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CU WBB Rankings/NET/Bracketology Catch-All

Bone Buff said:
The latest espn bracketology is up. 3 of the 4 #1 seeds are Pac 12, which simultaneously insane, but also correct.

www.espn.com

Women's Bracketology: South Carolina, USC, UConn and Notre Dame start as 1-seeds

The 2025 bracket will look different with the Pac-12 mostly gone and the ACC (18 teams), Big Ten (18), Big 12 (18) and SEC (16) bigger than ever.
www.espn.com
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Larry Scott should be ejected from the US for what he did to the league. I still despise the PAC, but it takes mad skills to blow something up like he did, and the brilliant presidents that helped him should go with him
 
buffgal said:
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Uncle Ken said:
There is probably a safety concern about fans rushing the court.

But I don't see how you can say that Caitlin didn't initiate contact and then dramatically flop.

And the video feels completely misaligned with these remarks from Clark in this AP article:
Click to expand...

Saw the video in real time yesterday. She did not flop. She did not initiate contact with someone with a phone above her head. Neither person was looking where they were going. Ohio State player came over to see how she was and security tried to stop her.

It's ridiculous the abuse college kids have to take.

This is part of the reason college athletes commit suicide; Do you find that acceptable.

Hannah Stuelke's father is livid about what happened to her.

Clark was called all sorts of names by fans when she finally did get to the tunnel and she was called names when she came on and off the court earlier in the game.

Fan behavior has gotten so out of control.

Way back when, the fan I refused to sit with at CU games was told by the ticket manager whose name escapes me to stop screaming at the refs. Coach Barry asked me if I could get her to calm down. I told Coach Barry I have no control over her and that is why I didn't sit with her. Coach Barry knew we were friends but I refused to sit with her. She harassed the refs loudly from the second the game started.
 
buffgal said:
Saw the video in real time yesterday. She did not flop. She did not initiate contact with someone with a phone above her head. Neither person was looking where they were going. Ohio State player came over to see how she was and security tried to stop her.

It's ridiculous the abuse college kids have to take.

This is part of the reason college athletes commit suicide; Do you find that acceptable.

Hannah Stuelke's father is livid about what happened to her.

Clark was called all sorts of names by fans when she finally did get to the tunnel and she was called names when she came on and off the court earlier in the game.

Fan behavior has gotten so out of control.

Way back when, the fan I refused to sit with at CU games was told by the ticket manager whose name escapes me to stop screaming at the refs. Coach Barry asked me if I could get her to calm down. I told Coach Barry I have no control over her and that is why I didn't sit with her. Coach Barry knew we were friends but I refused to sit with her. She harassed the refs loudly from the second the game started.
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I'm sorry, are you insinuating that I support/contribute to player suicide because I think Clark flopped and played the victim?

You don't seem to be willing to have a rational conversation about this. Have a nice day, Buffgal.
 
buffgal said:
Saw the video in real time yesterday. She did not flop. She did not initiate contact with someone with a phone above her head. Neither person was looking where they were going. Ohio State player came over to see how she was and security tried to stop her.

It's ridiculous the abuse college kids have to take.

This is part of the reason college athletes commit suicide; Do you find that acceptable.

Hannah Stuelke's father is livid about what happened to her.

Clark was called all sorts of names by fans when she finally did get to the tunnel and she was called names when she came on and off the court earlier in the game.

Fan behavior has gotten so out of control.

Way back when, the fan I refused to sit with at CU games was told by the ticket manager whose name escapes me to stop screaming at the refs. Coach Barry asked me if I could get her to calm down. I told Coach Barry I have no control over her and that is why I didn't sit with her. Coach Barry knew we were friends but I refused to sit with her. She harassed the refs loudly from the second the game started.
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quick google search says the suicide rate of:
  • NCAA athletes is 0.93 per 100k
  • US college students is 9.55 per 100k
  • US citizens is 14.04 per 100k
I'm not sure that take is justified
 
hokiehead said:
quick google search says the suicide rate of:
  • NCAA athletes is 0.93 per 100k
  • US college students is 9.55 per 100k
  • US citizens is 14.04 per 100k
I'm not sure that take is justified
Click to expand...
The rare place where Hokie's mind overlaps with Uncle Ken's. I did the same search, but mine showed that college students are at a 7.5/100,000 rate, so a bit lower than student athletes.

Veterans are around 31/100,000.

I do agree with Buffgal that it would be nice if fans could be consistently respectful of student-athletes, and also agree that's not always the case. But Clark's incident in Columbus feels like a strange way to support that narrative.
 
Uncle Ken said:
The rare place where Hokie's mind overlaps with Uncle Ken's. I did the same search, but mine showed that college students are at a 7.5/100,000 rate, so a bit lower than student athletes.

Veterans are around 31/100,000.

