First depth chart is out

[buffaholic]

Where do you get Hirschman graduating in May? He is not scheduled to Graduate in May, he is only a RS Soph and will be a RS Junior next year. Hirschman is one of the least likely to leave.

I will be surprised if Fishback is offered. People are upset with Embree bringing in Dorman (and to a lesser extent Shrock) - well Fishback has about the same pedigree, he wasn't even getting looks from FCS schools and now he is going to the be the Buffs savior???? They (coaches) are not that interested in him. The Buffs are players over the limit at the moment so they don't have room for another very pedestrian QB.

It has been suggested that Nick is close to graduation, much like Webb did in three years. Given he had a Harvard offer, it's believable that he came into CU with credits from AP courses, and he's spent 3 full summers at CU in addition to 6 semesters. Certainly, graduation is a possibility for him. I have no information either way.

He has two to play two, but if he were to transfer to a D1 program, he'd have to sit that first year. Graduation would allow him to transfer without sitting out.

 

[FlatironsBuff]

Webb shines in practice apparently. Had he been healthy, this might not even be a competition right now.

I hate to say it, but.....if Webb had a OC that can gameplan to his strengths, a OL that halfway knows what they are doing, a WR core that also halfway knows what to do, a running game that is halfway decent at running and blocking, and coaches that have a clue how to review film and exploit another teams defences........then he might not be too bad. Webb has not had that last year or with his situation in Kansas. Johnny football would have done better, but....we don't have much talent now. HCMM wants to win, and if he says Webb is the best choice, then Webb it is. Everything I see says we finally have real coaches, and a cohesive unit. I will cross my fingers and wait and watch.

 

[Buffnik]

What concerns me about Webb is what I saw last year. He did not consistently deliver the ball on time and on target. He also seemed to get rattled when defenses brought pressure. How much of that is due to him getting hurt against CSU and never really being right, I don't know.

 

[buffaholic]

My gut feel is that it's Connor Wood's job to lose. If he can perform at a high level, he can win this job as Dillon is still not ready.
If Connor Wood does not win the job, they bring in Fishback and have a 3-way battle in the fall between Dillon, Sefo and Fishback. We go young, and take some lumps.

 

[buffaholic]

What concerns me about Webb is what I saw last year. He did not consistently deliver the ball on time and on target. He also seemed to get rattled when defenses brought pressure. How much of that is due to him getting hurt against CSU and never really being right, I don't know.

I can write a lot of that off to bad scheme. However, I saw him throw screen passes that were awful. QBs are supposed to be able to handle the pressure on a called screen pass. You got to make the rushing linemen believe they are going to get you and dump it at the last second. Still, I don't write anyone off because the last offensive mastermind was just awful, as was the KU staff. And frankly, I saw him make some plays at KU that looked pretty good. It's always interesting to see what coaching can do. Ask DD Goodson how effectively his skillset was used (or viewed).

 

[MtnBuff]

What concerns me about Webb is what I saw last year. He did not consistently deliver the ball on time and on target. He also seemed to get rattled when defenses brought pressure. How much of that is due to him getting hurt against CSU and never really being right, I don't know.

I would be much more willing to give him the benefit of a doubt for both being gun shy due to injury and also for being confused or out of synch due to lousy coaching if he didn't have exactly the same history in his last couple years at Kansas as well.

 

[SCB]

I can write a lot of that off to bad scheme. However, I saw him throw screen passes that were awful. QBs are supposed to be able to handle the pressure on a called screen pass. You got to make the rushing linemen believe they are going to get you and dump it at the last second. Still, I don't write anyone off because the last offensive mastermind was just awful, as was the KU staff. And frankly, I saw him make some plays at KU that looked pretty good. It's always interesting to see what coaching can do. Ask DD Goodson how effectively his skillset was used (or viewed).

Whenever he was under center and got any pressure he threw horrible passes. From the gun he was able to avoid some pressure and seemed to be more accurate. But overall, if you got his feat moving at all it was generally and incomplete pass or worse. Given time he can make nice throws but he rarely had time.

