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Las Vegas Bowl is ending MWC partnership after 2019
- Thread starter Duff Man
- Start date
It's true Duff. Seen it many times.
I don't think he's criticizing the idea, just the retroactive part...
It happens, but sometimes the G5 team is actually the better team. Just using the "P5 team did not care" as a default excuse is lazy.
Ok .agree with that .But bowl games are often not very telling despite what Rammie fans believe. But plenty lower division teams can play.
ahoelsken
Well-Known Member
Yeah.....2003 Utah was definitely better than the 8 win Pitt team they hammered in the Fiesta Bowl that year. Boise from four years ago was better than Arizona. Do you really think the Utah team who beat Alabama in the Sugar Bowl would beat that Alabama team more than once if they played 10 times? Do you really think UCF beats Auburn (who handed the real national champion their only defeat of the year LY) more than once in 10?
Yes to both, especially on your second question. UCF was an exceptional team. Two evenly matched teams who probably split 5-5.
ahoelsken
Well-Known Member
UCF was a good team who didn't play anybody-they had one P5 opponent scheduled LY, and that was Georgia Tech (who wasn't very good)-lost that game because of the Hurricane. They got lucky catching Auburn at the right time. Auburn would hammer them otherwise.
Funny how those really good G5 teams just always catch the P5 teams at the EXACT right time. Pretty convenient for the P5 teams to have a built-in excuses for losses.
ahoelsken
Well-Known Member
Yeah that sure worked well for Western Michigan in 16 didn't it?
Right. They got beat by a better team in their bowl game. Just like the G5 is sometimes the better team. Thanks for agreeing with me.
ahoelsken
Well-Known Member
Central Florida was not better than Auburn. They played a team who wasn't motivated. Just like Utah in 2008. If that P5 is motivated, you get Georgia-Hawaii in the Sugar Bowl the year Hawaii went undefeated.
Right. Must be nice to be the P5 team. Even when you lose, you do not really lose, it was just a motivation issue.
Yeah. The biggest thing is probably the month without playing a game so you can get some things that are off like they are in season openers. But with some programs you definitely have an issue with the guys who have been more focused on lining up their trainer and agent while finishing out the fall semester than they are on whether their team wins its bowl game. They do like that swag and the activities around the bowl game, though.
I've followed VT closer than any other team but believe them representative of other P5 teams playing in non-playoff bowls. Frank Beamer was infamous for publicly stating that he didn't put the same emphasis on winning bowls and considered "the bowl invite to be the reward". I'm accustomed to reading how next years starters get most of the bowl-game practice reps vs the bowl-game starters getting those reps. I'm accustomed to seeing P5 teams put players on the field in bowl games that didn't even dress during the regular season. I'm accustomed to reading how coaches relax player rules during lead time up to bowl games, as well as travel rules at the bowl games: later curfews, less monitoring of diet, fewer weight checks, etc... I'm accustomed to reading how half the staff is working primarily on recruiting prep vs game prep.
I think there are valid reasons to support the conclusion that "a lot of P5 teams don't care much whether or not they win their bowl".
when Boise State beat Virginia Tech in game 1 of 2009, I think it was unquestionably because BSU came better prepared and played a better game against a Hokies that should've been equally motivated to win. The 4 - 5 bowl victories over Pac 12 teams or the Oklahoma bowl that really put Boise on the map? I'm not sure the P5 teams had anywhere near the motivation as the Broncos.
I think there are valid reasons to support the conclusion that "a lot of P5 teams don't care much whether or not they win their bowl".
when Boise State beat Virginia Tech in game 1 of 2009, I think it was unquestionably because BSU came better prepared and played a better game against a Hokies that should've been equally motivated to win. The 4 - 5 bowl victories over Pac 12 teams or the Oklahoma bowl that really put Boise on the map? I'm not sure the P5 teams had anywhere near the motivation as the Broncos.
The discussion started with Auburn losing to UCF. I can buy that UCF may have had more motivation going into the game, but once Auburn and UCF are tied at 20 going into the 4th quarter... I think it is pretty ridiculous to say that motivation was the main reason Auburn lost. The game was up for grabs and UCF won. It happens.
You could certainly argue that Oklahoma had less motivation than Boise to start, but once they came back from an 18 point deficit and actually took the lead in the 4th quarter... are we really going to say Oklahoma was not very motivated to win? It took a special play by Boise to tie the game and an extremely gutsy call in OT (after Adrian Peterson scored in one play) to win the game. There is no shame in just giving Boise credit without qualifying it.
That'd be nice; we're accustomed to losing national championship games because coaches don't relax the rules and they send key players home on a bus for violating them, unlike some coaches that hide key evidence from the police in their office safe until after the game is played...
all fair. and I know you follow Auburn closely, but wasn't there talk before the Peach bowl about Auburn not practicing as much as UCF? If lack of motivation led to lack of practice, I think its fair to conclude that it may have impacted Auburn's execution in the 4th quarter (i.e. players can be motivated as all hell in the heat of the moment, but if they're not prepared to execute, that's going to hurt them).
and I don't mean to take credit from either UCF or BSU -- what they've accomplished is very impressive. I just don't think bowl wins of those teams is a good indicator of their accomplishment; regular season P5 wins and conference championships are much more meaningful IMO.
The main issue for Auburn was as good as the team played down the stretch, the offense was mostly held together by chicken wire. Kerryon Johnson was a beast, but he was also pretty beat up. The depth on offense was actually pretty thin in many areas. This is the offense which struggled in the early season against Mercer. A very good team, but a smaller margin for error on offense than most on the outside realized.
I like that idea, too. Would the B12 do it, though? Give up a bowl game in their back yard for one outside their footprint?
There is one thing I know about the B12: they'll do anything if the price is right.
Texas having a chance to showcase their brand in Vegas? They would absolutely make that trade. Whorns will do anything to promote the "brand"
And if Texas likes it the B12 likes it. They like it even if they don't like it because Texas tells them to like it.
Sounds about right.
Okay so ultimately:
1. Rose Bowl: Pac-12 #1 vs. Big-10 #1
2. Las Vegas Bowl: Pac-12 #2 vs. Big-12 #2
3. Alamo Bowl: Pac-12 #3 vs. SEC #4/5
4. Holiday Bowl: Pac-12 #4 vs. Big-10 #4
5. San Francisco Bowl: Pac-12 #5 vs. Big-10 #7
6. Sun Bowl: Pac-12 #6 vs. ACC #5
7. Cactus Bowl: Pac-12#7 vs. Big-12 #6
It would be really nice to put the Pac-12 #5 against the Big-12 #6 in the cactus bowl so the Pac-12 #7 would play the Big-10 #7 in the San Fran bowl.
On another note, that ACC matchup in the Sun Bowl sucks. Move that to Coors field!