hire in 2016 to be extremely flawed. It was a crap hire. Period.
@MtnBuff, why are you making up stats on his record against BCS teams? Above .500? Huh?
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What are the expectations going forward in football?
- Thread starter Duff Man
- Start date
Didn't love it, didn't hate it. I just find the rationalization for that hire in 2016 to be extremely flawed. It was a crap hire. Period.
@MtnBuff, why are you making up stats on his record against BCS teams? Above .500? Huh?
Hawkins record at Boise
He wasn't .500 against BCS but he beat Iowa State in the humanitarian bowl and Oregon State as well as having a solid record against ranked mid major teams.
Duff, you may have not liked the hire at the time but most fans did and many in the media considered it a solid hire. History proved it not to be but at the time it looked like a big time move.
He was considered by most to be a big-time hire.
He wasn't .500 against BCS but he beat Iowa State in the humanitarian bowl and Oregon State as well as having a solid record against ranked mid major teams.
Duff, you may have not liked the hire at the time but most fans did and many in the media considered it a solid hire. History proved it not to be but at the time it looked like a big time move.
He was considered by most to be a big-time hire.
He beat a BCS level team in a bowl, he beat ranked teams, the perception was that he was a giant killer. I'm not saying he was, the media did say he was.
You can get as revisionist as you want to but at the time of the hire he was considered by many/most as the top coaching candidate on the market short of hiring away another BCS level coach. We all wish now it hadn't happened but at the time most thought it was a quality hire. CU was definitely not "settling for what they could get."
You blatantly made something up, no need to run from it.
No where have argued CU settled or that it was not lauded at the time. But I take issue with the idea that a good AD would have hired him regardless. Why would I care if another school's AD had been dumb and made the mistake of hiring him?
No where have argued CU settled or that it was not lauded at the time. But I take issue with the idea that a good AD would have hired him regardless. Why would I care if another school's AD had been dumb and made the mistake of hiring him?
dyemeduke
Well-Known Member
Hawk seemed like a decent hire at the time to all of us not in the know. When he was hired, I recall being eerily worried that BSU fans weren't upset, and BSU was quick to keep Peterson.
I hated Bohn in many ways, and even if hindsight allows us on the outside to call the hire bad acumen, Bohn was paid to have the prescience to see Hawk was the wrong guy. How did our AD hire a head coach whose fan base didn't even like him? Bohn was a moron and Hawk was a bad hire...as was Embree...Bohn was a complete idiot...
I hated Bohn in many ways, and even if hindsight allows us on the outside to call the hire bad acumen, Bohn was paid to have the prescience to see Hawk was the wrong guy. How did our AD hire a head coach whose fan base didn't even like him? Bohn was a moron and Hawk was a bad hire...as was Embree...Bohn was a complete idiot...
win. win. win.
it fixes all this.
my expectation is to be an all-time top 20 football program. that means bowling every year. it means being in the top 25 every year. it means regularly competing for conference championships and occasionally winning national championships. it means winning big games and being on tv. it means having your fanbase expand beyond die-hard alums and locals. it means committing to be in the hunt. in 2002, we decided none of these things mattered. it was decided that we would rather avoid any hint of scandal or trouble. if winning meant a risk, we weren't up for any risk. and, we believed our wonderful setting and town could overcome other programs' commitments to win.
it doesn't take a ****ing rocket scientist to right the ship. it takes will. a collective will. donors, faculty, alums, students, community, press. george has done a lot to get us going but we are well behind. we don't need to sell our souls to be successful but we damned sure better figure out how to be in the bell curve of operational choices.
it fixes all this.
my expectation is to be an all-time top 20 football program. that means bowling every year. it means being in the top 25 every year. it means regularly competing for conference championships and occasionally winning national championships. it means winning big games and being on tv. it means having your fanbase expand beyond die-hard alums and locals. it means committing to be in the hunt. in 2002, we decided none of these things mattered. it was decided that we would rather avoid any hint of scandal or trouble. if winning meant a risk, we weren't up for any risk. and, we believed our wonderful setting and town could overcome other programs' commitments to win.
it doesn't take a ****ing rocket scientist to right the ship. it takes will. a collective will. donors, faculty, alums, students, community, press. george has done a lot to get us going but we are well behind. we don't need to sell our souls to be successful but we damned sure better figure out how to be in the bell curve of operational choices.
I know it is an unpopular opinion, but I think it was a bad hire. Don't you think most/all ADs would be pretty hesitant about hiring the guy if they talked to him for more than 10 minutes?
I don't recall Duff, were you one of the few who didn't like the hire when it happened? There were some but not many.
There is no question now that you are right about it being a bad hire and you are right about the hiring process being flawed as well.
I have no inside information about the process but remember at the time that our athletic department was in chaos. The school had just completely bumbled the "scandal" and winning at football was clearly not a priority. Bohn was brought in because he would be compliant and not stand up to the Chancellor, the President, or the Regents.
