1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Is Baer part of the problem?

Discussion in 'Colorado Football Message Board' started by boydbuff, Nov 10, 2013.

  1. boydbuff

    boydbuff Club Member Club Member

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2011
    Messages:
    3,471
    Likes Received:
    110
    We have another thread on what we need to recruit on the defensive side. Lots of people were not excited about Baer joining our staff as DC given his up and down track record in BCS programs including in the PAC.

    How much of our crappy D this year is due to Baer's schemes and approach and how much is due to our lack of talent?

    I am on the fence but judging how we played fairly well on D against inferior teams, especially the 2 CSUs, and even hung in there against fUCLA for a while, I am inclined to say it is mostly a talent gap problem that can be fixed over the coming years with recruiting (hopefully with some ready-made JUCO starters).

    But is Baer also to blame?
     
  2. krom

    krom Club Member Club Member

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2005
    Messages:
    405
    Likes Received:
    64
    While I don't think Baer is all that good of a DC he will get a pass due to the lack of p12 caliber athletes on this team, rightfully so I suppose. There is not much anyone could do with this squad. CU is dead in the water right now. Can't get better athletes without winning. Can't win without better athletes.
     
  3. sackman

    sackman Club Member Club Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2005
    Messages:
    48,443
    Likes Received:
    4,457
    Phil DiStefano is to blame.

    Get used to sucking hard. We are going to be a terrible team for the foreseeable future.
     
  4. Swish

    Swish Half a bubble off Club Member

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2006
    Messages:
    4,199
    Likes Received:
    550
    Hard to identify many spots that you could say are not part of the problem. I wouldn't be quick to isolate Baer as even a bigger part in the whole equation.
     
  5. GoBuffs08

    GoBuffs08 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2008
    Messages:
    4,804
    Likes Received:
    640
    undersized and slow is a bad combination
     
  6. Duff Man

    Duff Man Moderator Club Member Junta Member

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2006
    Messages:
    39,637
    Likes Received:
    4,624
    It can't suddenly be all about inferior talent. The coaching leaves something to be desired right now.
     
  7. GoonieBuff

    GoonieBuff Not really Club Member

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2011
    Messages:
    4,547
    Likes Received:
    322
    While I don't think Baer is to blame, I do question whether he's part of the solution. Have we seen defensive improvement overall? No (or at least it's negligible).

    I haven't seen enough defensive adjustments during games to say that I have any confidence in Baer. We hardly seem to adjust gap responsibility, and we don't seem to add new stunts or blitzes during games when we need to get to the QB. Heck, we made the Arizona quarterback look like a world class track athlete only by running between the tackles the entire game. How effective adjustments weren't made for this simple problem is beyond me.
     
  8. boydbuff

    boydbuff Club Member Club Member

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2011
    Messages:
    3,471
    Likes Received:
    110
    I agree that its both but i am polling our community to get a sense if most people feel its more coaching or more talent

    You may recall i have always said good coaches win the games they should and great coaches win the games we shouldnt

    My impression is hcmm may actually be a great coach but not convinced about the rest of the staff except maybe walters
     
  9. GoonieBuff

    GoonieBuff Not really Club Member

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2011
    Messages:
    4,547
    Likes Received:
    322
    :stupid:

    Although I wouldn't say "suddenly." Many here have bitched about inferior talent being the problem from the get go. Saying that, Duff Man's right about it not being all about inferior talent, as the coaching leaves a lot to be desired right now.
     
    Last edited: Nov 10, 2013
  10. Quattro

    Quattro Banned BANNED Club Member

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2010
    Messages:
    26,503
    Likes Received:
    761
    Very likely, but I don't think we will be able to make a decision on him defintively until next year at this point.
     
  11. GoBuffs08

    GoBuffs08 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2008
    Messages:
    4,804
    Likes Received:
    640
    suddenly implies that people thought that there was talent to begin with.

    My issue with the previous coaches was the constant look of not having a clue about what was happening and having no idea how to even try an get players into a position to succeed. I think everyone knew after last season that the D was going to be a huge issue and the hope was new coaches would be able to at least find some ways to improve.

