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Officially off the Macintyre bandwagon
- Thread starter Denver_sc
- Start date
Deleted member 807
Guest
Yeah, but a case could be made that CU attendance might be even worse if not for the Front Range population not growth.
MacIntyre isn't getting fired after this season. Hell, it will take a complete dumpster fire on the magnitude of 2-10 for him to get canned after next year.
But he doesn't have "it." I don't see us ever finishing better than 8-5 with MM. Last year was an aberration. Better hope he makes some recruiting changes so the cupboard isn't left bare for the next guy.
But he doesn't have "it." I don't see us ever finishing better than 8-5 with MM. Last year was an aberration. Better hope he makes some recruiting changes so the cupboard isn't left bare for the next guy.
badbone63
Active Member
Never on HCMM bandwagon, he does not have what it takes to be a winning coach. Last year was all on Leavitt who Rick George hired. In fact it was Leavitt's ability to ignore the interference of HCMM that helped raise the defense out of the toilet. HCMM thinks he is a coaching genius and avoids hiring any coach that may actually know anything.
Savage
First off, I am not saying MikMac should be fired.
What makes MikMac's resume so impressive? 8 years as a HC, and 2 winning seasons? Is it coaching under such luminaries as Parcells? Wasn't it Parcells who said you are what your record says you are? Well, MikMac is a HC with a 41.2% win percentage. Or since we are considering the P12, MikMac has a 27.2% win percentage in the P12.
I cannot say any of the few options I listed are guaranteed to do better, but they would have to be pretty damn bad to not at least equal somewhere between 2 to 3 conference wins a year on the average. Need I point out Embree won 20% of his P12 games? Generally, I believe you give a HC 5 years. I don't think it unfair to consider the jury in at this point, MikMac has not really set the bar very high. Why RG would be hinky about taking a chance on a HC change seems more and more remote. Even with a 5-7 finish, I think MikMac will get, and should get, another year.
MikMac is running out of runway here. Last year was spectacular, but if CU falls back to dead last in the P12S (which is where they are now 10 games into the season) and they turn in a 4-5 win season next year, I think RG has to look at his options. CU is back to where it was in 14 and 15, a bunch of close losses.
MikMac is a very good x and o guy, IMO. But his loyalty to the dead weight on his staff, and the overall failure to recruit and develop the OL and DL are huge problems. Unfortunately, it may be too late to correct them for MikMac.
NeverGiveIn
Confused by the facts
I agree we gotta stay behind him for at least another season, but at the same time pray we don’t give him a ridiculously long and expensive contract we’ll have to buy out to get him to leave if it comes to that, like we did Dan Hawkins.
That completely ignores what he took over.
We are way ahead of where we were, which is hard to do when kids are embarrassed to sign with you.
While much of the criticism is valid, we are arguably the same as Utah this year, and Whittingham is arguably the best coach in conference. Should they fire him for allowing us to catch him or he having a down year?
Last year's class and this year's look spectacular compared to the classes of our upperclassmen. That should bode for improvement.
That Pac-12 record is what I believe will ultimately cost HCMM his job at CU or allows him to keep his job. I'm still appreciative of the work he has done to get CU to be competitive in the Pac-12. Hawkins and Embree couldn't get our teams to be competitive in the Big 12 and Pac-12. But given the history of CU football, being competitive isn't good enough. Winning and going to bowl games should be the norm at CU.
Dan Hawkins had a 10-27 record in Big 12 play whereas the Big 12 had conference eight games at the time which is good for .27 which is just .002 less than what HCMM has managed so far at CU. At the same time, if the Buffs have another run in 2018 like in 2016, HCMM's conference record will be closer to .500. Let's say next season's results will determine how much longer he stays in Boulder. And let's not forget the next two games which is at home against USC and the finale at Utah.
I think if you fire Mac this would be the year to do it. If the AD projects another down year next year recruiting's going to take a hit especially at the positions we are already bad at, and then we'll be in for another bad cycle of football. What's weird is he's not bad at addressing coaching issues on the team, he's just so slow at it.
