Seriously, besides W/L record makes this a bottom rung job?
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Mike MacIntyre: Does He Make It Through 2016?
- Thread starter DiggerBuffs
- Start date
Deleted member 807
Guest
Conference:
P12 pays member school as much as B12 and less than B1G. But B12 must kiss ring of Texas. CU has inherent advantage with CA recruits but trails KU and ISU for TX due to scheduling and P12N DTV limits. Verdict - push.
Recruiting location:
Colo, Kan, Iowa, Purdue all small states and must recruit in talent rich OOS hot beds to move up. Verdict - push.
Facilities:
Iowa State and CU have new athletic centers and IPFs. CU sets benchmark for integrated design
Academics:
Purdue and CU can compete for engineer athletes, as if that matters on a football roster. All are AAU research universities, But none of these schools accommodate dumb athletes as well as the SEC or Baylor. Verdict - Push
State support:
ISU second fiddle to Iowa
CU and KU second fiddle to NFL
Purdue second fiddle to ND & NFL
Advantage: ISU by a nose. Purdue solid last place.
Campus: CU - it's a lifestyle location compared to W Layfayette, Lawrence or Ames. Better weather, too. CU appeals more to affluent recruits, but diversity issues may place CU at disadvantage vs Ames or KU.
Back-the-Buffs
Well-Known Member
First of all I think we are all rooting for MM to succeed and take this program back to where it belongs (competing for conference titles) but if he turns out not to be the guy some of you act as if it would be a start from scratch scenario if they fired him. In reality that wouldn't be the case at all. Maybe I put too much trust in Rick George but I doubt it. If Mike Bohn was still the AD I would agree and say yes here we go again however with Rick George he will make the right hire and I believe that 100%. It wouldn't be a hire to start over it would be one to take them to the next level.
And that guy would be Les Miles. Miles loves Boulder, truly loves it. His relationship with Mac1 goes back to the 70's at Michigan where Mac coached him. There is also a strong bond between RG and Miles as well. LSU has shown they don't really want him. They got pressured into keeping him and wouldn't mind at all if he walked. CU is in a position to succeed in a big way they just need the HC. Miles would see that instantly and with his ties to the university and his love for CU I think it's a likely scenario. Of course this is all pending on MM not being successful this season.
And that guy would be Les Miles. Miles loves Boulder, truly loves it. His relationship with Mac1 goes back to the 70's at Michigan where Mac coached him. There is also a strong bond between RG and Miles as well. LSU has shown they don't really want him. They got pressured into keeping him and wouldn't mind at all if he walked. CU is in a position to succeed in a big way they just need the HC. Miles would see that instantly and with his ties to the university and his love for CU I think it's a likely scenario. Of course this is all pending on MM not being successful this season.
Yeah, not even saying Montez needs to a full-time starter this season, but shouldn't we be able to turn to him for 2-3 games? Either the guy can play at this level or he cannot. Giving it until he a redshirt junior or senior to see if he has "it" does not really work with the current QB depth chart.
Who are the established HCs that you are referring to that it's hard to attract? If you're referring to HCs at other P5 programs that have been successful enough to warrant consideration for a "better job" then I suppose you're right.
Yes. Like the redneck who was at Cincinnati and committed to CU as a safety job, then bolted to Tennessee.
For one thing, the PC culture up there. If you don't think the college football coaching community took notice of the Barnett/Betsy cluster, you were not paying attention. There will ALWAYS be candidates for a CU HC job. They are FCS guys, non-P5 guys, and coordinators from C+ to B+ P5 programs.
That Barnett/Betsy scandal was over a decade ago so not sure why you think we're so much worse off now than we were then. If CSU can hire consecutive coordinators from big time SEC programs there's no reason we can't.
I really wish there would be a serious push by the university to increase diversity so that the student body better reflects the diversity of the state. According to Wikipedia, the state was 4% black and 20.7% Latino in 2010. The Boulder student body is only 2% black and 10% Latino. However, lack of diversity is not a problem unique to CU. You're going to find that at most schools and in most small college towns. I found this site called collegeportraits.org that allows you to compare schools. I'd call this a wash.
CU vs. KU
CU vs. ISU
CU vs. Purdue
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When comparing towns, here's how it looks.