    Watching the first half last night there were at least 8 plays where guys were in the correct spot to make a play for no yards and get off the field. Better athletes at CU make those plays. Instead better athletes on UW broke tackles for extra yards, or in most cases simply outran the defender.

    I look at CU right now and outside of PRich do we have anyone that would start for another team in the PAC?
     
    MtnBuff likes this.
  12. Quattro

    Quattro Banned BANNED Club Member

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2010
    Messages:
    26,503
    Likes Received:
    761
    Gillam, Hendo, CUD
     
  13. GoBuffs08

    GoBuffs08 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2008
    Messages:
    4,804
    Likes Received:
    640
    Gillam is having a monster season, but I think he is a red shirt anywhere else.
     
  14. Clean Undies

    Clean Undies Flagship of the 12-Pac Club Member

    Joined:
    Jun 3, 2007
    Messages:
    27,282
    Likes Received:
    5,918
    Yep. We reap what we have failed to sew.

    This is Hawkins year 5 and Embree coming home to roost.
     
  15. Scotch

    Scotch Registered User Club Member Junta Member

    Joined:
    Jul 9, 2005
    Messages:
    9,804
    Likes Received:
    430
    Agree on the bold. I was only able to watch the 1st half, but there didn't seem to be a lot of missed assignments. They just got beat by better athletes.
     
  16. boydbuff

    boydbuff Club Member Club Member

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2011
    Messages:
    3,471
    Likes Received:
    110
    I think Awuzie is going to be a good one-dude is athletic. Hope Wright and Crawley live up to their expectations eventually. And of course we have Rippy next year.
     
  17. BlackNGold

    BlackNGold Club Member Club Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2005
    Messages:
    4,489
    Likes Received:
    605
    If it was all about coaching last year then it has to be all about coaching this year. Talent is about the same, actually a little better.
     
  18. Buffnik

    Buffnik Real name isn't Nik Club Member Junta Member

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2009
    Messages:
    80,554
    Likes Received:
    16,186
    It wasn't "all" about coaching last year. When you aren't even able to compete, though, that's on the coaches. The defensive staff is on the **** list right now. When Washington had the ball, they could do whatever they wanted. Offense didn't score much, but at least I can find some positives there. Our OL coaching is on the **** list, however.
     
  19. MiamiBuffs

    MiamiBuffs Wᴉɐɯᴉ qnɟɟs Club Member

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2005
    Messages:
    36,118
    Likes Received:
    2,010
    The Koolaid. Someone has had some.
     
  20. fwbuff

    fwbuff Active Member

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2011
    Messages:
    164
    Likes Received:
    38

    It's been seven years. I'm already used to it.
     
  21. Duff Man

    Duff Man Moderator Club Member Junta Member

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2006
    Messages:
    39,637
    Likes Received:
    4,624
    You could at least understand the coaching deficiencies last season. Head coach more involved with the offense. Brown was still learning on the job as DC and the secondary was neglected some due to his DC responsibilities. Cabral was going through the motions.

    This year, we have a DC with extensive experience. We have a head coach who has DC and secondary experience. We have two secondary coaches and the head coach also giving that unit personalized attention. Shouldn't we be getting better?
     
  22. MtnBuff

    MtnBuff Not allowed in Barzil 2 Club Member

    Joined:
    Jan 11, 2008
    Messages:
    26,420
    Likes Received:
    2,332
    Agree, saw the same thing. Saw multiple plays where a guy was in the right spot an simply wasn't athletic enough to make the play. I also saw a lot of plays, as I have seen all season where all we needed was somebody to win a one on one battle and the play would be dead. Instead all of our guys lost their battles, the LOS moved negatively, and a good gain for the offense resulted.

    It may turn out that Baer isn't the right guy. At this point we don't know. We are starting guys on defense like Webb who have no business starting for a PAC12 team, we are starting other guys who may be legitimately talented but at other schools would have had a RS year and a year or two of being depth guys before seeing significant time like Solis.