I do agree with Buffgal that it would be nice if fans could be consistently respectful of student-athletes, and also agree that's not always the case. But Clark's incident in Columbus feels like a strange way to support that narrative.
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the rate for athletes is 0.93/100k. 7.5/100k is almost a full OOM higher, doesn't really matter if you use 7.5 or 9.5 per 100k for all college students
 
No high school or college athlete should have be abused by fans period. Refs are fair game.
 
buffgal said:
No high school or college athlete should have be abused by fans period. Refs are fair game.
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I'm not sure I agree with that any more. College athletes have recently moved far away from being treated as amateurs and kids. I don't think we should be expected to both nod along when they say "business decision/ respect my decision" and also pull punches on criticism that we wouldn't for a WNBA player. Other than a bit of leeway due to them being young adults rather than 10-year WNBA vets, I don't think we need to modify from adult/pro expectations and engagement. That said, abusive, threatening or dangerous fan behavior is never acceptable.
 
buffgal said:
No high school or college athlete should have be abused by fans period. Refs are fair game.
Click to expand...
Agree.

But when Clark clearly initiates contact with a fan who is not abusing her - but just celebrating an exciting win - and then falls down quite intentionally (to my viewing of the incident) and then plays the victim in a press conference in a really dramatic way, what are we supposed to do with that?

I understand the fan shouldn't have been on the court, and addressing that is one angle. But are we supposed to support Clark without pointing that maybe she dramatized a situation that didn't need to be?
 
Physical abuse is never acceptable.

Verbal taunts directed at specific players, especially from the student section, have long been considered 'fair game', as long as they don't cross into racist comments (or other forms of bigotry) or actual threats.
 
So Caitlin Clark is a polarizing as Prime? It's amazing to me how much hate she gets. At the same time she is an amazing and unique talent on the court.
 
buffgal said:
Saw the video in real time yesterday. She did not flop. She did not initiate contact with someone with a phone above her head. Neither person was looking where they were going. Ohio State player came over to see how she was and security tried to stop her.

It's ridiculous the abuse college kids have to take.

This is part of the reason college athletes commit suicide; Do you find that acceptable.

Hannah Stuelke's father is livid about what happened to her.

Clark was called all sorts of names by fans when she finally did get to the tunnel and she was called names when she came on and off the court earlier in the game.

Fan behavior has gotten so out of control.

Way back when, the fan I refused to sit with at CU games was told by the ticket manager whose name escapes me to stop screaming at the refs. Coach Barry asked me if I could get her to calm down. I told Coach Barry I have no control over her and that is why I didn't sit with her. Coach Barry knew we were friends but I refused to sit with her. She harassed the refs loudly from the second the game started.
Click to expand...

I agree athletes put up with stupid **** from fans they shouldn't have to deal with, but Clark is being a drama queen on this one. The NBA would be proud of that flop.
 
Uncle Ken said:
Agree.

But when Clark clearly initiates contact with a fan who is not abusing her - but just celebrating an exciting win - and then falls down quite intentionally (to my viewing of the incident) and then plays the victim in a press conference in a really dramatic way, what are we supposed to do with that?

I understand the fan shouldn't have been on the court, and addressing that is one angle. But are we supposed to support Clark without pointing that maybe she dramatized a situation that didn't need to be?
Click to expand...

I really don't see how Clark initiated contact. Seems to me like they were both running and didn't see each other till the last split moment. She clearly tries to stop at the end. The arms going out? I don't know, haven't we all been surprised and reacted?

Straight up, the fan shouldn't have been on the court. But also, since storming the court happens and is a part of basketball, Clark should have been more aware and probably not sprinting in that situation.

Anyway....the Buffs are going all the way! It's computers. And San Dimas High School football rules!!
 
Birch1 said:
I really don't see how Clark initiated contact. Seems to me like they were both running and didn't see each other till the last split moment. She clearly tries to stop at the end. The arms going out? I don't know, haven't we all been surprised and reacted?

Straight up, the fan shouldn't have been on the court. But also, since storming the court happens and is a part of basketball, Clark should have been more aware and probably not sprinting in that situation.

Anyway....the Buffs are going all the way! It's computers. And San Dimas High School football rules!!
Click to expand...
This is reasonable. The fan clearly didn't see Clark, but I don't see how Clark didn't see the fan. Clark clearly initiates contact and pushes the fan. That may have been necessary or an honest reaction - so up to that point we're good. But watching the video of the incident, I'm struggling to believe that the contact spun Clark around and knocked her down. She's an elite athlete, for God's sake. So let's say she flopped in the moment. I'm fine with that. It was a rough game, she was probably emotional and there's solace in being a victim. It is her remarks after the game that trouble me. I think she's earned some fair criticism there.
 