 

[buffaholic]

I would be much more willing to give him the benefit of a doubt for both being gun shy due to injury and also for being confused or out of synch due to lousy coaching if he didn't have exactly the same history in his last couple years at Kansas as well.

I would be unwilling to give him the benefit of the doubt.......if he had exactly the same history in his last couple years at any CFB program other than Kansas.

But I don't feel strong conviction on that either!

 

[buffaholic]

whenever he was under center eb was resorting to the only playbook he had, the one he deftly lifted from the vikings. Meanwhile rip was in the booth

fify

 

[boydbuff]

My gut feel is that it's Connor Wood's job to lose. If he can perform at a high level, he can win this job as Dillon is still not ready.
If Connor Wood does not win the job, they bring in Fishback and have a 3-way battle in the fall between Dillon, Sefo and Fishback. We go young, and take some lumps.

I am starting to think the same thing based on Lindgren's comments yesterday. He wanted to start with Wood and he had good things to say about him. And Lindgren was quite transparent that Dillon is quite raw now. I think if the season were to start this Saturday no way is Dillon getting the start. But there is a lot of time and a lot of practices b/w now and CSU.

 

[White_Rabbit]

I absolutely do not think Webb is a BCS level QB, but he still might be our best option. I just hope when he proves to be terrible, these coaches pull him a little faster and get the backups some semi meaningful time.

 

[FtColBuff]

Where do you get Hirschman graduating in May? He is not scheduled to Graduate in May, he is only a RS Soph and will be a RS Junior next year. Hirschman is one of the least likely to leave.

Phil Fraser reported it in his article.

QB: Ugh, the QBs. If any group has had CU fans reaching for pearls to clutch, it's the QB position at CU for... for pretty much forever. We're left with a group of four, minus the 2 QBs we pretty much could have eliminated on our own before the spring- Stevie Joe Dorman and walk-on John Schrock. The remaining players, Jordan Webb, Connor Wood, Nick Hirschman, and Shane Dillon are all still in play and expected to receive equal reps. MacIntyre didn't name a starter last year until 5 days before the opener, and his comments appear to indicate that the same should not be unexpected this year as well. One thing to consider- Nick Hirschman is graduating in May, and could conceivably transfer to another D1 school and play immediately, in addition to the always available option of dropping down a level.

It was not made up. Hirschman is close to graduating which means that if he does not win the job here, he has options, much like Jordan Webb did when he graduated in 3 years from KU.

 

[lawdogg]

I hate to say it, but.....if Webb had a OC that can gameplan to his strengths, a OL that halfway knows what they are doing, a WR core that also halfway knows what to do, a running game that is halfway decent at running and blocking, and coaches that have a clue how to review film and exploit another teams defences........then he might not be too bad. Webb has not had that last year or with his situation in Kansas. Johnny football would have done better, but....we don't have much talent now. HCMM wants to win, and if he says Webb is the best choice, then Webb it is. Everything I see says we finally have real coaches, and a cohesive unit. I will cross my fingers and wait and watch.

Probably a lot of QBs that might not be too bad with all of those things.

 

[BuffClass90]

The Moten decision, along with moving DD, to me shows this staff is serious about getting faster.

Looks like they'll sacrifice some mistake making for guys playing fast. Good news to me since you can always teach technique.

 

[FlatironsBuff]

Probably a lot of QBs that might not be too bad with all of those things.

Exactly. And a lot of QBs would look like hammer dogpoo without ANY of those things. We don't have a great QB right now. But with some help from all the other areas that were complete failures, we MIGHT have a serviceable one. At that point, that would be a huge step up.

 

[AlferdJasper]

Where do you get Hirschman graduating in May? He is not scheduled to Graduate in May, he is only a RS Soph and will be a RS Junior next year. Hirschman is one of the least likely to leave.