So Boulder's is the whitest and the 0.9% black population is extremely low, but that is somewhat ameliorated by the fact that Denver is just a short drive down the turnpike. Boulder does have the highest Hispanic population of the three cities and the 4% black populations in Lawrence and West Lafayette aren't exactly sky high.
I think there are definitely some kids who are put off by the small black population but we aren't losing those kids to places like KU, ISU and Purdue. We're losing them to big city schools and schools in the south.
So Boulder's is the whitest and the 0.9% black population is extremely low, but that is somewhat ameliorated by the fact that Denver is just a short drive down the turnpike. Boulder does have the highest Hispanic population of the three cities and the 4% black populations in Lawrence and West Lafayette aren't exactly sky high.
I think there are definitely some kids who are put off by the small black population but we aren't losing those kids to places like KU, ISU and Purdue. We're losing them to big city schools and schools in the south.
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Coaches worry about winning, they know that winning keeps them head coaches and losing cost them jobs.
In that context a coach looking at this program after Hawkins saw a dumpster fire. A team with limited talent and some huge attitude problems. They could win but it was going to take time, work, and some lucky breaks. It was also a team completely lacking in support from the school as indicated by the state of the facilities and the willingness to hire a coach and to coordinators with a combined zero years experience to save money.
At the end of Embree it was a full fledged train wreck. This was a team that even with good coaching wasn't going to win, even with a good recruiting class wasn't going to win. And the facilities were still a strong negative as was the history of poor support. Few coaches were going to be willing to look at the job.
At the end of last year we are still a losing program. We are also a program that has gone from worst to close to first in facilities. The administration has been willing to pay for quality assistants like Leavitt and Chev. A good coach could look at film from last years games and look at multiple close losses, game that he could justify in his mind that better coaching would have won the game and it wouldn't have taken a lot more wins to be a bowl team.
Yes this is a better job by far than it has been for at least 10 years. And it is a much better job than schools like Kansas and Indiana and Purdue that haven't taken major steps to improve.
In that context a coach looking at this program after Hawkins saw a dumpster fire. A team with limited talent and some huge attitude problems. They could win but it was going to take time, work, and some lucky breaks. It was also a team completely lacking in support from the school as indicated by the state of the facilities and the willingness to hire a coach and to coordinators with a combined zero years experience to save money.
At the end of Embree it was a full fledged train wreck. This was a team that even with good coaching wasn't going to win, even with a good recruiting class wasn't going to win. And the facilities were still a strong negative as was the history of poor support. Few coaches were going to be willing to look at the job.
At the end of last year we are still a losing program. We are also a program that has gone from worst to close to first in facilities. The administration has been willing to pay for quality assistants like Leavitt and Chev. A good coach could look at film from last years games and look at multiple close losses, game that he could justify in his mind that better coaching would have won the game and it wouldn't have taken a lot more wins to be a bowl team.
Yes this is a better job by far than it has been for at least 10 years. And it is a much better job than schools like Kansas and Indiana and Purdue that haven't taken major steps to improve.
The Buff HC job is still an absolute career killer. If MM gets fired, he'll NEVER get another College P5 HC job again. He'll coach, but in other roles. The Buff staff jobs are a) a college career revival job for Leavitt, and b) step-up jobs for guys like Tumpkin and Chev. The rest of the staff are Spam, not the computer kind, but the salty canned "meat" kind.
Caveat: Things might improve this year, but I think that a bowl is still unlikely. I'd say 60/40 against a bowl.
Caveat: Things might improve this year, but I think that a bowl is still unlikely. I'd say 60/40 against a bowl.
We could have hired Jim McElwain, but he reportedly said some non-PC stuff in his interview. So that's one reason why we can't. I really like you guys here on this website, the least reason of which is that that you keep making my arguments for me.
No, your argument is ridiculous. We could have hired McElwain but Bohn didn't, that's an entirely fixable problem. If no coach worth a damn would want this job McElwain wouldn't have been interested in the first place.We could have hired Jim McElwain, but he reportedly said some non-PC stuff in his interview. So that's one reason why we can't. I really like you guys here on this website, the least reason of which is that that you keep making my arguments for me.
More than McElwain, Jim Mora Jr really wanted the CU job the year we hired Embree but CU was only talking to candidates with those all-important "Buff ties".
What is up with those heads up there? My God are the just stupid or what? I think it's more that they don't give a ****. I'm judging from afar. Actions speak though.