After Gary, I learned not to assume a coaching change means we get someone better. IMO, Ten wins is a significant enough achievement to allow Mac some leeway for another year and possibly two. If the next one to two years are mediocre then I'm fine with a change.
Whittingham and Mac are not even close to comparable
I hadn't heard that. Do you have a link?
Again, I am not calling for MikMac firing, settle down.
Whittingham is a crummy example for comparison. He has 57% winning record in the P12 and in his first five years won 44% of his P12 games, almost twice as many as MikMac in his first five years. He also took a share of the P12 S and saw three bowl games in his first five years in the P12. His track record indicates success, MikMac's well, not so much.
At some point the BS excuse of "look what he took over" wears out, especially when last year's success was built on the backs of a lot of those "horrible" players MikMac inherited. Five years in and mondo support ought to be netting a little more than what CU is getting. That is all I am saying. Well, that and MikMac has pretty much burned through the goodwill from last year by, most likely, heading for his fourth last place finish in five years in the P12S.
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Give me a break. Being way ahead of where we were when he took over is the lowest bar imaginable. We are at the end of year 5 - you can no longer blame Embree, Hawkins, or Bohn for the state of the program today.
Lefty is right, Mac should and will be back next year (unless he leaves on his own), but next year becomes a hot seat year IMO. 1 bowl game in 6 years is a fireable situation regardless what he took over.
vinniew_11
Well-Known Member
He just got the extension! Buyout is too big.
aghcsm
Well-Known Member
Yes and “bowl game” is a low bar - means winning half your games, 3 of which are often token tune-ups (or should be). We could go to a bowl game every year and never have a winning conference record. Which is why missing a bowl this year (if it happens) would be a particularly disappointing setback.
Dropping the first 2 years (2015 should have been much better) I’d give MM a 1-1 rating with 2017 not complete. If we finish poorly then 2018 needs to be a good enough year (win 5 of 9 conference games) or MM will be getting a lot of heat. Still I expect 2019 will be the key year for retaining his job, if 2018 is poor. A new head coach is a risk, the program can take 3 directions and 2 of them are not improvements. Losing P12 records in 2018 and 2019 would confirm to me that MM cannot successfully build and run a team in this conference.
pcbuff
Well-Known Member
I don’t think Mack should be let go.
The inability to convert the fourth down play allowed Them hope and momentum. The failure to adjust the D is coaching, and it was bad. I kept asking myself if it was Mack’s D or our D coordinator, either way, they were poor. CU needs some work. Recruiting was better last year and seems to have dropped off this year. We should have won, 30 points is enough to min 90% of games Sven of your receivers are dropping catchable touchdowns.
MacIntyre is not going to be fired, nor should he be, but there are some fundamental issues with program right now, especially in regards to recruiting. The 2018 class is a significant step back from the previous class, which should be the standard going forward. Comparing it to MacIntyre's first few classes is irrelevant.
Immaturity killed this season.
3 key guys kicked off the team from the defense.
2 captains suspended to start the season.
Some guys who obviously got cocky off last year instead of having a chip on their shoulders this season, which has shown up in sloppy play.
What's most frustrating to me is that the offense hasn't performed anywhere close to its capability.
3 key guys kicked off the team from the defense.
2 captains suspended to start the season.
Some guys who obviously got cocky off last year instead of having a chip on their shoulders this season, which has shown up in sloppy play.
What's most frustrating to me is that the offense hasn't performed anywhere close to its capability.
You're a lot more patient than I am. If we miss out on bowl games this year and next year then I don't see the justification in bringing him back in 2019. At that point I would absolutely roll the dice that someone else could do better than 1 bowl game in 6 years.
We still have a couple opportunities this year to make a bowl which would hopefully put this discussion to bed for a while.