Well, there's this from Nick himself.

Nick Hirschman ‏@NickHirschman 1 Apr
Officially walking in May. Undergrad went by fast. #graduation

See Nick Hirschman twitter account: Nick Hirschman @NickHirschman

 

[Duff Man]

Some of you guys are getting a little carried away with the DD Goodson hype.

 

[prf]

Where do you get Hirschman graduating in May? He is not scheduled to Graduate in May, he is only a RS Soph and will be a RS Junior next year. Hirschman is one of the least likely to leave.

Phil Fraser reported it in his article.

QB: Ugh, the QBs. If any group has had CU fans reaching for pearls to clutch, it's the QB position at CU for... for pretty much forever. We're left with a group of four, minus the 2 QBs we pretty much could have eliminated on our own before the spring- Stevie Joe Dorman and walk-on John Schrock. The remaining players, Jordan Webb, Connor Wood, Nick Hirschman, and Shane Dillon are all still in play and expected to receive equal reps. MacIntyre didn't name a starter last year until 5 days before the opener, and his comments appear to indicate that the same should not be unexpected this year as well. One thing to consider- Nick Hirschman is graduating in May, and could conceivably transfer to another D1 school and play immediately, in addition to the always available option of dropping down a level.

It was not made up. Hirschman is close to graduating which means that if he does not win the job here, he has options, much like Jordan Webb did when he graduated in 3 years from KU.

Hi guys, the aforementioned Phil here: I based that statement on a twitter sent out by Nick, when he said he was walking in May. Take it for whatever it's worth, but I updated the story to note that he did post it on April 1st. Whether or not it was an April Fool's gag, I do not know. Thanks for reading and pretending that I'm a Very Serious Journalist. ~phil

 

[absinthe]

Hi guys, the aforementioned Phil here: I based that statement on a twitter sent out by Nick, when he said he was walking in May. Take it for whatever it's worth, but I updated the story to note that he did post it on April 1st. Whether or not it was an April Fool's gag, I do not know. Thanks for reading and pretending that I'm a Very Serious Journalist. ~phil

welcome to the board.

 

[prf]

thank you kindly

 

[buff4bcs1985]

thank you kindly

yes, welcome to the board... glad to have you.

 

[AlferdJasper]

Hi guys, the aforementioned Phil here: I based that statement on a twitter sent out by Nick, when he said he was walking in May. Take it for whatever it's worth, but I updated the story to note that he did post it on April 1st. Whether or not it was an April Fool's gag, I do not know. Thanks for reading and pretending that I'm a Very Serious Journalist. ~phil

He's not joking. It doesn't mean he is leaving, it simply means he's got enough credits to graduate. So he is.
And now he has options, something most of the other QBs do not have without losing another year.

 

[1989Buff]

I am not sure how I feel. I guess I was hoping to feel better somehow...but I am not sure why. I mean, we kinda knew what we had personnel-wise.

The QB situation is frustrating. I mean, I went to CU in the late 1980s, and the best QBs we ever had over the years were guys like Kordell and Detmer (who were mediocre NFL players...although, I WILL say that Hagen was one of the better option QBs I ever saw. Frazier with the Bugs might have been THE best I ever saw...unfortunately for us...). It DOES make one wonder why in 100+ years of football we haven't had a few real awesome guys we could point to as all-pro NFL quality. But, hey, certain schools seem to specialize in certain positions. We do well with RBs and LBs traditionally. Decent O-Line guys too...so I am not complaining.
BUT
That brings me to my point (and one that others here have touched upon)...maybe we don't need a fantastic QB for us to do well. If we can get a solid cast around a serviceable QB perhaps we could expect a good coach to use the weapons we DO have to effectively get what we need out of the offense to win games. When you realize how mediocre (at best!) our QB situation has ALWAYS been at CU, one might say this is the only formula that has ever won us games.