Plus Butch Jones being seriously interested and other coaches like Bronco Mendenhall and Gary Andersen kicking the tires as well. PAHI is mistakenly assuming there are a lot of "destination" jobs in college football. In reality, there are not many and CU has taken necessary steps (facility upgrades and pay increases) to be competitive with the large swath of schools not looked upon as destination type jobs. Bringing up Hoffman/Barnett is largely irrelevant.
This is the crap thinking that got CU in this mess in the first place. You are more than entitled to your opinion, but this is not true. There may be a handful of coaches who don't want to touch it, but plenty of very good coaches have and will want the job.We could have hired Jim McElwain, but he reportedly said some non-PC stuff in his interview. So that's one reason why we can't. I really like you guys here on this website, the least reason of which is that that you keep making my arguments for me.
Do you realize that was TWELVE YEARS AGO? How many coaches give swo s.hits about what happened twelve years ago at any school? Every single person involved in that side show is gone, and has been for a long time. Dick Bynny is the only one still employed by the school, and he's down in Denver at the Med school. Your argument that the Barnett/Betsy cluster is in any way impactful today is absurd.
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8Jah
Well-Known Member
Can someone local enough to follow closely tell me how well MM2 runs his 'player lead' summer workouts and fall camps? For the past few years it seemed like our teams were raw looking and undisciplined in the first games.
CSU is well coached. I hate myself for saying this, but I think there is a significant chance we lose to CSU. If we lose to CSU...
CSU is well coached. I hate myself for saying this, but I think there is a significant chance we lose to CSU. If we lose to CSU...
S&C Director mostly in charge & organizing over summer due to NCAA limits on coach contact. One of the reasons Forman is gone & Wilson is now in charge.
I think the biggest factor that will help attract a good coach whenever we need one is that Bohn is not in charge of the search. It seemed like he didn't have a very good reputation in the college coaching world, Feldman even called him a ****ty AD in one of his podcasts which is very blunt compared to his usual comments. Ultimately this will come down to RG selling this job to someone and I have a lot more confidence in his being able to close the deal with a Butch Jones type coach than Bohn.
Also, I don't really agree with the fact that if Mac gets fired from CU it will be a career killer for him. Some coaches don't work out at different places for many reasons and I think it's pretty clear he has learned a ton on the job here. I doubt he would roll to another job with assistant coaches like he did here and it seems like he is beginning to understand how crucial recruiting is at this level. Does he realize it is the biggest factor at a school like Colorado? Probably not but he is beginning to see the light IMO. Tons of college coaches fail and regroup. Just because Hawkins was a terrible coach and Embree didn't deserve to be a head coach in the first place doesn't mean Mac will end up the same.
Also, I don't really agree with the fact that if Mac gets fired from CU it will be a career killer for him. Some coaches don't work out at different places for many reasons and I think it's pretty clear he has learned a ton on the job here. I doubt he would roll to another job with assistant coaches like he did here and it seems like he is beginning to understand how crucial recruiting is at this level. Does he realize it is the biggest factor at a school like Colorado? Probably not but he is beginning to see the light IMO. Tons of college coaches fail and regroup. Just because Hawkins was a terrible coach and Embree didn't deserve to be a head coach in the first place doesn't mean Mac will end up the same.
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If fired, I think MM would end up as a Head Coach at a G5 program or a DC at a smaller P5 program, and given another HC job 3-4 years down the road.
WichitaBuff
Member
I just don't understand how CU will have a better year than last year? We had 4 wins last year with an easier schedule. Plus, nobody is talking about the big loss- We lost NELSON SPRUCE! How are we BETTER without him? How do we win 2 more games with him gone? He made a ton of plays and was the go to guy. We do not have a proven talent like him. I think it is a lot like Paul Richardson when he left. We were not better after he left. Spruce opened up a lot of space for guys last year and now he is gone and he was the safety receiver. We have no threats on offense and please do not sell me on the BS of "potential" of some guys.
We add a very highly raterd JUCO WR in Juwann Winfree. Another highly rated and highly recruited WR out of high school in Johnny Huntley. Highly rated and highly recruited all purpose back in Bisharat.
That doesn't even account for Udoffia Rakestraw Julmisse or Ento.
We will be fine at WR. Probably more over all talent than we have had in a long long time. There may not be a "superstar", but every wr spot on the field should be upgraded at least somewhat.