    Our getting this bad didn't happen overnight. It started with Slick Rick not recruiting linemen, continued with Barnett giving up on recruiting after getting thrown under the bus, and continued under Hawk reaching it's bottom (we better hope) with Embree. We are no longer a name program. Kids don't get excited to have a Colorado offer (even kids from Colorado,) recruiting is going to be an uphill battle.

    I am dissapointed in the defense this year but that is because I drown myself in Kool-aid at the start of the year thinking that young guys would step up faster and that we could mask our weaknesses. We have gotten better. Teams have had to work to blow us out, we have beaten the teams that we should beat like the FCS teams but we are still bad.

    My vote if I had one is to let M2 run this thing until he shows that he can or can't do it. Saban wasn't available to take over our program and frankly I don't think he would have been able to make us a good team this year. I'm just as sick as anyone else of waiting but at this point we don't have a choice.
     
  23. Duff Man

    Duff Man Moderator Club Member Junta Member

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2006
    Messages:
    39,637
    Likes Received:
    4,624
    A good start would be to stop compounding mistakes. If we can agree players like Webb and Orms are just not cut out to play at this level, then we should probably be trying to find players on the recruiting trail that aren't exactly the same type of players.
     
  24. MtnBuff

    MtnBuff Not allowed in Barzil 2 Club Member

    Joined:
    Jan 11, 2008
    Messages:
    26,420
    Likes Received:
    2,332
    This X1000. I'd rather undersign in a class than tie up a scholly for four years on a kid who has little to no chance of being a contributor. The problem is finding guys who are worth bringing in that want to come.
     
  25. PAHIBuff

    PAHIBuff Club Member Club Member

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2005
    Messages:
    2,733
    Likes Received:
    352
    Ka-Frickin'-Ching.
     
  26. tante

    tante Club Member Club Member

    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2009
    Messages:
    25,787
    Likes Received:
    1,359
    When Orms got bowled over by their QB, it should be painfully obvious to everyone we need an upgrade of talent.

    Guys like Orms should be on special teams or spot duty.
     
  27. Mick Ronson

    Mick Ronson Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 29, 2005
    Messages:
    9,863
    Likes Received:
    269
    bad coaching is having NFL talent on the OL and finishing last in the conference 3 seasons in a row in total offense. been there, done that.

    we are a sieve on D, badly pushed around, undersized, and weak....but i think the coaching is better than it has been since Barney on both sides of the ball.
     
  28. lawdogg

    lawdogg Club Member Club Member

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2011
    Messages:
    4,089
    Likes Received:
    408
    Can't really argue with this, but it continues to be the chicken or the egg dilemma. We can't win the way we all want to win with guys of that caliber, but we should be able to be dramatically more competitive than we were last night. Being more competitive in games, and possibly winning one or two more games in a season seems like what would be necessary to land the guys out there who are in that next echelon above the Webbs and Orms of the world. So at some point, the Webbs and Orms' need to at least perform up to the level of their capabilities and a lot of that goes to the coaching.
     
  29. FlatironsBuff

    FlatironsBuff Club Member Club Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2005
    Messages:
    10,813
    Likes Received:
    1,281
    Last year starters were pulled by the second quarter except in games we were supposed to win....but didn't. This year starters are playing most, if not all of the games. If you are so stupid as to see only the score and say we are just as bad, well.....you can't fix stupid. With similar talent we are at least winning the games we should and putting up some fight and keeping the opposing teams starters in for most of the game. There is a difference. We will keep improving. I personally saw our players being in position, but just being fast enough. And the fact that we have to play true freshmen and they are the best players on the field for out team (outside of Hendon CUD and PRich) says that you can't be blaming Baer yet. This dearth of talent is still on Hawk and JE.
     
  30. Duff Man

    Duff Man Moderator Club Member Junta Member

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2006
    Messages:
    39,637
    Likes Received:
    4,624
    The defense has done nothing the last few weeks. Let's stop trying to sugarcoat it. Last night actually could have been worse if not for red zone penalties by UDub.
     

Share This Page