NW Buff said:
Who cares? Seriously, can we get back to talking about the ****ing amazing year the Buffs are having? Daughter got us tickets for Friday! Looking forward to seeing them in person
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New Girl Nick GIF
 
Clark played soccer also, likely forward, so probably well versed in selling contact through dramatic improvisation.
 
Buffnik said:
Last night caused our Buffs to jump from #35 to #26 on NET.

It's a Quad 2 win, because UW slipped from #74 to #81.

Wazzu moved to #45 (from #57) with the blowout of Utah, which dropped to #31 from #24.

Next 2 road games will definitely be Q1 games, regardless of the UW-Utah result. Root for UW since that probably gets them back to the top 75.

Of note, Buffs also moved up to #21 on KenPom.
Click to expand...
Wait. Wrong thread?
 
buffgal said:
Saw the video in real time yesterday. She did not flop. She did not initiate contact with someone with a phone above her head. Neither person was looking where they were going. Ohio State player came over to see how she was and security tried to stop her.

It's ridiculous the abuse college kids have to take.

This is part of the reason college athletes commit suicide; Do you find that acceptable.

Hannah Stuelke's father is livid about what happened to her.

Clark was called all sorts of names by fans when she finally did get to the tunnel and she was called names when she came on and off the court earlier in the game.

Fan behavior has gotten so out of control.

Way back when, the fan I refused to sit with at CU games was told by the ticket manager whose name escapes me to stop screaming at the refs. Coach Barry asked me if I could get her to calm down. I told Coach Barry I have no control over her and that is why I didn't sit with her. Coach Barry knew we were friends but I refused to sit with her. She harassed the refs loudly from the second the game started.
Click to expand...
To be fair, 90% of referees deserve it.
 
Buffnik said:
I'm not sure I agree with that any more. College athletes have recently moved far away from being treated as amateurs and kids. I don't think we should be expected to both nod along when they say "business decision/ respect my decision" and also pull punches on criticism that we wouldn't for a WNBA player. Other than a bit of leeway due to them being young adults rather than 10-year WNBA vets, I don't think we need to modify from adult/pro expectations and engagement. That said, abusive, threatening or dangerous fan behavior is never acceptable.
Click to expand...

I'm sorry, but I just can't see eye to eye on this when we are talking about women's basketball players.

Yes, the guardrails are off with respect to how/how much student athletes get paid and the freedom of movement that they have, but that doesn't mean that ALL of these kids are getting all of those benefits. In fact, it's probably a pretty small number by percentage of all athletes, and a VERY small percentage of WBB athletes.

The bottom line is that the majority of these athletes are still teenagers without fully formed brains. I don't think it's out of line to suggest that they shouldn't be subject to the same scrutiny as professional players, especially when the pros are uniformly getting benefits (to one degree or another).

Now- if you want to suggest that the people who are saying "business decision" should be held to that level of standard with respect to those decisions, then I find that hard to argue.
 
Denver_sc said:
I'm sorry, but I just can't see eye to eye on this when we are talking about women's basketball players.

Yes, the guardrails are off with respect to how/how much student athletes get paid and the freedom of movement that they have, but that doesn't mean that ALL of these kids are getting all of those benefits. In fact, it's probably a pretty small number by percentage of all athletes, and a VERY small percentage of WBB athletes.

The bottom line is that the majority of these athletes are still teenagers without fully formed brains. I don't think it's out of line to suggest that they shouldn't be subject to the same scrutiny as professional players, especially when the pros are uniformly getting benefits (to one degree or another).

Now- if you want to suggest that the people who are saying "business decision" should be held to that level of standard with respect to those decisions, then I find that hard to argue.
Click to expand...
Fair. Lot of gray areas to this, so probably can't come too strongly either way.
 
Buffnik said:
I'm not sure I agree with that any more. College athletes have recently moved far away from being treated as amateurs and kids. I don't think we should be expected to both nod along when they say "business decision/ respect my decision" and also pull punches on criticism that we wouldn't for a WNBA player. Other than a bit of leeway due to them being young adults rather than 10-year WNBA vets, I don't think we need to modify from adult/pro expectations and engagement. That said, abusive, threatening or dangerous fan behavior is never acceptable.
Click to expand...
Sports enliven the soul, they create an emotional stirring. The fact that athletes are more amateurs than kids now is a better designation than it used to be. These athletes have been dealing with crowd emotion since high school at least, perhaps earlier, so everyone knows the score. The court and field are really not places for the timid or uncontrolled. I'd say they're some of the few venues where you can truly work on your emotional control (be it player or fan). It sucks when the spectator takes it too far with threats and abuse, and social media makes it even more blatant, but it's going to happen. It's not easy, but if they can't handle it now, the few that go on to the NBA will get destroyed. There's a level of emotional intelligence education that should be happening behind the scenes with athletes, starting with high school at minimum.
 
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