LimaBuff37
New Member
Ruthless but the truth hurts MIKE MAC is a bum ... go back to San Jose State brother
I think the last 2 weeks have been what we should have reasonably expected from this offense. And it was enough to win against the middle of the Pac, even on the road.
Agreed.
I get that not all programs, and not all rebuilds are the same. People want to say MikMac is a great coach, and that if CU moves on, there is little likelihood CU can match or do better. I think given the record over five years, not just last year, that just isn't true. Stoops won a MNC in year 2. Butch Davis took FIU from 4-8 last year to bowl eligibility this tear. Stop and think about that, FIU is bowl eligible with a first year coach. Mendenhall took UVA from 2-10 last year to bowl eligibility this year. It can be done and it doesn't always take five or six years. If MikMac was an irreplaceable talent, you would think his track record would show it. It doesn't. That doesn't mean he is horrible, doesn't mean he should get the hook, it does mean his time to put up is short.
All kinds of reasons would cause an AD to vary from the general rule you give a guy five years. Embo got the hook after two because the team wasn't just losing, they were getting stomped, but still his conference win average was not far from MikMac's. I think the only reason MikMac is safe now is because of last year. If he had not caught lightning in a bottle last year and had gone 4-8, I think most here would be screaming for his head. If MikMac turns in a losing record this year and next, I think you can pretty much seal the deal 2016 was lightning in a bottle. 5-7 this year makes all the rise talk a joke.
On the other hand, upset SC and beat Utah, and I will shut up. I hope MikMac and the team shuts me up. Objectively, I think SC is a no-hoper, and Utah a toss up.
BlackNGold
Club Member
MacIntyre will be here until 2020 - CU is not picking up more than a $3 Million buyout. I do not know his contract but I hear it is pretty much $3 million per year which CU is on the hook for if they let him go without cause. I think Rich George has decisions to make regarding how involved he gets in the football program - I think he would just like to offer suggestions not ultimatums. The makeup of the staff is an issue to me and even last year when Leavitt left it took a long time to fill the position and we were not going after the top candidates which has been the blueprint for MacIntyre. Even if certain staff are fired are we going to hire anyone better. There seems to be little commitment to hiring top recruiters.
2018 has proven the old adage (slightly modified but the point is the same): You can only do so much with the X's and O's without the Jimmy's and Joe's.
TL;DR version - we absolutely must recruit better.
TL;DR version - we absolutely must recruit better.
30 points is not winning football for that game.
Especially with the mistakes factored in that took 11 points off the board.
Especially with the 2nd half drives looking like this (wearing our defense out):
Drive 1: 3 plays, 7 yards, 0:31 (punt)
Drive 2: 4 plays, 3 yards, 1:32 (FG)
Drive 3: 3 plays, 69 yards, 0:55 (TD)
Drive 4: 3 plays, -1 yard, 1:18 (punt)
Drive 5: 5 plays, 10 yards, 2:35 (punt)
Drive 6: 5 plays, 64 yards, 1:29 (FG)
Drive 7: 6 plays, 20 yards, 2:36 (punt)
Drive 8: 4 plays, 34 yards, 0:46 (INT)
I blame Lindgren for a lot of this. It's one thing to go fast when you're scoring. Going fast when you're not scoring is just setting up what happened: a 24 point 4th quarter by ASU against a gassed CU defense.
And, yes, I know the weaknesses of this defense and that they need to be better. But Lindgren also knows the weaknesses of this defense and has to call his game with that in mind. MacIntyre needs to step in and micromanage that kind of stuff, which he has done in the past. Why MM didn't tell Lindgren to slow things down, I have no idea.
His buyout, if fired this year a would be approximately $12.3M and goes down by about $3M per year. It's a lot of money for CU, but I also don't believe we could afford to keep a losing coach around until 2020 if that's what happens.
I blame the second half drives on Kaiser. When Lynott was in during the 1st half the line looked fine. Pressure was coming at will in the second half and you could tell how uncomfortable Montez was back there.