That having been said...I wish Webb had a bigger arm. If he's the guy most like a field general for us, I would like him to be able to use this speed we keep trying to create in our WR corps to spread the field vertically. Unless I have really missed something (always possible) I haven't seen that from Webb's arm (yet). But, hey, a shotgun formation...quick release offense with easy-quick pre-snap reads might improve Webb's game quite a bit (and keep him from being hit so much and having such saucer-like eyes as he foresees the rush and the hits he's going to take before he takes them).

Maybe this turns into the equivalent of a B-Jax year for us (where we make the best of what is currently in the inherited cupboard while we wait for more talent to develop for the year after this one). Unless the Frosh coming in proves to be awesome...or we can work some JC magic (unlikely on both counts), this may be what this year holds for us. Let's be honest: that's a QB situation Buffs are very familiar with over the last century at the QB position. It could be worse. Let's hope coach Mac fixes what he can and puts whatever QB we field in the best position to succeed with the other weapons we can provide.

 

[BuffUp]

I am not sure how I feel. I guess I was hoping to feel better somehow...but I am not sure why. I mean, we kinda knew what we had personnel-wise.

The QB situation is frustrating. I mean, I went to CU in the late 1980s, and the best QBs we ever had over the years were guys like Kordell and Detmer (who were mediocre NFL players...although, I WILL say that Hagen was one of the better option QBs I ever saw. Frazier with the Bugs might have been THE best I ever saw...unfortunately for us...). It DOES make one wonder why in 100+ years of football we haven't had a few real awesome guys we could point to as all-pro NFL quality. But, hey, certain schools seem to specialize in certain positions. We do well with RBs and LBs traditionally. Decent O-Line guys too...so I am not complaining.
BUT
That brings me to my point (and one that others here have touched upon)...maybe we don't need a fantastic QB for us to do well. If we can get a solid cast around a serviceable QB perhaps we could expect a good coach to use the weapons we DO have to effectively get what we need out of the offense to win games. When you realize how mediocre (at best!) our QB situation has ALWAYS been at CU, one might say this is the only formula that has ever won us games.

That having been said...I wish Webb had a bigger arm. If he's the guy most like a field general for us, I would like him to be able to use this speed we keep trying to create in our WR corps to spread the field vertically. Unless I have really missed something (always possible) I haven't seen that from Webb's arm (yet). But, hey, a shotgun formation...quick release offense with easy-quick pre-snap reads might improve Webb's game quite a bit (and keep him from being hit so much and having such saucer-like eyes as he foresees the rush and the hits he's going to take before he takes them).

Maybe this turns into the equivalent of a B-Jax year for us (where we make the best of what is currently in the inherited cupboard while we wait for more talent to develop for the year after this one). Unless the Frosh coming in proves to be awesome...or we can work some JC magic (unlikely on both counts), this may be what this year holds for us. Let's be honest: that's a QB situation Buffs are very familiar with over the last century at the QB position. It could be worse. Let's hope coach Mac fixes what he can and puts whatever QB we field in the best position to succeed with the other weapons we can provide.

nice post man.

 

[WeCU13]

The late 80's, glory days with #8 Sal Aunese and #3 Darian Hagan at QB; they were team players; happy days!! Winners!!

 

[Buffenuf]

I am not sure how I feel. I guess I was hoping to feel better somehow...but I am not sure why. I mean, we kinda knew what we had personnel-wise.

The QB situation is frustrating. I mean, I went to CU in the late 1980s, and the best QBs we ever had over the years were guys like Kordell and Detmer (who were mediocre NFL players...although, I WILL say that Hagen was one of the better option QBs I ever saw. Frazier with the Bugs might have been THE best I ever saw...unfortunately for us...). It DOES make one wonder why in 100+ years of football we haven't had a few real awesome guys we could point to as all-pro NFL quality. But, hey, certain schools seem to specialize in certain positions. We do well with RBs and LBs traditionally. Decent O-Line guys too...so I am not complaining.
BUT
That brings me to my point (and one that others here have touched upon)...maybe we don't need a fantastic QB for us to do well. If we can get a solid cast around a serviceable QB perhaps we could expect a good coach to use the weapons we DO have to effectively get what we need out of the offense to win games. When you realize how mediocre (at best!) our QB situation has ALWAYS been at CU, one might say this is the only formula that has ever won us games.