How much of the process they turned over to Neinas I don't know but it was to much of it. He justified his salary by bringing in a guy who they could sell as a big name hire, as Bohn put it "A home run hire."
Considering the situation Hawk was hired into I don't know how many coaches worth anything would have taken the job or how many would have done much better. That doesn't change what we now know that few also could have done much worse. We hired a guy who ended up way over his head, didn't have a clue how to fix things, and then we kept him well past when any reasonable program would have.
I totally get that and have read your comments on the hiring process before, that was obviously a terrible process (although is worked for RG thank god) I am just referring to the hiring of Hawkins which got a ton of great press and was widely viewed as a home run. Even you said you didn't love it or hate it and that is saying a lot.
I remember reading when Bohn hired hawkins that he already had "a slam dunk" hire in mind when he fired barnett. He gave a courtesy interview to Embree, but Hawkins was the only guy Bohn really looked at. That made the hawkins hire a stupid hire.
Bohn's biggest problem was he decided on a hire before even interviewing them. I liked Bohn, but think that was his biggest fault as an AD. He did it multiple times and bit him bad.
With the amount of redshirt seniors to juniors that we have on this squad, there will be NO EXCUSES for not going to a bowl game this coming season. I expect an improved squad given the efficiency for student athletes with the new Champions Center. All home games are winnable this season plus CSU and perhaps the road game in Tucson.
Why did we name the new facilities the CHAMPIONS CENTER? Because we should expect CU to win conference championships, go to the Rose Bowl, and compete for national championships. We might be in a more competitive conference than the Big 12, but regardless of conference affiliation, CU has won conference championships in football, and that should be the expectation for CU football because it has been that way ever since.
Why did we name the new facilities the CHAMPIONS CENTER? Because we should expect CU to win conference championships, go to the Rose Bowl, and compete for national championships. We might be in a more competitive conference than the Big 12, but regardless of conference affiliation, CU has won conference championships in football, and that should be the expectation for CU football because it has been that way ever since.
...but there will be plenty of reasons...
BlackNGold
Club Member
I knew very little about Hawkins at the time of his hire other than Boise had a pretty good record in the WAC. As soon as he was hired I did some checking around and the red flags that went up were - people around him considered him as someone who loved to hear himself talk and people at Boise were a little happy to see him go and some thought it was time for him to go. Not much concrete concerns. The first time I met him was a get together right before the 2006 recruiting luncheon in Denver. There were a group of people (5 or 6) standing around him and he was talking and kept referring to himself in third person "...Hawk does this..." & "...The Hawk is going to...". It was very strange and went on for 20+ minutes. I have always thought that people who referred to themselves a lot in third person tended to be narcissist. The other weird thing was that he never engaged anyone to find out who they were...this is a sharp contrast to someone like Gary Barnett who always try to shake hands in small gatherings, chat and try to get to know people.
At the luncheon they had brought in Coach McCartney to fire people up and he talked about why Hawkins would be successful - because he was humble and had determination and with those attributes you could accomplish great things. I kind of wondered if Coach Mac had meet the same guy, so I tracked him down after the luncheon and asked him if he really thought that Hawkins was humble. He smiled and offered some comment that basically derailed the subject but I often thought he was trying to send Hawkins some advice during his speech. I only bring this up because of Duff's 10 minute comment. I listened to the guy for only 20 minutes and I had concerns.
MtnBuff, Maybe media members thought he was a hot candidate but more informed people had other opinions. Mike Bohn had a very bad record of vetting candidates and hiring someone because the media liked them was typical for him
BnG,
As I stated before I was not referring to Hawk as a great candidate but at least in the media and with a lot of the general public he was considered the name for that year.
The results proved that Bohn should have taken a closer look and that in fact he wasn't the right guy. That is part of the ADs job and Bohn didn't do it.
My comments only dealt with general perception, not that he actually was the right guy, he wasn't. I am though also sure that based on the high profile the media gave him had we not hired him another major conference program would have, and he wouldn't have worked out there either. Maybe they would have been smarter and fired him earlier though and moved on.
Kuratz
Well-Known Member
For the love of all that is holy do not stumble out the gate against CSU this year. Unfortunately due to the brilliant foresight of Bohn in scheduling at Ann Arbor that first game is a must win in order to bowl.
I expect the team to be ready for the first game of every season. No more of this Hawaii-esque blunder bull****.
I expect the team to be ready for the first game of every season. No more of this Hawaii-esque blunder bull****.
Interesting to read a year later.
(at least the first few pages are interesting when people were actually sharing expectations - then it devolved into relitigating the past.)
But overall, I think this past season and now a top 30 recruiting class exceeded most of our short term expectations.
(at least the first few pages are interesting when people were actually sharing expectations - then it devolved into relitigating the past.)
But overall, I think this past season and now a top 30 recruiting class exceeded most of our short term expectations.
When do we start Spring Practices?
Yeah!