That having been said...I wish Webb had a bigger arm. If he's the guy most like a field general for us, I would like him to be able to use this speed we keep trying to create in our WR corps to spread the field vertically. Unless I have really missed something (always possible) I haven't seen that from Webb's arm (yet). But, hey, a shotgun formation...quick release offense with easy-quick pre-snap reads might improve Webb's game quite a bit (and keep him from being hit so much and having such saucer-like eyes as he foresees the rush and the hits he's going to take before he takes them).

Maybe this turns into the equivalent of a B-Jax year for us (where we make the best of what is currently in the inherited cupboard while we wait for more talent to develop for the year after this one). Unless the Frosh coming in proves to be awesome...or we can work some JC magic (unlikely on both counts), this may be what this year holds for us. Let's be honest: that's a QB situation Buffs are very familiar with over the last century at the QB position. It could be worse. Let's hope coach Mac fixes what he can and puts whatever QB we field in the best position to succeed with the other weapons we can provide.

Couple things: Recall Frazier might have been a Buff, except Mac I recruited Detmer and changed his "O" accordingly; most big-time QBs came from warm weather states, Cali or the South (TX, AL, GA), or from places that have decades-long good HS FB (PA,OH)---Colo has neither; Webb's arm is plenty "big"---he can air it out pretty well, its what he does before he throws, that's been real shaky--I blame it on working under the two worst D1 HCs evah!--who took a pure spread guy and forced him to go under center. Anyway, there's at least 40 teams with winning records in D1 and only 5-7 QBs who get drafted every year, so you just need a good college QB, not an All-Pro, to win, as you note.

But, hey! Too many here want to render their garments or wear hairshirts over a bunch of 18-21 yr. olds. LOL!

 

[buffaholic]

Some of you guys are getting a little carried away with the DD Goodson hype.

I assume you are pointing to my post where I used him as an example for getting a "fresh look".

Let me be clear on this, as I posted in another thread, our WR corp is not uber-talented and after PRich, we don't have explosion. PRich has yet to prove he is an all-conference level player. Jeff Thomas has yet to show us he will be a solid WR, but we hold out hope. Spruce is good at what he does. But there are many on this board (and other boards) who are suddenly in a happy place about our WR corp and it all remains to be seen. Gerald Thomas was on the field last year because he was fast. He never ever had one big YAC play, and he never got open once outside the bubble screens. And he dropped a bunch of passes. So the fact that DD is now making waves means very, very little. Let's see what the depth chart looks like in late August and more importantly, late November. This continues to be (on paper) a horrible position group. It's not a strength at this point.

DD could have provided the 2012 Buffs with everything Gerald Thomas provided us, while allowing Gerald to redshirt. That's all.

 

[BuffClass90]

Some of you guys are getting a little carried away with the DD Goodson hype.

Not getting carried away. I just think moving DD to WR shows the staff is serious about speed. Let's see how he does this year.

The only player group I'm expecting anything from is the RBs...assuming the OL is decent.

 

[somebody]

Whenever he was under center and got any pressure he threw horrible passes. From the gun he was able to avoid some pressure and seemed to be more accurate. But overall, if you got his feat moving at all it was generally and incomplete pass or worse. Given time he can make nice throws but he rarely had time.

I agree - Webb's problem is no feats.

 

[BuffClass90]

Whenever he was under center and got any pressure he threw horrible passes. From the gun he was able to avoid some pressure and seemed to be more accurate. But overall, if you got his feat moving at all it was generally and incomplete pass or worse. Given time he can make nice throws but he rarely had time.

Misspelling an easy word like that is quite a feet. :lol: